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Post by SilverbackRon on Jul 27, 2014 0:37:14 GMT
Ummm, Isn't Paz like right there on the last page, going on ahead or something? She's grown her hair very fast if that's her; not impossible but I'd like to see her face before making the assumption. They don't necessarily meet before boarding the ship, depending on what kind of arrangements they've made. Yep, I am assuming that isn't Paz. I know Kat and Annie have changed hairstyles a few times over the life of the comic, but Paz so far has kept a consistent (and adorable) cut. Monday's page cannot come fast enough. So many questions waiting to be answered! EDIT - awesome job by Kmar for that very cool graph! |
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Post by Brother_Spartacus on Jul 27, 2014 0:47:12 GMT
^To play devil's advocate, people sometimes choose to change their appearance shortly after starting a relationship.
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Post by wombat on Jul 27, 2014 1:18:37 GMT
Or she was too busy having kissy time with Kat to make time to get her hair cut.
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Post by Brother_Spartacus on Jul 27, 2014 1:21:08 GMT
^That would be too goddamn much kissing. They must have bloody lips if that's the case.  |
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Post by Daedalus on Jul 27, 2014 3:19:08 GMT
[Probably could take down Ysengrin with enough planning and etheric fire, but I don't think there's a force on the earth that can take down Coyote. Yet.Despite being the only one in the forest, there are other gods in the Gunnerverse. Even if it would be a deus ex machina to have them do anything at this point, Coyote probably isn't the strongest of them all. We also know from somewhere... that when he gives away an ability, he can no longer use it. Convincing him to give several gifts to people would make him easy to take down. Wasn't Ysengrim nearly defeated in Crash Course? tl;dr: I don't think that they are quite as powerful as you think they are. Actually, I did think about that when I was typing it, but I didn't bother to mention the other gods. Probably should have haha |
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Post by Brother_Spartacus on Jul 27, 2014 3:33:15 GMT
Modalf could SO beat coyote.
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Post by The Anarch on Jul 27, 2014 4:35:10 GMT
That's not Zimmy. Nor is that Jack. Nor is that Annie or Kat. Conclusion? Shapeshifting pod people from Planet X here to steal our cheerleaders and force them to work in the plutonium mines on Pluto while brain-sucking viruses living at the center of the Earth conspire to promote Communism among our youth!
Okay, Dr. Disaster.  |
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lit
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Post by lit on Jul 27, 2014 5:14:55 GMT
Just curious (I've given up on converting unbelievers) why would Annie recognize that one girl she saw once years ago? Well. She's probably noticed over the course of the year that Jack has gotten familiar with this girl, since she has a marked interest in him. He did at least once. And I was just wondering about this regression. Public gathering instead of private chat? Maybe he doesn't want to seem too familiar with a pretty girl in front of his new partner. But I suspect Annie has been avoiding Jack over the year similar to the way she tried to on this page, and perhaps that also made Jack feel less comfortable with addressing her familiarly. |
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Post by fuzzyone on Jul 27, 2014 5:32:23 GMT
Guys... I just realized something... Think back to the end of divine... what happened the last time we saw Zimmy and Gamma? ... They had absconded with Kat's Headband of +5 Straightness... AND TOSSED IT INTO WHATEVER ETHERIC SPACE THEY OCCUPIED. ZIMMY HAS BEEN AFFECTED BY THE HEADBAND! IT MADE HER GIRLIER AND MORE INTERESTED IN BOYS.
(IF it isn't obvious, I am not being serious.)
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Post by philman on Jul 27, 2014 6:21:45 GMT
Just curious (I've given up on converting unbelievers) why would Annie recognize that one girl she saw once years ago? Just because we last saw her 2 years ago doesn't mean Annie hasn't, they are in the same school year and possibly have a few classes together even if they don't know each other that well. Annie still has school and classes in between all the chapters we see, tom just doesn't show them all as they'd be boring! |
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Post by stef1987 on Jul 27, 2014 9:34:49 GMT
Jack was not a crush of Annie, seriously, I dunno what exactly Annie was up to in faraway morning, but she doesn't have a crush on him, plus they parted as friends sort off, and that was almost a year ago (in comic time; it was at the start of the year, now it's the end of the year) In "Annie in the Forest" which pre-dates "Faraway Morning" when asked about a "boy back home" out of all the boys she knows she mentions Jack. Her interactions with him in "Faraway Morning" could actually be read as her taking the advice she got in the forest about how to hit on a boy. (Make him think you don't like him so he'll chase you) This is further supported by her offering to give him a kiss (which he turns down) before he heads off for the night. www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=942 Annie is socially awkward, and I don't think she's inclined to be fully honest with herself or him, but there are definitely hints that she has feelings for Jack. read that page again: www.gunnerkrigg.com/extracomics/comic.php?c=Annie%20in%20the%20Forest%20Part%202&p=9that's not how she says it and you know it, that's just wishfull thinking she says Jack because it's the ONLY guy she nows that she could date, but it's clear that she has no feelings for him in that page. |
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Post by keef on Jul 27, 2014 10:10:26 GMT
Anyway, I made this cheap comparison in MS Paint to further disprove MAL's Zimmyness: And helped me decide- I think that if it's really Jack then it's really Zimmy. I don't think the spider residue in Jack's mind would have settled for a look-alike goth, no matter how hot. and this- to change my vote back from unsure to yes. I'm not worried Tom will come up with a perfectly good explanation. And I really will be LAUGHING ON LINE when we have a new 16 page thread on monday.. |
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Post by hifranc on Jul 27, 2014 10:23:20 GMT
[...] So here is my question: Why is Kat just content to grab her suitcase and go aboard with Annie? Shouldn't we be seeing Paz here somewhere? They are in the same class, where is she? I rather figured we should be seeing the girls as a trio on an outing like this (and Annie feeling like a 3rd wheel, or did she get past all that?) Given that it was Lindsay who saw them off, I get the impression that it was for the people in those residences. Doesn't Paz live at the lab? Oh, browsing throgh Faraway Morning again I realized: at the end of their little fight Jack started to call her Annie instead of Carver. But here he calls her Carver again. Is it normal in Britain to call people by their last names in public even if you are on a first-name basis? It used to be the case but that was already going out of fashion in the 60s. There are various reasons that it may happen. I always assumed that it was Jack being excessively formal to underline that he doesn't consider Annie a friend. After Faraway Morning, he may have it in his mind that it's now meant to be "ironic" but, given that he has a Zimmy lookalike on his arm, I doubt that. Then again, it's hard to work out what he's thinking. |
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Post by fish on Jul 27, 2014 10:57:36 GMT
In "Annie in the Forest" which pre-dates "Faraway Morning" when asked about a "boy back home" out of all the boys she knows she mentions Jack. Her interactions with him in "Faraway Morning" could actually be read as her taking the advice she got in the forest about how to hit on a boy. (Make him think you don't like him so he'll chase you) This is further supported by her offering to give him a kiss (which he turns down) before he heads off for the night. www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=942 Annie is socially awkward, and I don't think she's inclined to be fully honest with herself or him, but there are definitely hints that she has feelings for Jack. read that page again: www.gunnerkrigg.com/extracomics/comic.php?c=Annie%20in%20the%20Forest%20Part%202&p=9that's not how she says it and you know it, that's just wishfull thinking she says Jack because it's the ONLY guy she nows that she could date, but it's clear that she has no feelings for him in that page. I agree, it's clear that Annie had no romantic interest in Jack when she mentioned him in the forest. Nevertheless she went and tried out the love advice she was given. To me it's still unclear whether she juts wanted to get back at Jack for what he did in Spring Heeled like she told him, or whether she really wanted to try this romance thing out and had to cover it up with the Spring Heeled excuse because her attempt backfired. But either way, Jack showed her the cold shoulder instead and maybe, just maybe, the "love spell" worked the other way around and now she wants what she can't have? Well, I don't really believe so myself but it is a possibility. |
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Post by eyemyself on Jul 27, 2014 12:22:03 GMT
In "Annie in the Forest" which pre-dates "Faraway Morning" when asked about a "boy back home" out of all the boys she knows she mentions Jack. Her interactions with him in "Faraway Morning" could actually be read as her taking the advice she got in the forest about how to hit on a boy. (Make him think you don't like him so he'll chase you) This is further supported by her offering to give him a kiss (which he turns down) before he heads off for the night. www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=942 Annie is socially awkward, and I don't think she's inclined to be fully honest with herself or him, but there are definitely hints that she has feelings for Jack. read that page again: www.gunnerkrigg.com/extracomics/comic.php?c=Annie%20in%20the%20Forest%20Part%202&p=9that's not how she says it and you know it, that's just wishfull thinking she says Jack because it's the ONLY guy she nows that she could date, but it's clear that she has no feelings for him in that page. I read that page again just before I posted my last response to you. Look, you have your theory based on the evidence and I have mine. When I was a 14 year old girl experiencing my first crush my feelings and actions were pretty consistent with how Annie has acted around Jack the last few times she's seen him. I agree she hadn't really considered Jack (or anyone) a love interest before the forest, but when she was asked and she did a mental inventory I saw that as her realizing "oh hey, maybe." She could have said "I don't really like anyone" instead. The girl in the forest gives her advice along the lines of "play hard to get" and the very next time she sees him in "Faraway Morning" that is exactly what she does ... getting close to him only to playfully shoot him down and then quickly cover when his reaction is not what she was expecting. None-the-less she spends the entire night talking to him outside and on the stairs in what appears to be a deeply personal conversation while her best friend and everyone else are in the other room and at the end of that she offers him a kiss, which he turns down. Kat then asks her if she and Jack are dating which indicates that her best friend certainly considered it to be a possibility. Annie's no is very matter of fact and could be read in multiple ways. I could see the argument that she was just messing with him, but given evidence and my own life experiences my reading is that she did have hopes for something there and upon being shot down she now feels a bit awkward around him and has been actively avoiding him. |
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lit
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Post by lit on Jul 27, 2014 14:11:37 GMT
I agree, it's clear that Annie had no romantic interest in Jack when she mentioned him in the forest. Nevertheless she went and tried out the love advice she was given. To me it's still unclear whether she juts wanted to get back at Jack for what he did in Spring Heeled like she told him, or whether she really wanted to try this romance thing out and had to cover it up with the Spring Heeled excuse because her attempt backfired. But either way, Jack showed her the cold shoulder instead and maybe, just maybe, the "love spell" worked the other way around and now she wants what she can't have? Well, I don't really believe so myself but it is a possibility. I think this is likely. My theory is that her stake in Jack has also been inflated by seeing all of her friends (Jack himself included) start, or in some cases, already in, these very significant relationships with other people. She feels lonely and left out, and wants that sort of relationship with somebody, but every prospect has chosen someone else. She'd chosen Jack as her most likely prospect. Which is what makes seeing him with MAL hurt so much. Her feelings for Jack are less about who he is and more about what he could be for her. That doesn't make them any less painful. But like. I get the feeling they're not going to end up together. I agree she hadn't really considered Jack (or anyone) a love interest before the forest, but when she was asked and she did a mental inventory I saw that as her realizing "oh hey, maybe." She could have said "I don't really like anyone" instead. Maybe. But she wanted to play along. She wanted to fit in. She was afraid saying "I don't like anybody" would mark her as an outsider all over again. |
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freeman
Full Member
That 70's Coyote!
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Post by freeman on Jul 27, 2014 14:18:26 GMT
I have to say a thing about the first name/surname distinction.
At the military, I managed to acquire a certain buffoon reputation, and people mostly called me by my first name, my roommates exclusively so, yet several of them go quite offended when I made a conscious effort to learn and use their first names. It was most amusing, because I had no Idea it was a yet another pecking order marking thing there, as there weren't enough already.
In the civilian world such things just don't exist anymore. I do remember a fragment of some really old film where the new kid in a construction site had to buy the right to call the other workers by first name (and "thou") with cigarettes and other small favors but that's that, that had never been a part of my reality before.
I'm glad that that period of life is over, even if it was nice in a way to be instantly told I screw up, instead of getting sacked with vague excuses some time after.
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Post by fish on Jul 27, 2014 16:21:54 GMT
Growing up with mostly American/Britisch movies/books without actually living in one of those countries, you tent to jump to conclusions about the respective culture. Some of those may of course be misconceptions. One of the conclusions I drew was that it was common for students of British boarding schools to call each other by the last name if they were not close or even wanted to create more distance. The most prominent British-boarding-school-book/movie that comes to my mind is Harry Potter. There, Draco calls almost everybody by their last name and almost everybody calls him Malfoy in return. And a lot of other people adress Harry with "Potter". This fact just struck me as odd back when I was reading the story (I was 11 - 14), because nobody does this in Germany. I think it is not only unusual to adress somebody by just their last name, but is also considered rude. If you talk to somenone higher in the "social hierarchy", you do adress them by their last name but always with a Herr/Frau honorific (Mr/Mrs). If it's someone lower or on the same level as you, you just call them by their first name (or nickname, etc.). You only adress somebody by just their last name if you are really trying to look down on them. (This "rule" only applies if you adress the person directly, if you just talk about them, you can call them whatever you like). The thing is, concerning last names, I got the same impression in Gunnerkrigg Court as I got in Harry Potter. A lot of students call Annie "Carver", not just Jack. Zimmy calls her Carver but Zimmy wouldn't want to get close to anybody besides Gamma; John calls her Carver when he's still uncomfortable talking to her; even Parley calls her Carver before she learns about Jeanne and gets closer to Annie and Kat. Sooo, I guess my question is: did I draw the right conclusion? Is this common practice in Britain, in schools or otherwise? Some of you said it isn't, which just confused me... |
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Post by SilverbackRon on Jul 27, 2014 16:36:31 GMT
[...] So here is my question: Why is Kat just content to grab her suitcase and go aboard with Annie? Shouldn't we be seeing Paz here somewhere? They are in the same class, where is she? I rather figured we should be seeing the girls as a trio on an outing like this (and Annie feeling like a 3rd wheel, or did she get past all that?) Given that it was Lindsay who saw them off, I get the impression that it was for the people in those residences. Doesn't Paz live at the lab? No, Paz lives in the dorm like all the other girls. She works at the lab just like Kat works in the old warehouse. Neither one lives at their work, they go back to the dorms at the end of the day. |
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Post by Brother_Spartacus on Jul 27, 2014 16:37:44 GMT
^That was shown in Faraway Morning. They all live in the dorms.
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Post by chrisjenl on Jul 27, 2014 17:52:46 GMT
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Post by stef1987 on Jul 27, 2014 18:22:07 GMT
I agree, it's clear that Annie had no romantic interest in Jack when she mentioned him in the forest. Nevertheless she went and tried out the love advice she was given. To me it's still unclear whether she juts wanted to get back at Jack for what he did in Spring Heeled like she told him, or whether she really wanted to try this romance thing out and had to cover it up with the Spring Heeled excuse because her attempt backfired. But either way, Jack showed her the cold shoulder instead and maybe, just maybe, the "love spell" worked the other way around and now she wants what she can't have? Well, I don't really believe so myself but it is a possibility. I agree I read that page again just before I posted my last response to you. Look, you have your theory based on the evidence and I have mine. When I was a 14 year old girl experiencing my first crush my feelings and actions were pretty consistent with how Annie has acted around Jack the last few times she's seen him. I agree she hadn't really considered Jack (or anyone) a love interest before the forest, but when she was asked and she did a mental inventory I saw that as her realizing "oh hey, maybe." She could have said "I don't really like anyone" instead. The girl in the forest gives her advice along the lines of "play hard to get" and the very next time she sees him in "Faraway Morning" that is exactly what she does ... getting close to him only to playfully shoot him down and then quickly cover when his reaction is not what she was expecting. None-the-less she spends the entire night talking to him outside and on the stairs in what appears to be a deeply personal conversation while her best friend and everyone else are in the other room and at the end of that she offers him a kiss, which he turns down. Kat then asks her if she and Jack are dating which indicates that her best friend certainly considered it to be a possibility. Annie's no is very matter of fact and could be read in multiple ways. I could see the argument that she was just messing with him, but given evidence and my own life experiences my reading is that she did have hopes for something there and upon being shot down she now feels a bit awkward around him and has been actively avoiding him. fair enough I doubt Zimmy would care (much), she never really cared about what people thought of her. also, about the name thing, here in Belgium, we tend to call each other by first name most often, but some people sometimes by last, but it's not based on familiarity or anything, just when someone has a fun last name, or one that rolls better off the tongue (that's an expression, right?), we just use that instead of their first name. And some people just always use other people's last name, regardless of whether it's friends or strangers. (at least that's how it is for me) |
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Post by hifranc on Jul 27, 2014 18:31:41 GMT
Thank you, SilverbackRon. I forgot those details. Personally, I think that Per is on to something when she said that it was CJG. Looking at Page 404 and the next page, and comparing that to MAL, is convincing. She looks the same, the dress sense is similar and so is the body language. Most girls would object to be used to mess with someone but, given how Reynard treated them, I don't think that CJG would mind. |
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lit
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Post by lit on Jul 27, 2014 18:52:09 GMT
I think MAL is probably just some girl we haven't met in Jack's year in Questlett South. Have we met anybody in QS apart from Jack? And yet they must exist. Jack wouldn't be in a class all on his own. What's he doing hanging out with the QN kids so much?
EDIT: Maybe MAL is one of those extras in Residential. There are a lot to choose from.
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Post by zimmyzims on Jul 27, 2014 19:00:50 GMT
Have to agree with GK Sierra about Jack... It's hard to look at him without laughing I love it when young people try to find ways to express themselves, and yes sometimes the results are terrible, and no, they are almost never original, but somehow it pisses me off when adults feel a need to ridicule kids because of their appearance. Puberty sucks hard enough without that. Have to agree with GK Sierra about Jack... It's hard to look at him without laughing, and I understand that those with strong emotions about this character cry inside, and cry all the more the more they feel urge to laugh at this dude. Fortunately, I've never been fond of him. Hey, he's 15-ish, unspotted, and with someone. He's living the dream. Okay, dudes. My apologies to Jack. Tomorrow we may or may not get to know whether that's Zimmy or just someone who reminds Jack enough of Zimmy. I, honestly, am completely unsure about this. I voted "yes", but it was before I had read the page and I initially thought that the question translates to "is the Court's cruise ship Zimmy" and thought it hilarious to say "yes" to that.  So, when I first read the page, I already was given the idea that there's Zimmy. Without that idea, I'm not sure if it would have occurred to me that it is Zimmy. But I think it may well be. |
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Post by Elysium on Jul 27, 2014 19:20:05 GMT
Wouldn't be surprised if tomorrow's page gave even more mixed signals.
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Post by asyetunnamed on Jul 27, 2014 19:24:41 GMT
I am probably wrong, but I view calling someone by their surname as either a power play (in the case of Malfoy stated above; he believed that he was superior to the people that he was using it to) or as a small dig at the person (them being an outsider). I don't think that there's any "tu" or "vous" style correctness going on when people use it. I know that it was a derogatory term for the people who used it in my old (state) school.
(For people who know less French than my pithy amount, using the more informal "tu" rather than "vous" to talk to a person is a given privilege - I believe that technically you have to ask someone whether you can actually do it.)
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Post by Per on Jul 27, 2014 19:28:34 GMT
Thank you, SilverbackRon. I forgot those details. Personally, I think that Per is on to something when she said that it was CJG. Looking at Page 404 and the next page, and comparing that to MAL, is convincing. She looks the same, the dress sense is similar and so is the body language. Most girls would object to be used to mess with someone but, given how Reynard treated them, I don't think that CJG would mind. A few points: 1. Male pronouns for me, please. 2. I'm not convinced MAL is CJG, but it's a possibility if Tom's comment is taken to mean we have seen her before (I'm not convinced of that either). I am convinced MAL is not Zimmy. 3. I'm not sure how being chased by a lockpick wolf is indicative of or leads to low self esteem. Never happened to me though. |
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Post by fwip on Jul 27, 2014 19:30:11 GMT
For those of you who don't know, you can change your vote. Click on the box checked already, then click a different box to re-vote. (I already changed my vote from yes to no.)
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Post by KMar on Jul 27, 2014 19:54:40 GMT
Growing up with mostly American/Britisch movies/books without actually living in one of those countries, you tent to jump to conclusions about the respective culture. Some of those may of course be misconceptions. One of the conclusions I drew was that it was common for students of British boarding schools to call each other by the last name if they were not close or even wanted to create more distance. The most prominent British-boarding-school-book/movie that comes to my mind is Harry Potter. There, Draco calls almost everybody by their last name and almost everybody calls him Malfoy in return. And a lot of other people adress Harry with "Potter". This fact just struck me as odd back when I was reading the story (I was 11 - 14), because nobody does this in Germany. I think it is not only unusual to adress somebody by just their last name, but is also considered rude. If you talk to somenone higher in the "social hierarchy", you do adress them by their last name but always with a Herr/Frau honorific (Mr/Mrs). If it's someone lower or on the same level as you, you just call them by their first name (or nickname, etc.). You only adress somebody by just their last name if you are really trying to look down on them. (This "rule" only applies if you adress the person directly, if you just talk about them, you can call them whatever you like). The thing is, concerning last names, I got the same impression in Gunnerkrigg Court as I got in Harry Potter. A lot of students call Annie "Carver", not just Jack. Zimmy calls her Carver but Zimmy wouldn't want to get close to anybody besides Gamma; John calls her Carver when he's still uncomfortable talking to her; even Parley calls her Carver before she learns about Jeanne and gets closer to Annie and Kat. Sooo, I guess my question is: did I draw the right conclusion? Is this common practice in Britain, in schools or otherwise? Some of you said it isn't, which just confused me... Caveat: I'm no Brit either, but this is the impression I've got from reading fiction (Wodehouse, maybe Dickens even): I think the practise you're referring to (addressing fellow students by surname) at least used to be commonplace in boarding schools and Oxbridge universities in 19th and early 20th century, but I guess trends like that used to come and go. And if it used to be practise then, it isn't necessarily nowadays (or who knows, maybe it still is in schools like Eton, if not where the 'normal' people go), which would explain the conflicting accounts that caused you confusion. At least, if memory serves, the (young adult male) characters (of the social status Wodehouse tends to depict in his comedies) address each other by the last name often enough, if not by some 'funny' nicknames usually based on their last names (which was a real practise I think, I remember reading that friends of J.R.R. Tolkien called him 'Tollers')? Edit. However, on a second thought, the humorous novels by P.G. Wodehouse might not be the most reliable source on social life of upper class Britons.George Orwell, C. S. Lewis and Roald Dahl all wrote autobiographical takes on their experiences in British public schools (it wasn't necessarily very joyous experience in real life), and while I remember reading those accounts, I can't really recall anything about how people addressed each other. Anyway, it seems that modern authors like Rowling and Siddell think it was how students talked in boarding schools, and to evoke the impression of "old posh boarding school big on tradition" they go on with it. Or maybe it's just because we, the audience, expect that people in British boarding schools talk like that? I guess it might be a trope. I wonder if a certain community dedicated on cataloguing them might be of assistance (I'm almost serious). |
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