Magic in Gunner's Crag

[neal]

Ok, so the place is obviously magical, or at least paranormal. But the only person who has shown signs of actual controlled 'magic' as thought of in our D&D world is Anja. She cast a binding spell on Reynardine. But what about Kat? Her anti-grav machine has a strange purple glow to it, very similar to the glow magical items in the comic, like the binding spell and the blinker stone. Perhaps Kat's talent with mechanics is her way of expressing her magic.

And since all the girls we know from here have paranormal abilities, shouldn't we assume the other kids have them too? I'm curious to see how the other talents unfold.

[todd]

Well, so far we haven't seen any signs of the paranormal from Janet, Willie, Paz, or Sullivan's John. (Though I'm just a wee bit suspicious about Janet, in light of the scene where she's letting Mort have it. Not too many kids go shouting at people who interrupt their flute playing in such an archaic style of language.)

[Aspen d'Grey]

I think it's more of a steampunk kind of thing- a mix of magic, technology, and old-world manners. I wouldn't think that Kat was all that 'magical', and that the glow from her anti-grav is simply the technology. Then again, I like your theory about her expressing magic via technology. I think that it's already been proposed that most of the characters are, at the least, a bit 'off'. (From that About the Court thread)

Mr Eglamore can either wield a magical sword (Shown at the end of Chapter 7) and can probably control magic in other ways.

I don't really get the feeling that this is a 'Hogwarts' type school- at the very least it would be Rowling + Verne, but I think we just happen to focus on the weird things going on because that's what's interesting.

[mrw]

Dakini mentioned the alchemical symbolism which is pervasive throughout Gunnerkrigg Court. Here's some links you all may find quite interesting...

Antimony: chemistry.allinfoabout.com/alchemy/antimony.html
(Note the mention of the wolf as well!)

Lead: chemistry.allinfoabout.com/alchemy/lead.html
(Doesn't one of these symbols look familiar? )

Mercury: chemistry.allinfoabout.com/alchemy/mercury.html
(Another familiar symbol in the lineup... )

[Aspen d'Grey]

This was also mentioned by Kat back in [37] when she sees Antimony's pendant. Thanks for looking that up and posting it, though. I was pretty sure the symbols weren't random but hand't had a chance to actually look them up.

(More later, sorry)

[iMacThere4iAm]

mrw, you've made me notice a couple of things I'd missed before about those symbols. In case anyone else missed it, as well as Antimony's namesake symbol, Mr. Eglamore has a symbol for lead on his dragonslayer gear, [52] and Reynardine seems to be associated with Mercury [53]. It's interesting to see what qualities these symbols were associated with.

[todd]

We know that Mort's got some obvious magic of his own, since he can shape-shift (and is presumably solid when he does so, since Janet can thump him several times in the epilogue to Chapter Four, and Annie tap him on the shoulder in his "demon-form" in Chapter Nine). He can also make doors disappear, though I don't know if that means actually transforming the door into a wall or just projecting the image of a blank wall over the door, and conjure up flowers - or the image of a group of eyeless circus statues to scare Paz.

[Aspen d'Grey]

Well, Mort's a ghost. Magic is implied there. Also, remember that Mort is pretty young, according to Muut. (Funny, -all- of our main characters are young...)

Maybe Gunnerkrigg is a school for more than just humans? This was definetly hinted at by our friends the suicide fairies, but at the tiem I thought (liek Annie) that they turned INTO humans.

[freemage]

I have to wonder if our esteemed author is familiar with the old White Wolf RPG Mage: the Ascension. It had a 'unified' system of magic that accounted for everything from shamanism to psychic phenomenon to wierd science.

Of course, a few other game-systems have managed that as well, but rarely so well unified.

Or, it's just possible that he's simply decided that this is a school for paranatural students of all sorts.

[my2k]

aspengrey said:

Well, Mort's a ghost. Magic is implied there. Also, remember that Mort is pretty young, according to Muut. (Funny, -all- of our main characters are young...)

Not to mention, according to Muut, he hasn't been dead very long either. But that could mean anything in the spirit world.

then again there's the common 5th dimension "every possibility universe" theory. But that's too generic.

[La Poire]

As much as I love magic and weird science and all that, I think a lot of the time it is better left unexplained, to let the reader fill out the blanks. It often irks me when magic is explained in such detail that it seems like just another scientific process. Magic is supposed to be magical, and Tom does that really well, I think; he doesn't give it extra attention, but still doesn't make it mundane in any way. Hope that makes sense.

One storyteller Tom really reminds me of, although I've actually not considered it until now, is Hayao Miyazaki – which is in every way meant as a compliment. Now that I think about it, I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone draw parallels between Gunnerkrigg and Spirited Away, but maybe I just haven't looked close enough.

Reading through, I'm not sure if all this is really on topic, but what the hell. Close enough.

[Aspen d'Grey]

my2k said:

aspengrey said:

Well, Mort's a ghost. Magic is implied there. Also, remember that Mort is pretty young, according to Muut. (Funny, -all- of our main characters are young...)

Not to mention, according to Muut, he hasn't been dead very long either.

Ah, my implication by 'young; was that he wasn't dead long, as opposed to dying young. But, it could be either way I suppose.

[todd]

Mort's youthfulness comes across all the more in: a) his general inexperience as a ghost (Annie has to point out to him that he's relying too much on the old cliches of sheets with holes in them and "Boooo" and b) his shy crush on Annie.

[alexthegreater]

aspengrey said:

I don't really get the feeling that this is a 'Hogwarts' type school- at the very least it would be Rowling + Verne, but I think we just happen to focus on the weird things going on because that's what's interesting.

Well I have always described this as Harry Potter meets the X files. Its not a school for magic as much as a school for kids with unusual talents.

Also magic is just science that has yet to be explained.

[rastarogue]

I feel as if there are a couple of different classes of magic users at the the Court.
mage-controlled, restricted, with rules - Anja's binding on Rey
Sorcerer-closer to the elements and much more free than mage magic - Eglamore
Druid-I dont think I have to explain this one - Muut
Psychic-Mental powers, controlled by will - Zimmy
(forgive the dnd classes)

Forgot to mention the techies, no class for them just good at technology.


Magic is not a science waiting to be explained

[missushow]

What about Demon? I think Raynardinne counts as a magic user, and Zimmy ver well could be a Demon.

[rastarogue]

Reynardine is a magical being of some sort and thus has some inherent magical abilities, I dont think they can really be classified.

Also think about the haunted forest across the gorge.

[missushow]

Allright, I can see that... but I think creature magic should be classified also, because what if it's not just that Reynardine knows how to use magic because he's a demon, but because he learned it...

[rastarogue]

Where does it say he learned it?

[xux]

I doesn't say it anywhere, hence missushow use of 'what if'.

[alternativeoyster]

aspengrey said:

I think it's more of a steampunk kind of thing- a mix of magic, technology, and old-world manners. I wouldn't think that Kat was all that 'magical', and that the glow from her anti-grav is simply the technology. Then again, I like your theory about her expressing magic via technology. I think that it's already been proposed that most of the characters are, at the least, a bit 'off'. (From that About the Court thread)

Mr Eglamore can either wield a magical sword (Shown at the end of Chapter 7) and can probably control magic in other ways.

I don't really get the feeling that this is a 'Hogwarts' type school- at the very least it would be Rowling + Verne, but I think we just happen to focus on the weird things going on because that's what's interesting.

I think this is the best way of looking at the Court. I don't think the world classifies itself, or breaks itself down into easy categories. People just have abilties. Kat can figure how things work and rewire them, Annie is pretty much awesome, etc. Doesn't need a D&D style magic system.

[rastarogue]

I was just using the DnD class sysytem to make my thoughts easier to understand. if you want I can say it in my own words, but i felt this would be the clearest way.

[missushow]

I think this is the best way of looking at the Court. I don't think the world classifies itself, or breaks itself down into easy categories. People just have abilties. Kat can figure how things work and rewire them, Annie is pretty much awesome, etc. Doesn't need a D&D style magic system.

Oh oh! I like this explanation the best.

To think of Magic as a split between old world magic and...science magic.

[Aspen d'Grey]

Isn't one of the definitions of 'magical creature' is that they are beyond classification?

As for splitting between old-world magic and science-magic, that would be the 'steampunk' genre.

[rastarogue]

That is probably the best way to describe it, but the term science-magic realllllllyyyyyy grates against my nerves, kinda like nails on a blackboard.

[mrw]

Debating where you see science leaving off and magic beginning is very much like debating religion.

I fear no good will come from this...

[rastarogue]

I know, just please let us avoid the term science-magic (shudders). I like like the old magic idea because in the middle ages Alchemy was a science to the Alchemists and magic to the rest of the world and Alchemy plays quite a "symbolic" role in GC.

[alexthegreater]

rastarogue said:

in the middle ages Alchemy was a science to the Alchemists and magic to the rest of the world

My point exactly. Magic is just science that has yet to be explained. If you do not understand something than it happens by magic.

If you do have a theory of how something works than it is science.

Any attempt to classify magic into schools makes it science.

[rastarogue]

I think the difference lies in that even when magic is explained and catagorized it is still magic. Magic draws power from the inside and science is more of an outside of the body thing.

[alexthegreater]

So a bodybuilders strength or a martial artist's moves are magic? Even when we know how it works.

Define inside and outside. Until then I will use the definition given by Arthur C Clarke.

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"

To us Kat's mother's Binding spell was magic. She knows how it works and to her its no different than preforming a martal arts move or reprogramming a VCR. It looks Arcane and mysterious but its actually very simple if you know how to do it.