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Post by madjack on Mar 4, 2020 8:01:59 GMT
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ST13R
Full Member
Quiet little mouse
Posts: 171
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Post by ST13R on Mar 4, 2020 8:19:12 GMT
Telling a court robot they are of no use. Oof. |
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Post by wies on Mar 4, 2020 8:22:36 GMT
Looking more probable that the Guide is a kind of program, created by Kat, instead of a psychopomp.
Though I wonder how much self-determination the Guide has. Like calling Kat an angel, was that a decision of Kat or by the Guide?
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Post by philman on Mar 4, 2020 8:23:24 GMT
Telling a court robot they are of no use. Oof.Well if their body has been destroyed or rendered inoperable and they are just a consciousness in a bathtub I imagine most robots would agree... We saw the unnamed Bathtub Robot's distress at being told the pipes were no longer being checked! |
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Post by bicarbonat on Mar 4, 2020 8:39:13 GMT
Katerina Donlan, Mother of Fleshbots, is here to break the wheel! ...Everybody get your emergency GORP and your water filtration systems, we're going to ground. |
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Post by grahamf on Mar 4, 2020 8:54:01 GMT
Looking more probable that the Guide is a kind of program, created by Kat, instead of a psychopomp. Though I wonder how much self-determination the Guide has. Like calling Kat an angel, was that a decision of Kat or by the Guide? Given enough faith the guide can be both. |
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Post by zbeeblebrox on Mar 4, 2020 9:17:27 GMT
She suddenly got very dogmatic, didn't she? I'm starting to think this might the digital avatar of one of those archangel bots Kat is not a fan of. Meddling yet again
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manabi
Junior Member
Posts: 76 
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Post by manabi on Mar 4, 2020 9:38:41 GMT
Looking more probable that the Guide is a kind of program, created by Kat, instead of a psychopomp. Though I wonder how much self-determination the Guide has. Like calling Kat an angel, was that a decision of Kat or by the Guide? What if Robot helped her create the program, and it's him who has made it like this? The language is very similar to his. This could also lead to him ultimately becoming a psychopomp for the new robots. |
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Post by Sky Schemer on Mar 4, 2020 10:20:25 GMT
"To receive your free body, all you need to do is attend our seminar next weekend on exciting vacation opportunities that are available to you. You'll be under no obligation to purchase any of the timeshares--though most attendees do--but you must be present in each session to qualify for your gift. Terms and conditions apply..."
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Post by theonethatgotaway on Mar 4, 2020 10:31:01 GMT
"You're gonna get a body and you're gonna CHOOSE to enjoy it! Now say: "thank you, Angel!"." |
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 4, 2020 10:52:59 GMT
Two thoughts:
1. I thought it was a secret that Kat created this new body for Arthur, because it was a forbidden love. Why does a random water pipe maintenance robot know of it?
2. "We" regret that?
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Post by merry76 on Mar 4, 2020 11:06:11 GMT
Two thoughts: 1. I thought it was a secret that Kat created this new body for Arthur, because it was a forbidden love. Why does a random water pipe maintenance robot know of it? Now we know that robots are terrible gossips. I guess it takes quite a short time too, being in binary and all.
But creating living bodies for random robots that just want to check pipes? What could possibly go wrong?
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Post by saardvark on Mar 4, 2020 11:32:47 GMT
Two thoughts: 2. "We" regret that? royal we? or Kat and Robot, who "helped" Kat make the avatar more robot-friendly and persuasive (and snuck some robo-religion in when she wasnt looking...) |
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Post by saardvark on Mar 4, 2020 11:38:20 GMT
Telling a court robot they are of no use. Oof.its likely the pipe-bot was one of those who was part of the bubble shield who got de-CPU-ed to make the hole for the forest elves to enter. Then, as just a bare CPU in a padded box, he really wouldn't be much use in his current form, so the avatar is just being truthful. |
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Post by wies on Mar 4, 2020 12:38:17 GMT
Two thoughts: 1. I thought it was a secret that Kat created this new body for Arthur, because it was a forbidden love. Why does a random water pipe maintenance robot know of it? Forbidden by the Court. But it is reasonable the news spread in the society of robots. 1) They already have amassed a group around Kat and are listening to sermons about her deeds. 2) Seeing the court had to write an article against it, there are multiple robots in love with humans, and like with all opressed forms of love, they would certainly tell each other about the one couple that did succeed in affirming their love. 3) Some of them are interested in transhumanism (or transrobotism?) So why would a random water pipe maintenance robot not know of it? It was one of the biggest events in their history. Telling a court robot they are of no use. Oof.its likely the pipe-bot was one of those who was part of the bubble shield who got de-CPU-ed to make the hole for the forest elves to enter. Then, as just a bare CPU in a padded box, he really wouldn't be much use in his current form, so the avatar is just being truthful. Yeah, this made me wonder if they were supposed to stay in that box? By now, the elves are inside the Court, so I suppose the Court is going to want the CPU's back. So that could lead to them finding out they are missing, which could cause detection of Kat's secret project. |
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Post by saardvark on Mar 4, 2020 13:40:18 GMT
its likely the pipe-bot was one of those who was part of the bubble shield who got de-CPU-ed to make the hole for the forest elves to enter. Then, as just a bare CPU in a padded box, he really wouldn't be much use in his current form, so the avatar is just being truthful. Yeah, this made me wonder if they were supposed to stay in that box? By now, the elves are inside the Court, so I suppose the Court is going to want the CPU's back. So that could lead to them finding out they are missing, which could cause detection of Kat's secret project. Yes, I suspect the CPUs were meant to be stored for later reuse. But I also would have thought that they'd want to close the bubble shield gap ASAP, to prevent more infiltration. In that case, they'd want to shoo the elves in and replace the CPUs almost immediately.... no need even to box them up. So maybe the Court did something else.... The fact that they removed CPUs from a contiguous line of robots suggests each robot was responsible for a part of the bubble shield directly before it. Maybe they could plug/close the gap for the short term merely by shifting the other robots around a bit. Lower robot density might mean the shield is weaker locally, but at least the hole was closed. Then they could re-insert the CPUs at leisure, or maybe even repurpose these robots to more traditional tasks. Or return them the shield bubble, to shore it up a bit. Anyway, if the Court were thereby more relaxed about the need to reuse CPUs, this gave Juliette the chance to snarf them and get them to Kat. Eventually tho, you're right, eventually the robot shortage or need to strengthen the bubble would cause the Court to wonder where the box had got to. But maybe there will be enough of a delay that Juliette and Arthur can make an escape, and Kat finish flesh-botting the others. |
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Post by netherdan on Mar 4, 2020 13:40:56 GMT
I should point that this Kat Jones Robot mash-up guide is being very literal with the word "free". Not just as in "free to move", but literal, unrevokable freedom
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Post by ctso74 on Mar 4, 2020 14:21:15 GMT
Looking more probable that the Guide is a kind of program, created by Kat, instead of a psychopomp. Though I wonder how much self-determination the Guide has. Like calling Kat an angel, was that a decision of Kat or by the Guide? What if Robot helped her create the program, and it's him who has made it like this? The language is very similar to his. This could also lead to him ultimately becoming a psychopomp for the new robots. If this happens, it would be interesting if his form changed, due to Etheric stuff. How is a robi-psychopomp supposed to look? A mini-EtherKat? An electric elemental? Regular Robot but with neon underglow? |
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Post by red0mamma on Mar 4, 2020 14:32:02 GMT
Oh, this is so obviously not Kat, unless we find out she's had a personality change or is being pressured into being not herself in other ways—which is possible. She plays down being called an angel. I *think* it's Robot, and I think the kicker will be that everyone gets fleshy bodies secretly (maybe even unbeknownst to Kat...unless she's been manipulated into becoming a mad scientist). The way the porcelain girl talks is totally like Robot—cool, but manipulative. The only other possibility is she's putting the robots' consciousnesses into the ancient robots, but I get the feeling this is actually different (yet parallel).
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Post by Gemini Jim on Mar 4, 2020 15:47:55 GMT
well, the Not An Angel doesn't specifically say "human body;" just "body." Although admittedly, it does imply another Arthur-ish body.
"Set free" could mean set free from the barrier, or set free from the limits of being a robot.
It's just vague enough that it could mean "archaic robot body" or "humanoid body."
I'll admit, it seems strange to go through all this trouble just for going from one robot body to another. (Are all robots commonly moved from body to body, or just Robot? When Robot was paperclipped, I don't think the other robots expected him to come back.)
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Post by bedinsis on Mar 4, 2020 17:53:49 GMT
1. I thought it was a secret that Kat created this new body for Arthur, because it was a forbidden love. Why does a random water pipe maintenance robot know of it? I'm seeing a parallel to the chapter Tall Tales where we got to see how the creatures of the forest viewed Annie through their lens. Specifically, how Smitty's secret meeting with the forest creatures managed to reach the attention of <snuffle>*. What I'm saying is that the robots gossip. And as our robot plumber no doubt would tell us, even a small leak can have far reaching consequences. *pronounced correctly. |
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Post by mturtle7 on Mar 4, 2020 19:13:24 GMT
Oh my goodness those phrases "you have languished enough" and "no use to anyone" both REALLY pushed some buttons for me in a very bad way. If anyone said that sh*t to me, I'd probably blow up, or else shrink down into nothing. Although, of course, it certainly has a very different connotation for robots like Danny-Bot here (thanks for the new nickname, btw, ohthatone). By default, they really do get very excited about how "useful" they are, and how well they do their jobs of being intelligent mechanical tools. And when they're not useful (i.e. dead), such as when they're powered off or put in storage, that's just a fact of life to them, which can usually be fixed by getting powered on again and/or getting a new body. That's not exactly a GOOD thing, but I can see how the Guide would think this is an OK thing to say to the poor guy. I'm still rather inclined to dislike her now, though. |
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Post by jda on Mar 4, 2020 20:00:34 GMT
She suddenly got very dogmatic, didn't she? I'm starting to think this might the digital avatar of one of those archangel bots Kat is not a fan of. Meddling yet again I woudl think the case is more like the first "AI chat programs" that only read part of your inputs, regex-ed them, and extracted some sort of Value to make conversation with you, not being aware of what it means but only as interface; thus, the "avatar" need to read the robot mind to be able to comfort them with a "So, what it is the last you remember?" - Being at X doing Y "dont' worry about X or Y_" So, the "angel" idea was something PipeRobot was fond of, so it was an anchor for progressing on the conversation. |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Mar 4, 2020 21:40:24 GMT
Yeah, this made me wonder if they were supposed to stay in that box? By now, the elves are inside the Court, so I suppose the Court is going to want the CPU's back. So that could lead to them finding out they are missing, which could cause detection of Kat's secret project.
Yes, I suspect the CPUs were meant to be stored for later reuse. But I also would have thought that they'd want to close the bubble shield gap ASAP, to prevent more infiltration. In that case, they'd want to shoo the elves in and replace the CPUs almost immediately.... no need even to box them up. So maybe the Court did something else.... The fact that they removed CPUs from a contiguous line of robots suggests each robot was responsible for a part of the bubble shield directly before it. Maybe they could plug/close the gap for the short term merely by shifting the other robots around a bit. Lower robot density might mean the shield is weaker locally, but at least the hole was closed. Then they could re-insert the CPUs at leisure, or maybe even repurpose these robots to more traditional tasks. Or return them the shield bubble, to shore it up a bit. Anyway, if the Court were thereby more relaxed about the need to reuse CPUs, this gave Juliette the chance to snarf them and get them Kat. Eventually tho, you're right, eventually the robot shortage or need to strengthen the bubble would cause the Court to wonder where the box had got to. But maybe there will be enough of a delay that Juliette and Arthur can make an escape, and Kat finish flesh-botting them. Agree though I think what this all implies is that the robot CPUs were being stored in case of later reuse; if they were really fundamental to the restored Court logistics and services they'd be somewhere they couldn't easily be nicked by any one person, even by a Shadow Man. If they have to build new robot bodies I think the Court would rather have new robots entirely, less sophisticated and somewhat less useful but more predictable/obedient/robotic robots... so things like this can be omitted from the operating manuals. |
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Post by arf on Mar 4, 2020 23:17:03 GMT
I'm wondering if Angel here is one of the Diego type robots that Kat resurrected, 'upgraded', and then set to work on mass upgrading (hence the 'we')
Another possibility: some interloper wisps have found a new plaything.
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 4, 2020 23:29:20 GMT
Two thoughts: 1. I thought it was a secret that Kat created this new body for Arthur, because it was a forbidden love. Why does a random water pipe maintenance robot know of it? Now we know that robots are terrible gossips. I guess it takes quite a short time too, being in binary and all. You are certainly right in that the robots are gossips, but I would have expected Kat, Juliette and Arthur to keep this work from the ordinary robots. Once one of them knows they certainly all know. Two thoughts: 2. "We" regret that? royal we? She referred to herself with "I" before... 1) They already have amassed a group around Kat and are listening to sermons about her deeds. 2) Seeing the court had to write an article against it, there are multiple robots in love with humans, and like with all opressed forms of love, they would certainly tell each other about the one couple that did succeed in affirming their love. 3) Some of them are interested in transhumanism (or transrobotism?) So why would a random water pipe maintenance robot not know of it? It was one of the biggest events in their history. You are both right... It just does not convince me. The robots are also loyal to the Court. I see a huge danger. Just one of them blabbing out the secret to Court personnel and they know about it. Arthur is the only robot we have seen working as a Shadow Man, but there might be others. On the other hand, the Court did not seem to realize anything was up after the Torn Sea incident, which is even harder to believe, so... Maybe they are just playing dumb and letting Kat continue so they can reap the fruits of her work later (or blame it all on her if it turns out to be a catastrophe). BTW, successfully transferring Arthur's consciousness into a new, more or less biological, brain was one of the biggest events in their history, but they do not know that yet, because it happened after they were all overridden by the shield protocol. (Are all robots commonly moved from body to body, or just Robot? When Robot was paperclipped, I don't think the other robots expected him to come back.) It seems normal to upgrade robots from basic chassis to more sophisticated designs over the course of their lifecycle. Though it seems it does not happen with S-models (who also have the strange extra part on their CPU). Regarding Robot specifically, he was not expected to be back, because his CPU was put in storage to be studied. Agree though I think what this all implies is that the robot CPUs were being stored in case of later reuse; if they were really fundamental to the restored Court logistics and services they'd be somewhere they couldn't easily be nicked by any one person, even by a Shadow Man. Maybe Juliette was supposed to do exactly that... |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Mar 5, 2020 1:16:36 GMT
Agree though I think what this all implies is that the robot CPUs were being stored in case of later reuse; if they were really fundamental to the restored Court logistics and services they'd be somewhere they couldn't easily be nicked by any one person, even by a Shadow Man. Maybe Juliette was supposed to do exactly that... No doubt she was but for hardware that is very important there should be some kind of multiple-person tracebility (chain-of-custody) that has at least one other person checking it, preferably two as well as some mechanical or electronic feature that would aid in tracking (such as a transponder in the carrying case) though that latter part would be something that Juliette could easily defeat with her inside knowledge. That much is basic. If the Court isn't even doing that then either they have some serious organizational problems (which wouldn't dovetail well with being paranoid about monitoring other people in the Court) or the CPUs were just not considered that important, but considering the value of the CPUs outside the Court I think it is a little of both. That said, I can come up with scenarios where they were better secured and Juliette got them anyway. The best way would have been to swap out the CPUs with something of similar composition and then have the fakes accidentally destroyed, say in a fire, along with a number of other top-secret things (so that even if the Court is suspicious they can't be sure what the actual target was therefore they can't be sure of the motive). Now, maybe that someone else in the custody chain was Art but he's supposed to be on the DL so someone else should have been assigned by now. Maybe manpower is just too thin or the other person(s) responsible for the CPUs is/are slacking and/or just blindly trusting Juliette when they should be exercising due diligence; stuff like that does happen... but if so when Juliette ghosts there will almost certainly be someone else holding the bag for all those CPUs. Maybe it's another Shadow Man, maybe it's a clerk who's responsible for the facility where they were supposed to be in storage, maybe both; maybe Juliette's immediate superior will also have to shoulder blame (though they are possibly the same person). Also: Grateful as the Court may have been to whoever made the shield protocol (probably Donald Donlan) doing so proved that the robots had vulnerabilities that could be exploited in a big way; someone with similar access and etheric science talent could have made the robots do something really nasty to whoever and whatever in the Court they wanted, if so inclined. They weren't going to dispose of them, at least not right away, but that may just mean they wanted them for study or emergency use, and to prevent them from falling into the wrong hands. Assuming Juliette doesn't want to screw over her co-workers (as well as give them an additional reason to hunt her down) I think it likely that she isn't taking a huge risk by swiping them, which means the CPUs were not a big part of the Court's plans and were being stored somewhere that was a little lax, hopefully somewhere that the missing CPUs won't be noticed for a good while. |
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Post by zbeeblebrox on Mar 5, 2020 1:48:51 GMT
She suddenly got very dogmatic, didn't she? I'm starting to think this might the digital avatar of one of those archangel bots Kat is not a fan of. Meddling yet again I woudl think the case is more like the first "AI chat programs" that only read part of your inputs, regex-ed them, and extracted some sort of Value to make conversation with you, not being aware of what it means but only as interface; thus, the "avatar" need to read the robot mind to be able to comfort them with a "So, what it is the last you remember?" - Being at X doing Y "dont' worry about X or Y_" So, the "angel" idea was something PipeRobot was fond of, so it was an anchor for progressing on the conversation. Interesting idea, but that's not how it reads to me. "With your new body you will be set free" sounds very much unlike [YOU'LL BE FINE FOLLOW INSTRUCTIONS] and much more like "Praise robo-Jesus you're being reborn!" |
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Post by saardvark on Mar 5, 2020 3:24:29 GMT
She referred to herself with "I" before... BTW, successfully transferring Arthur's consciousness into a new, more or less biological, brain was one of the biggest events in their history, but they do not know that yet, because it happened after they were all overridden by the shield protocol. Agree though I think what this all implies is that the robot CPUs were being stored in case of later reuse; if they were really fundamental to the restored Court logistics and services they'd be somewhere they couldn't easily be nicked by any one person, even by a Shadow Man. Maybe Juliette was supposed to do exactly that... which is why I mentioned the second idea that "we" referred to "Robot and Kat", who developed the avatar together (Robot tweaking Kat's basic design) - the "royal we" was a straw man argument.... Excellent point about the robots in general likely not realizing that their transfiguration to robo-human is now possible. ...and exactly my thought - that Juliette may have absconded with the CPUs instead of putting them into storage. |
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arnj
New Member
Posts: 13
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Post by arnj on Mar 5, 2020 23:59:26 GMT
No one has mentioned the horrific implications of this page so I guess I have to.
Box Bot is getting a body.
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