[1494] Kat didn't know anything about it!

[Elysium]

Mar 30, 2015 12:34:20 GMT zimmyzims said:

I'd say just about every school, in condition that the decision is made so late that the first lesson already takes place.

The decision was already made, cf. Anthony's dialogue

Mar 30, 2015 12:34:20 GMT zimmyzims said:

but in case that office is closed for the summer may be hardly avoidable if decision is not made the last spring,

School's offices doesn't magically open the day class begins, they should have prevented her from taking class, or at the very least inform her, but not, they (or rather, Anthony) went the dickish route.

Mar 30, 2015 12:34:20 GMT zimmyzims said:

I'm just about sure that Anthony will come up with an option for Annie, so that she will have to choose. They will not make her repeat a school year without hearing her first, and she will have a choice.

So he'll blackmail her ? lovely father-daughter relationshup !

[kalechibki]

Mar 30, 2015 11:40:18 GMT Jelly Jellybean said:

Mar 30, 2015 7:46:29 GMT vakri said:

Stop. Just don't.

By the way, what would be Kat's punishment? Maybe, she will loose access to her lab?

Kat and Paz have been open with their relationship.  I have no doubt that the Court (or at least Anthony) would threaten to separate them.  Might even do it as an example to others.

I don't see this as an option for a Kat punishment. We really haven't seen any homophobic back lash against KazPat. It would feel really jarring - and I mean more jarring to me than Anthony trying to push Antimony down a grade - if this was suddenly introduced. I also don't believe that Kat and Paz, for all their wonderfulness, would be quite so open IF the court was homophobic to the degree that it would take for them to try and force this relationship issue.

Also - as a wonderful Blue Genie once pointed out - even cosmic power can't force love (or hate!).

[rama]

Mar 30, 2015 13:10:27 GMT Elysium said:

So he'll blackmail her ? lovely father-daughter relationshup !

No, he is not.

From wikipedia (I know it's not the best source but meh):

"Blackmail is an act, often a crime, involving unjustified threats to make a gain or cause loss to another unless a demand is met. It is coercion involving threats of physical harm, threat of criminal prosecution, or threats for the purposes of taking the person's money or property."


Nothing of what Anthony is doing is truly unjustified. She did cheat the entire last year. Had she not and he instead fabricated evidence to make it seem like she did to set her back a year, that would be blackmail.


He is still manipulating her though, but I'm in the camp of those that believe that Anthony is not planning on actually bringing her back a year.
It is probably what would happen in any real school (I'm not sure, I've never had to decide something like that) because of the lack of theoretical knowledge that would result from copying an entire years worth of coursework, but as others have said Antimony would not have been allowed to advance to next year at all had they planned to hold her back.

I'm of the belief that this is Anthony setting something up to seem like a more reasonable solution, and at the same time preventing Kat from being too angry at Annie, namely by taking the role as an unreasonable boogeyman for Kat to hate.
It's all speculation though, because Anthony is a freaking pokerface champion that hasn't made his intentions clear at any point before. We do know that he has feelings though, and that he himself experienced friendships failing because he couldn't figure out what to do.

[Chancellor]

There's that word you're using Anthony. Oh, nah, you're not using it incorrectly, it's just a funny thing to hear out of your mouth, considering-well, EVERYTHING we know about you.

Daughter eh? I dunno, Ms. Carver just sounds more your style, man.

[elcheeso]

I'm kinda curious whether everyone would be having the same reaction re: Annie having to repeat yr9 if Anthony wasn't involved with the decision or, at the very least, not been such a toolbag to her beforehand? It's a pretty harsh punishment for sure, but I'm inclined to think it's fair enough given her own work is a shambles when she's not copying off Kat, and it's fair to assume that the cheating is really damn extensive given what Rey and Anthony have said and what we've seen in the comic. It's possible her work in biology and history are really good, but unless Anthony's standards are really high, his words weren't exactly a glowing testimony of her work ("satisfactory" and "fine"). It's likely that she's not exceeding in these classes, either. Either way, it should be interesting to see if this is what really ends up happening, Annie definitely needed something to shake her out of this thing where she's (like max said) shirking accountability.

Also glad to see Kat try and stand up for her and that their friendship isn't going to go up in smoke over this thing. Even if Annie probably does deserve a bit of an earful later on, Kat's priorities are in order. That said, I don't really think this is a dream, mostly because it's not really inspired by anything? Annie hasn't really come close to actually getting in actual trouble over her cheating/skipping detentions, her father is randomly (from her POV) missing a hand and has obviously had something happen to his mouth/face in general since she last saw him, and if it's one of those dreams where all the horrible things that could happen to you do, Kat's reaction is very out of place. I don't get a dream vibe from this at all, besides Anthony being present in general.

Can anyone else describe what they think Anthony's expression is in panel 5? It seems curious/vaguely sympathetic to me, sorta like his first expression on page 1492, but at the same time his words really aren't. It might be intended to be a blank slate ala Jones, but it doesn't come off that way to me.

[zimmyzims]

Mar 30, 2015 12:43:13 GMT imaginaryfriend said:

Mar 30, 2015 12:34:20 GMT zimmyzims said:

I'd say just about every school, in condition that the decision is made so late that the first lesson already takes place. That is, of course, a bad arrangement by the school, but in case that office is closed for the summer may be hardly avoidable if decision is not made the last spring, and would definitely not prevent them from making her repeat the previous school year - nor should it really, because her duty to actually pass all the courses is much more important than their duty to inform about this before the first lesson of the year, and she's the one who got herself to this crap anyway, there's also a real possibility that she'd be expelled altogether and would have to start again from year 8. In this case, the decision probably is not even made yet. I'm just about sure that Anthony will come up with an option for Annie, so that she will have to choose. They will not make her repeat a school year without hearing her first, and she will have a choice.

But in panel #3 Anthony says that he already made the arrangements for Antimony to repeat the year. He did give her a chance to deny it, or I suppose shift blame, but I think this is/was the hearing, on the first day of the new term. That's why I've been saying that it's a bit fishy. He also says in panel #2 that he examined all of her work, so I figure that if the school knew about the cheating in the previous term they didn't know the full extent of it.

I think it is obvious that this is the hearing. So, he first lesson is over, she can start the 9th year from the beginning right away. Exactly that he had to go through all her work himself to see the extent of her cheating may have been the cause that the Court's decision was delayed so late. Now, there's really hardly a credible alternative to her repeating a year (or two!), apart from her being expelled, but panel #1 suggests that the Court was not so conclusive on basis of their knowledge (and supposedly they were unaware of the extent of her cheating).

[zimmyzims]

Mar 30, 2015 13:10:27 GMT Elysium said:

Mar 30, 2015 12:34:20 GMT zimmyzims said:

I'd say just about every school, in condition that the decision is made so late that the first lesson already takes place.

The decision was already made, cf. Anthony's dialogue

It says that the preparations for her to repeat the year 9 are made, which takes time just as takes to go through her schoolwork in order to come to this decision (i.e. that she has to repeat a year). It does not say that a final decision is made and I suspect it isn't.

Mar 30, 2015 13:10:27 GMT Elysium said:

Mar 30, 2015 12:34:20 GMT zimmyzims said:

but in case that office is closed for the summer may be hardly avoidable if decision is not made the last spring,

School's offices doesn't magically open the day class begins, they should have prevented her from taking class, or at the very least inform her, but not, they (or rather, Anthony) went the dickish route.

See above. They have a ton of things to do and a decision like this would take time. Several weeks at minimum.

Mar 30, 2015 13:10:27 GMT Elysium said:

Mar 30, 2015 12:34:20 GMT zimmyzims said:

I'm just about sure that Anthony will come up with an option for Annie, so that she will have to choose. They will not make her repeat a school year without hearing her first, and she will have a choice.

So he'll blackmail her ? lovely father-daughter relationshup !

So now giving a choice is blackmail!? You guys offer me endless laughs... So, in your opinion giving your children no choice is the epitome of parenting? There just is not a thing that he could do that you would not describe negatively, is there? If he came up with fresh baked cookies that would probably be labeledd trying to make her fat! Try to understand: she's in a big trouble thanks to no one but herself, and already only repeating one year seems like pretty good deal for her (only imaginable alternatives in any normal real world situation would be 1) repeating two years and 2) being drop out of school), but what we're suggesting is that he's even offering her an alternative that she'd prefer to repeating a year. If that is blackmail, everybody but absolute dicktators should be in jail.

[zimmyzims]

Mar 30, 2015 13:32:21 GMT Chancellor said:

There's that word you're using Anthony. Oh, nah, you're not using it incorrectly, it's just a funny thing to hear out of your mouth, considering-well, EVERYTHING we know about you.

Daughter eh? I dunno, Ms. Carver just sounds more your style, man.

What's the problem? As you said, it's precisely correct in this moment. "Ms. Carver" would have been completely ridiculous. He is speaking to her as a father. But I can see that you and I, we're no reading the same comic, because considering EVERYTHING I know about Anthony, it is perfectly in place here for him to call Antimony "my daughter" (second in order would have been "Antimony").

[youwiththeface]

Mar 30, 2015 13:31:32 GMT rama said:

Mar 30, 2015 13:10:27 GMT Elysium said:

So he'll blackmail her ? lovely father-daughter relationshup !

No, he is not.

From wikipedia (I know it's not the best source but meh):

"Blackmail is an act, often a crime, involving unjustified threats to make a gain or cause loss to another unless a demand is met. It is coercion involving threats of physical harm, threat of criminal prosecution, or threats for the purposes of taking the person's money or property."


Nothing of what Anthony is doing is truly unjustified. She did cheat the entire last year. Had she not and he instead fabricated evidence to make it seem like she did to set her back a year, that would be blackmail.

That's not true, actually. An act doesn't have to be illegal or fabricated for a person to use it to blackmail someone. If you knew someone who was cheating on their wife and made them give you money so you wouldn't tell their wife what they were doing, that would be blackmail. Adultery isn't illegal, and in this case it did actually happen, and what you'd be doing would totally be blackmail. 

If Anthony is indeed holding the threat of being held back over Annie's head to get her to do something, that's pretty damn close to blackmail. 

[Deepbluediver]

Mar 30, 2015 7:28:46 GMT Daedalus said:

Also, this might be the final nail in the coffin for Anthony fans.

I didn't think Anthony had any actual fans, merely people who were more willing to tolerate his existence than average.

What I do find interesting is that most of the "ANTHONY MUST DIE!!! PREFERABLY SLOWLY AND PAINFULLY" posts seems to have petered out somewhat.  That fact that he has a valid reason to be upset with Antimony seems to have thrown some ice-water on the fires of righteous indignation.  He's still acting like an ass (you couldn't have done this privately before class, dude?) but he's kind of put people on the defensive it seems.

Mar 30, 2015 7:03:57 GMT OrzBrain said:

The Court knew and yet did nothing? Why?

Can you imagine all the stuff that Red probably gets away with?  I get the distinct impression that the court makes accommodations for people with special abilities.

Mar 30, 2015 7:32:17 GMT Max said:

As surprising as this is, Annie has been shirking accountability for a long time. Not just for cheating, but other stuff as well. And the more and more it builds up, the harsher the consequences will be.

Yeah, possibly they where just giving her enough rope to hang herself with.  Cheating on one assignment?  NBD, probably.  Threatening to make you repeat an entire year? Quite a different story.

[pxc]

Does Tony's weathered old face remind anyone of the headmaster? Tom has drawn actual old people. Tony and the Headmaster don't look old. Headmaster had a thick head of dark black hair. Their faces don't look just old, they look unnaturally weathered. The headmaster moreso, like he's in a more advanced stage of something. Something to do with etheric experimentation?

Also, Tony is a dick and a poor excuse for a father. It might be right for Annie to repeat some classes or even be held back. But this is doing the (questionably) right thing the wrong way. There are and should be consequences for her cheating and shirking her studies. Where are the consequences for his absence, emotional and (meta)physical abuse, and shirked fatherly responsibilities? Bringing Annie's shortcomings to light do nothing to change the mistakes he has made and is continuing to make. He owes his daughter apologies, explanations, and the offer to do something to try to make his neglect and abuse right. But he instead focuses on the bad decisions his neglected, directionless daughter that he's ignored for years has made while he was away doing who the hell knows what.

And Tom's cheeky exclamations of "Seems reasonable!", "Fair point!", "It's only polite to wait!" indicate he clearly knows this behavior is ridiculous and unwarranted. He's doing his best to get under our skin with this outrageous return. I'm waiting for the big reveal that rounds this out, and don't buy that Tony will continue this way. It's too much, the bubble will burst here soon.

[csj]

I'm sensing high probability of the word 'unless' being utilised in the next page or two

however, that may be as much a curse as a blessing if true

[fwip]

Mar 30, 2015 8:17:59 GMT Max said:

I wonder if she will be forced to retake bio and history as well, even though her father said she did well in those classes.

What other subjects do they typically teach at the Court?  Around here, from kindergarden to high school you typically learn some form of literature, some form of history, some form of science, and some form of math.  Was it only in non-bio science classes that she had issues?  Did she have trouble in Mathematics?  I can't see her effectively cheating off Kat in Literature.

[imaginaryfriend]

Mar 30, 2015 14:30:53 GMT Deepbluediver said:

I didn't think Anthony had any actual fans, merely people who were more willing to tolerate his existence than average.

What I do find interesting is that most of the "ANTHONY MUST DIE!!! PREFERABLY SLOWLY AND PAINFULLY" posts seems to have petered out somewhat.  That fact that he has a valid reason to be upset with Antimony seems to have thrown some ice-water on the fires of righteous indignation.  He's still acting like an ass (you couldn't have done this privately before class, dude?) but he's kind of put people on the defensive it seems.

Even if Antimony wasn't the main character of the story, being protective of the young is a natural instinct to mammalian-types; conversely a parent abandoning its young is generally seen as below par, lizard-like. I still remain in the "withholding judgement" category although I am expecting some sort of good things to come out about Anthony Carter eventually, as misunderstandings and "hurting people accidentally" seems to be a running theme in the comic, but I also recognize the possibility that there may be a twist where Anthony may be a bigger douche then most ever suspected (re: my comments on sacrificing Antimony to resurrect Surma).

Mar 30, 2015 13:45:03 GMT elcheeso said:

I'm kinda curious whether everyone would be having the same reaction re: Annie having to repeat yr9 if Anthony wasn't involved with the decision or, at the very least, not been such a toolbag to her beforehand? It's a pretty harsh punishment for sure, but I'm inclined to think it's fair enough given her own work is a shambles when she's not copying off Kat, and it's fair to assume that the cheating is really damn extensive given what Rey and Anthony have said and what we've seen in the comic. It's possible her work in biology and history are really good, but unless Anthony's standards are really high, his words weren't exactly a glowing testimony of her work ("satisfactory" and "fine"). It's likely that she's not exceeding in these classes, either.

I suspect Anthony Carver's standards are high. Antimony probably has an edge on history classes because of all her conversations with the 'guides as a kid; that gave her grounding and interest in what they've been studying, I'd imagine. She absolutely has an advantage in biology from her dad. As for the rest, she's trying to keep up with Kat who is a genius possibly equal to Diego in the sciences. That's a confidence-crippler. Not sure who else she's cheating off but I'm sure it's either Kat or other high-end students.

But as to punishment, I don't think they would have caught her if Anthony Carver hadn't gone over not only all of Antimony's work but Kat's and other classmates's with a fine tooth comb. If the Court did know about all of it and let her run a tab to this year, then they let her graduate with a string attached only to yank it back on the first day of the next term like a joke dollar on a fishing line. As a school that wouldn't be very professional behavior; actually that's a good example of jerking someone around, like how the headmaster apparently let Antimony think she was going to be the Court medium. If they knew about some of it and Anthony found the rest then her dad's doing the yanking and is therefore the jerk. It's also possible the Court was only relatively recently briefed on the cheating by the returning Anthony (thus Antimony's presence and the book here in class) and he is misrepresenting how long they knew, using the Court as a shield to deflect responsibility for his own jerkitude.

Mar 30, 2015 13:45:03 GMT elcheeso said:

Can anyone else describe what they think Anthony's expression is in panel 5? It seems curious/vaguely sympathetic to me, sorta like his first expression on page 1492, but at the same time his words really aren't. It might be intended to be a blank slate ala Jones, but it doesn't come off that way to me.

Owl. And in panel #2 he's a pale forest dude.

[edzepp]

Mar 30, 2015 15:20:46 GMT imaginaryfriend said:

Mar 30, 2015 14:30:53 GMT Deepbluediver said:

I didn't think Anthony had any actual fans, merely people who were more willing to tolerate his existence than average.

What I do find interesting is that most of the "ANTHONY MUST DIE!!! PREFERABLY SLOWLY AND PAINFULLY" posts seems to have petered out somewhat.  That fact that he has a valid reason to be upset with Antimony seems to have thrown some ice-water on the fires of righteous indignation.  He's still acting like an ass (you couldn't have done this privately before class, dude?) but he's kind of put people on the defensive it seems.

Even if Antimony wasn't the main character of the story, being protective of the young is a natural instinct to mammalian-types; conversely a parent abandoning its young is generally seen as below par, lizard-like. I still remain in the "withholding judgement" category although I am expecting some sort of good things to come out about Anthony Carter eventually, as misunderstandings and "hurting people accidentally" seems to be a running theme in the comic, but I also recognize the possibility that there may be a twist where Anthony may be a bigger douche then most ever suspected (re: my comments on sacrificing Antimony to resurrect Surma).

That actually did cross my mind, honestly. I have a few options going and that's one of them.

[imaginaryfriend]

Mar 30, 2015 15:26:26 GMT edzepp said:

Mar 30, 2015 15:20:46 GMT imaginaryfriend said:

Even if Antimony wasn't the main character of the story, being protective of the young is a natural instinct to mammalian-types; conversely a parent abandoning its young is generally seen as below par, lizard-like. I still remain in the "withholding judgement" category although I am expecting some sort of good things to come out about Anthony Carter eventually, as misunderstandings and "hurting people accidentally" seems to be a running theme in the comic, but I also recognize the possibility that there may be a twist where Anthony may be a bigger douche then most ever suspected (re: my comments on sacrificing Antimony to resurrect Surma).

That actually did cross my mind, honestly. I have a few options going and that's one of them.

Well, the full-blown Ikari Gendo scenario is worst-case. More realistic: One day he just flips out and yells at her for making her mother die and slaps her around. Possibly just for looking like Surma one morning. Then he runs off somewhere and leaves everyone to deal with the consequences. Slightly worse but nearly as impossible as case Gendo since Mr. Siddell said something about not having real violence in the comic: The yelling about her mother as before, plus slashes her face with scalpel.

[Vilthuril]

Time to go on strike. If that doesn't work, move to the Forest. And no, I don't even buy any of the speculation that Anthony is actually just doing this whole nasty, soulless, abusive hardass act toward Annie, Kat, and to judge by their faces when leaving the room everyone else in the class, with the intent of throwing in a "No, not really, if you agree to..." at the end. If he was, it would still be cretinous and absolutely wrong, but I don't think it fits with what we know about him. When did he ever in his entire life, so far as we know/have seen from various memories, actually treat anyone except Surma with even a hint of human feeling or consideration? Sure, Surma said to Antimony that her father still loved her, after he gave Antimony the glare of death and childishly snubbed her. Then again, one of the most definite things we know about Surma herself is that she was quite capable of being a manipulative liar, specifically about issues of love. Right, Reynardine? (It occurred to me thinking about that incident that at the time she agreed, or was part of the planning and decision, to lie to Reynardine about loving him in order to trap him in the Court in case he became a threat later...he wasn't a threat. He only became a threat and ended up killing someone - not that the killing isn't his fault and only his fault! because it is as he himself recognizes - because of the dirty plot itself.)

[kelantar]

Once again, my problem with this is how it's being done. I'm wondering if this is all just a huge bluff anyway, because in no school I've ever known does one teacher have the power to come in (in either their first year, or coming back after 15 years), review a single students records, override the decisions made by everyone else (who already knew about the cheating and didn't choose to pursue it), and decide to hold a student back after they've already been promoted to the next grade. Even if it is a fitting punishment (and I'm not saying it isn't), it's one that needs to be implemented properly, and not orchestrated by her father.

Mar 30, 2015 7:32:17 GMT Max said:

As surprising as this is, Annie has been shirking accountability for a long time. Not just for cheating, but other stuff as well. And the more and more it builds up, the harsher the consequences will be.

The funny thing is, in that page, she even implies that she wouldn't be getting away with it if she had a parent who would hold her accountable, but that the Court doesn't care, which kind of parallels this whole cheating situation.

Mar 28, 2015 11:32:23 GMT imaginaryfriend said:

[edit]Just joking about Chester, that's for forest weirdos. More likely she'll have to repeat a year or get dropped to dunce courses within the same house.[/edit]

Nice. Cookie for you.

Mar 30, 2015 8:27:47 GMT zimmyzims said:

If we take Jones' word as a cue, the Court's was not going to let her continue. Maybe they hd to contact Anthony and bring him back and let him evaluate the situation (it start's to seem like this is the reason, or at least an important reason, why he is back, which is a little bit disappointing), and this took until the beginning of the year, which caused this inconvenience. Obviously it would have been better to prepare this half a year earlier, but it appears they only reacted to this recently.

I was under the impression that the court had no way of contacting Anthony, though. If he's back, I think it's of his own volition.

Mar 30, 2015 14:30:53 GMT Deepbluediver said:

I didn't think Anthony had any actual fans, merely people who were more willing to tolerate his existence than average.

You'd be surprised.

[edzepp]

Mar 30, 2015 15:34:19 GMT imaginaryfriend said:

Mar 30, 2015 15:26:26 GMT edzepp said:

That actually did cross my mind, honestly. I have a few options going and that's one of them.

Well, the full-blown Ikari Gendo scenario is worst-case. More realistic: One day he just flips out and yells at her for making her mother die and slaps her around. Possibly just for looking like Surma one morning. Then he runs off somewhere and leaves everyone to deal with the consequences. Slightly worse but nearly as impossible as case Gendo since Mr. Siddell said something about not having real violence in the comic: The yelling about her mother as before, plus slashes her face with scalpel.

Honestly, none of my options are very positive either.

[ctso74]

Mar 30, 2015 7:50:16 GMT arf said:

So, Anthony.
- Why raise this at the *start* of the school year?
- How do *you* come to have a say in this matter, anyway?

- At bare minimum, the school would have told hear she was under review. Standard procedure. That's more than courtesy, that's good paperwork and bureaucracy.
- Also, an immediate family member wouldn't be the only point of contact, even if he was a teacher.
The Court has already shown a blind eye to her cheating for their own reasons. I imagine, Tony gave them reasons to pay attention.
That being said, expulsion seems reasonable, let alone being held back. I'm one who thinks Tony has an agenda. However, he could merely be pissed off that his friends let his daughter's education slack off, while he "had matters to attend to".

Mar 30, 2015 8:03:49 GMT heranje said:

Can I just say that I love Kat for (seemingly impulsively) jumping to Annie's defense even though she just found out she's been stealing her work? Like, she might well be angry and there might well be a confrontation about it later, but even with that her first, instinctive priority is defending her friend.

Kat4life

For some reason, I imagined an older edgier Paz having "Kat4Life" tattooed on her knuckles. I laughed.

[dawolf]

Positing that Anthony is going to rescind the punishment in return for Antimony doing something in return, I don't think it'll directly be extra studies (although that'll be the excuse). I think he could demand that she gives up being the Forest medium, arguing that she needs that time to study (as I suspect he hates the non-court side).

Regardless, in all of this he's still acting like a heartless monster and not a father at all, and I'm amazed to see any comments above that what he's doing is in any way reasonable. What right does he have to express his disappointment in his daughter, when he has been an absentee father for the entire time she's been at the school?

[chrisjenl]

Before she need to do the class again I want she to do a test if fall she need to do the class again if not the now what she need. I always Annie if she can do her school work but she go for the easy way.

[mordekai]

My prediction: Annie not only is going to be made to repeat a year, she's going to be sent to Foley, to isolate her from Kat and her other friends, and also so Anthony doesn't have to ever be near her, and also because that's where half-elemental freaks like her belong to...

Of course that will go spectacularly wrong for the Court when pissed Annie interacts with all the spies Coyote has sent into the Court...

Also, Annie will be with Shadow, Red, Blue and Jackalope...

[Jelly Jellybean]

Mar 30, 2015 13:17:29 GMT kalechibki said:

Mar 30, 2015 11:40:18 GMT Jelly Jellybean said:

Kat and Paz have been open with their relationship.  I have no doubt that the Court (or at least Anthony) would threaten to separate them.  Might even do it as an example to others.

I don't see this as an option for a Kat punishment. We really haven't seen any homophobic back lash against KazPat. It would feel really jarring - and I mean more jarring to me than Anthony trying to push Antimony down a grade - if this was suddenly introduced. I also don't believe that Kat and Paz, for all their wonderfulness, would be quite so open IF the court was homophobic to the degree that it would take for them to try and force this relationship issue.

Also - as a wonderful Blue Genie once pointed out - even cosmic power can't force love (or hate!).

i am not suggesting that Anthony or the Court would threaten to seperate Kat and Paz for homophobic reasons. The relationship is something Kat would want keep, and Annie would not want to jeopardize, so it could be used as leverage against both of them. A normal person should realize that this would be a risky play that could alienate all involved. I am not sure if Anthony is capable of understanding that, or caring even if he does understand.

[Jelly Jellybean]

Mar 30, 2015 16:22:13 GMT dawolf said:

Positing that Anthony is going to rescind the punishment in return for Antimony doing something in return, I don't think it'll directly be extra studies (although that'll be the excuse). I think he could demand that she gives up being the Forest medium, arguing that she needs that time to study (as I suspect he hates the non-court side).

Regardless, in all of this he's still acting like a heartless monster and not a father at all, and I'm amazed to see any comments above that what he's doing is in any way reasonable. What right does he have to express his disappointment in his daughter, when he has been an absentee father for the entire time she's been at the school?

Maybe he will insist that Annie submits to an elementalobotomy. In which case I hope Kat yells "Don't do it, we'll meet again when we're 18 and out of this damned school."

[psibakaonna]

If memory serves, year 9 was SAT year. SATs being, in the UK, when students have to sit exams in Maths, English and Science to assess what progress they've made in the past three years. If Annie's progress in her studies was entirely down to cheating then she never would have passed those exams and she would have been confronted about her dismal grades at the end of the school year, assuming that the Court takes their responsibilities as educators seriously. (Unless of course she was using her blinker stone to spy on other kid's papers but as we never saw that then that's left to speculation)

The fact that this is - as far as we know - the first Annie's heard of her poor performance then we can assume one of two things.
1) She's absorbed enough over the past few years to earn a passing grade for herself but cheats more than she needs to out of habit, peaking at Kat's book as it's easier/quicker than figuring out the problem for herself
or
2) Tony was over zealous in his assessment of Annie's work and attributed parts as cheating even when Annie had in fact managed to work out the correct answer for herself.

The fact is that we don't know the full extent of Annie's cheating and neither does Tony really. Annie should at least be allowed to take a retest just to prove how much knowledge she actually attained over the last year or so, preferably while an examiner/teacher who isn't her (prejudiced) father holds onto her blinker stone so that they can know for sure that she isn't psychicly looking up the answers. That's my assessment, anyway.

Annie is an intelligent young woman. Assuming that because we've known her to cheat a handful of times it means that she was cheating 100% of the time doing her a disservice.

[Eisenblume]

I want him to die.

[Sadie]

Maybe someone mentioned this in the previous discussion pages, but I keep thinking about "The Apple" as referring to the one that "doesn't fall far from the tree", which means there's some sort of duality to be found or revealed regarding Annie, this situation, and her parents. I'm hoping it's with her father, as a contrast to all the existing dualities between her and Surma.

ANYWAY

It's interesting that Annie grew up almost completely isolated and the first thing her dad does after showing up out of the blue is start isolating her again.

[stef1987]

next page, Annie wakes up;
it was all just a bad dream.


...
right?

[atteSmythe]

Changes nothing. Well, for the story, etc., of course it's huge, but not regarding Mr. Carver.

He is, as always, technically correct. And he has, as he has this whole chapter, implemented his policy in the about the worst way possible. He remains at ultimate fault here for being the adult in the relationship and having failed to be a father for the last two years. Moreover, failing to appoint a guardian in his absence.

Antimony may be repeating a grade, but if this story were happening anywhere with a functioning government, Anthony would be imprisoned for child neglect.