Translating Gunnerkrigg Court (Update: Jun 29)

[Señor Goose]

Depending on how I feel tonight, (right now it's a "Meh", but if I keep listening to old German pop songs I may go up to an "Alright!"), I'll probably start installing korba's translations. Be patient and please correct me if I beefed something!

[Señor Goose]

Before I do this, could anyone give me a crash course in how to download whole chapters at a time? There was a thread earlier, but coding is a foreign language to me. Could anyone explain to me like I'm five how to run that?

[Señor Goose]

Hmm, bit of a roadbump: I don't think Ale & Wenches supports umlauts and so forth. Does anyone mind if I use "ae", "oe", and "ue" instead?

[Señor Goose]

Holy crap, would you look at the time! I should be in bed.

[Deleted]

For various reasons, I think it's best if you only prepare a few test pages, not least because the translations are pretty much still subject to change any time. Besides, before publicly using Tom's imagery on such a large scale as entire chapters, he really should be asked for permission. The Word documents are a different matter, since they're raw translated text and useless without looking at the comic itself.

I really would not use AE, OE or UE. I'd rather change the font. There must be several Uncial or Gaelic scripts available that have umlauts and such.

I should probably edit my first post to include links to the documents, since the thread is starting to grow long.

[fish]

You could also write two full stops and move them above the a, o and u. The full stops should be of a smaller font size though.

[Deleted]

That still leaves a ß-shaped problem.

I'm also not sure if Ale and Wenches fits inside all the speech balloons and such, what with German words being longer on average.

[hnau]

Feb 12, 2014 17:54:39 GMT @korba said:

Feb 12, 2014 12:08:49 GMT hnau said:

[Book: FOLGENREICHE DINGE] [so z.B. Chemie] - "wie z.B. Chemie" ("so" is a bit archaic)

Really? I hear »so zum Beispiel« all the time, in the sense of »for instance«, but rarely come across »wie zum Beispiel« outside of writing.

Hm. Maybe regional, again.

Sollte man die vor dem Essen nicht lieber putzen? - "... waschen". "Putzen" tends to imply more work, e.g. cutting off foul parts, sorting out moldy berries, etc.

This line has been changed to »Sollte man die nicht vor dem Essen lieber abwaschen?«.

"Abwaschen" is not wrong, but I think that "waschen" is much more common with respect to fruit and vegetables. "Abwaschen" tends to imply visible dirt, e.g. on tableware.

ich sei verletzt worden - "dass ich mich verletzt hatte". "Sei" implies hearsay, Annie has personal knowledge.

The first conjunctive doesn't really imply hearsay as much as your suggestion stresses that the reported event is a known fact. I'll consider it, though. Edit: I opted for neither and employed a shorter noun phrase with a stronger verb.

wie man ihn erreichen könnte - "könne"

The irrealis is correctly used to express both Annie's doubt and the reported impossibility of reaching Anthony.

You are rigth, but something was bothering me with these sentences... I like the new version.

(EDIT) "O Gott, (bitte) lass mich sterben!", or "... lass mich im Erdboden versinken!"

I'm not sold on these two. I've considered the latter myself, but found it unconvincing.

"Strike down" is biblical (e.g. Exodus 12:29), but the German translations are not as distinctive ("schlagen", "töten").

I've actually heard somebody (jokingly) saying the 1st one.
The 2nd one is derived from "vor Scham im Erdboden versinken" (there *might* be a connection to Numbers 16:32).

[hnau]

Feb 13, 2014 11:48:08 GMT @korba said:

I really would not use AE, OE or UE.

I agree.

I'd rather change the font. There must be several Uncial or Gaelic scripts available that have umlauts and such.

I think that was already discussed somewhere on the forum, maybe in the "I saw an opportunity" thread.

EDIT: found something.

[Deleted]

I deleted »so« before »z.B.«, and replaced »abwaschen« with »säubern« in Annie's line about the cherries. Does that fit?

As for Renard, his line translates to »Oh Herr, streck mich nieder!«, but unlike the English equivalent, that doesn't sound natural to me. I think »Oh, Himmel und Wolkenbruch!« manages to carry over the notion of being struck down by overwhelming force. I'm not exactly versed in the Bible, though, and didn't know about the allusion, so that's something to consider.

Even though a phrase may be technically correct, it can still sound bothersome — therefore, it's great that you pointed out the dodgy conjunctives. Thank you again.

[Deleted]

Attenzione! Midway through translating Chapter Eight, I came across the first mention of a blinker stone in the comic. Since this is a very special item, I've compiled a list of possible translations. Feel free to discuss them, because that's why I'm posting them ahead of time.

• Blinkerstein — obviously the most direct translation.
• Ätherstein — meaning »ether stone«, alluding to the German word for »gemstone« (Edelstein).
• Flimmerstein — meaning »flicker stone«; »flimmern« being another possible translation of »to blink«, indicating a rather unsteady, ethereal light.
• Klinker — a portmanteau of »blinken« and a tongue-in-cheek word for »prized gemstone«, »Klunker«, which also refers to »sich [in den Äther] einklinken« (to latch oneself onto/to jump into [the ether]) and its antonym »ausklinken«. This is a personal favourite. Edit: »Klinker« also translates to »clinker brick«.
• Blinzelstein — translating »to blink« in the sense of »to blink one's eye«. This one carries a somewhat clandestine connotation.
• Blinklichtstein — »blink-light-stone«, a variation on »blinker stone« using a near-synonym.
• Blinkfeuerstein — »blink-fire-stone«, in the sense of »blinker beacon stone«, also alluding to »Feuerstein« (flintstone, lit. »fire-stone«).
• Blinkgemme — using a rare Latinate translation of »gem«, always meaning a carved and polished stone.

If you have a different suggestion, I'd naturally like to hear about that as well.

[GK Sierra]

Most direct translation is always best, IMO.

[Deleted]

It's my current choice as well, but the German word »Blinker« usually refers to a car's flashing lights and not much else, and the nuance of »blinker« being British slang for »eye« falls completely under the table.

However, the delightful thing about »Blinker« is its second meaning: »luminescent lure used in fishing« (Wikipedia).

Edit: Chapter Eight is almost finished. I'll get the bonus page done tomorrow.

[hnau]

Feb 13, 2014 13:46:26 GMT @korba said:

I ... replaced »abwaschen« with »säubern« in Annie's line about the cherries. Does that fit?

Again, it's not wrong, but with fuit and vegetables, it often implies removing visible dirt, sometimes even using a brush. These are cherries, fresh from the tree. You just use water, and that's "waschen".

As for Renard, his line translates to »Oh Herr, streck mich nieder!«, but unlike the English equivalent, that doesn't sound natural to me. I think »Oh, Himmel und Wolkenbruch!« manages to carry over the notion of being struck down by overwhelming force. I'm not exactly versed in the Bible, though, and didn't know about the allusion, so that's something to consider.

Well, at "Himmel und Wolkenbruch" you seek shelter, or you'll get soaking wet - it's inconvenient, but you won't die. It's more of an exclamation, or weak swearing. In the books of Moses, "to strike down" usually results in death. "Strike me down" is a death wish.

[hnau]

Blinker stone:

Leuchtstein? because of its two functions: to give light (or a signal), and to show the ether world (fig. illumination).


Some comments on your suggestions:

Flimmerstein - flimmern is weak light, the blinker stone can be quite spectacular. Or is it just focussing Annie's fire talent? Something to look at and to look through?

Klinker - too much confusion with clinker brick


I don't know yet which one I like best.

[rasamune]

Feb 9, 2014 20:07:44 GMT Covalent said:

Here's my attempt at translating the title and a few of the chapter names.

ガンナークリッグ・コート

第一章：　ロボットと影

第二章：　校庭の神話

第三章：　レーナディーン (Don't quote me on this one.)

第四章：　とても怖くない

第五章：　二人の変な女の子

I wish someone could check my accuracy on these..

Not a native speaker, only studied it for a damn long time, but these look mostly good to me. Only thing is that #4 should be あまり怖くない instead of とても…; and I'm not sure whether 女の子 or 少女 would be better for #5.

It embarrasses me a bit to say that I've spent plenty of idle moments thinking about how to translate certain parts of this comic into Japanese. I'll post a couple of my thoughts if you're okay w/ me stealing some of your thunder

edit: Actually, looking at it again, I have my doubts about #2 as well. Trouble is "Schoolyard Myths" is a play on words, and it'd take a bit of work to come up with a good Japanese phrase that can approximate it.

[Deleted]

Feb 13, 2014 21:42:02 GMT hnau said:

Again, it's not wrong, but with fuit and vegetables, it often implies removing visible dirt, sometimes even using a brush. These are cherries, fresh from the tree. You just use water, and that's "waschen".

Then it is settled.

Well, at "Himmel und Wolkenbruch" you seek shelter, or you'll get soaking wet - it's inconvenient, but you won't die. It's more of an exclamation, or weak swearing. In the books of Moses, "to strike down" usually results in death. "Strike me down" is a death wish.

Point taken, but I'm still not sure how to make that sound right in German. »Himmel und Wolkenbruch« segues quite smoothly from Renard's previous line, whereas »Oh Gott, lass mich sterben!« seems a bit forced. I'd like to employ one of those hokey curses that mostly fell out of use, such as »Blitz und Donnerkeil!«, if it could also convey the hyperbolic death wish.

Leuchtstein? because of its two functions: to give light (or a signal), and to show the ether world (fig. illumination).

Possibly. That construction has a well-known precedent in »Leuchtturm«, and therefore seems quite plausible. The problem is that »blinker« is translated rather loosely here.

Flimmerstein - flimmern is weak light, the blinker stone can be quite spectacular. Or is it just focussing Annie's fire talent? Something to look at and to look through?

Yes, the stone is used as a lens through which one's imagination is projected onto the ether. This nuance is lost in the direct translation: »blinker stone« hints at blinking eyes, while »Blinkerstein« does not, since German eyes do not usually »blink«. — »Glimmerstein« (gleamstone/glimmering stone) seems to suffer from the same problem. »Flackerstein« (flicker stone / flare stone), perhaps?

Klinker - too much confusion with clinker brick

Another reason why I like »Klinker« is the superficial similarity to French »cliquer«, meaning »to blink«. I kind of wish the clinker brick was named differently in German, but then again they were named after the sound they make when slammed against each other, and that's just hardcore. I can't argue with that.

The comedy option is »Burnstein«, but somehow I doubt I'll settle on that one.

[Covalent]

Feb 13, 2014 23:38:39 GMT rasamune said:

Feb 9, 2014 20:07:44 GMT Covalent said:

Here's my attempt at translating the title and a few of the chapter names.

ガンナークリッグ・コート

第一章：　ロボットと影

第二章：　校庭の神話

第三章：　レーナディーン (Don't quote me on this one.)

第四章：　とても怖くない

第五章：　二人の変な女の子

I wish someone could check my accuracy on these..

Not a native speaker, only studied it for a damn long time, but these look mostly good to me. Only thing is that #4 should be あまり怖くない instead of とても…; and I'm not sure whether 女の子 or 少女 would be better for #5.

It embarrasses me a bit to say that I've spent plenty of idle moments thinking about how to translate certain parts of this comic into Japanese. I'll post a couple of my thoughts if you're okay w/ me stealing some of your thunder

edit: Actually, looking at it again, I have my doubts about #2 as well. Trouble is "Schoolyard Myths" is a play on words, and it'd take a bit of work to come up with a good Japanese phrase that can approximate it.

You're right: あまり works way better. I opted for something too literal, there, haha. Does 少女 have a different connotation or something? And sure, go ahead; I could use all the conversation I can get, as I'm also studying Japanese. xD Sorry for my general inexperience. I don't even know if I could do dialogue at all at this point.

[Señor Goose]

Feb 13, 2014 16:26:04 GMT @korba said:

Ätherstein — meaning »ether stone«, alluding to the German word for »gemstone« (Edelstein).

I participated in the old thread and I came up with either 'Ätherstein' or 'Ätherkristall'.

The way I see it, it doesn't need to be a literal translation; it's a stone (or crystal) that interacts with the Ether. Why go crazy?

Anyway, did we decide on a font, or am I going to write this in Swiss German?

[hnau]

Feb 13, 2014 23:41:51 GMT @korba said:

Well, at "Himmel und Wolkenbruch" you seek shelter, or you'll get soaking wet - it's inconvenient, but you won't die. It's more of an exclamation, or weak swearing. In the books of Moses, "to strike down" usually results in death. "Strike me down" is a death wish.

Point taken, but I'm still not sure how to make that sound right in German. »Himmel und Wolkenbruch« segues quite smoothly from Renard's previous line, whereas »Oh Gott, lass mich sterben!« seems a bit forced. I'd like to employ one of those hokey curses that mostly fell out of use, such as »Blitz und Donnerkeil!«, if it could also convey the hyperbolic death wish.

I would like to preserve a biblical reference, but not even Luther in his 1545 translation has strong words.

Nowadays, "O Gott" / "Oh Gott" / "Oh mein Gott!" or somtimes just "Gott!" is not necessarily the invocation of a deity but more of an exclamation.

As I understand "Strike me down", it would be an act of mercy, with death preferable to the shame of being caught playing with dolls. "Im Erdboden versinken" carries that subtext even more than just "sterben".

Slightly modernized, Renard could say: "(Oh (mein)) Gott! Ich will im Erdboden versinken!".

[hnau]

Nenn mich Anja, und das hier ist Donald - that usually implies "duzen" instead of "siezen", but Annie might continue to use "sie", being not comfortable with duzing (neologisming?) her teachers. If she does so, when do you plan to let her switch to "du"?
As Annie is quick to make friends with all kinds of creatures, is she also quick to use "du"? Or is she too literate and polite?


[102]
Außerdem wollten wir dir dies zeigen. - "... das/dies hier zeigen"

[103]
Er hat sich augenscheinlich nicht verändert. - "Offensichtlich hat er sich nicht ver/geändert." is more on the point.

[104]
Aber wenn Anthony verschwinden will, dann tut er das. - better: "... tut er das auch."

um deine Versorgung sicherzustellen - alternative: "dass du in allen Dingen gut versorgt bist."

Du brauchst dir keine Sorgen zu machen - to omit repetition: "Du brauchst dir da keine Gedanken zu machen" / "Du musst dir da(rüber) keine Gedanken machen"

[105]
Wenn es Ihnen nichts ausmacht, habe ich auch etwas für Sie, dass Sie wohl sehen sollten. - "das" instead of "dass". Also, this is rather longish...

[106]
Wenn ich Augäpfel hätte, das verspreche ich euch - "das sage ich euch" (EDIT: "versprechen" is possible, too, but it makes me think of "if I ever get real eyes, I promise, I will roll them now?")

[107]
Antimony sollte die Gewalt über sein Handeln ausüben. - "sollte jetzt" or "müsste jetzt"

Aber ich hätte nicht geahnt - or "gedacht"?

(to be continued)

[crater]

the parts of this thread I can read are fascinating, I wish I could translate something with my own flavor of local colloquialisms. Oh my god I can

Page 2 of GKC

Panel 1: Gunnerkrigg Court is a shit looking school that's more like a factory or something
Panel 2: during the first few weeks of school some weird shit started going down
Panel 3: the weirdest thing was that I was dropping two shadows like mad

[GK Sierra]

Oh! Allow me to translate the first page into LA-speak!

Panel 1: Dude, I got sent to this rehab place called GKC- it looks like La Puente
Panel 2: Check this though, even though I was clean I was still seeing off-the-wall shit
Panel 3: Now I got, like, this extra shadow mofo following me around- I'm straight trippin' dog, tell my mom to come get me, this is wack bro!!!

[Georgie L]

Feb 13, 2014 16:48:09 GMT GK Sierra said:

Most direct translation is always best, IMO.

Not always, you want to translate meaning more than the direct words after all.

especially with idioms and invented terms, you can sometimes come out with nonsense otherwise if the idiom or term is meaningless in the translated language.

I'd say the one which is closest in terms of connotations and meaning whilst also sounding cool is best.

My personal favourites are the blink gem, klinker and aether stone ones personally, but that's preference.

[hnau]

A culture of translating

Once, the was an active translation community at UserFriendly. They even translated into several German dialects. Here's an example. Search for a thread titled "Translations" near the bottom of the page; here's a link to that thread, without the comic.

The question is: can we create a similar culture here at GC, and how can it be integrated into the current site/forum structure?

[Daedalus]

I formally move to place this all within the now vacated 'fan project' board. It would make organization easier and we could even work with a different thread for German, Japanese, Spanish, etc.

Thought?

[Señor Goose]

Feb 15, 2014 3:48:37 GMT Daedalus said:

I formally move to place this all within the now vacated 'fan project' board. It would make organization easier and we could even work with a different thread for German, Japanese, Spanish, etc.

Thought?

I was going to suggest that, a different thread for each language and so forth, but it seems like it might be a better idea to put that in the Fan Progect board. This is a fan project anyway, isn't it?

Anyway, this is my formal support!

[Daedalus]

Feb 15, 2014 4:23:01 GMT Señor Goose said:

Feb 15, 2014 3:48:37 GMT Daedalus said:

I formally move to place this all within the now vacated 'fan project' board. It would make organization easier and we could even work with a different thread for German, Japanese, Spanish, etc.

Thought?

I was going to suggest that, a different thread for each language and so forth, but it seems like it might be a better idea to put that in the Fan Progect board. This is a fan project anyway, isn't it?

Anyway, this is my formal support!

Cool if more than half the people associated with translation agree I'll make a thread over there

[Covalent]

I guess I could try to translate some nouns, too.. like maybe "blinker stone" could be 瞬き石 (literally, "blink stone").

[Daedalus]

Feb 15, 2014 4:56:10 GMT Covalent said:

I guess I could try to translate some nouns, too.. like maybe "blinker stone" could be 瞬き石 (literally, "blink stone").

Btw while you're here, what's your thought re: moving to the other board?