[1290] I'd totally date a girl...

[lit]

You need to be able to respect your partner. Everybody has different strengths, and there are even different types of intelligence. Some combinations are more compatible than others. If your partner has strengths that you value, that can outweigh whatever weaknesses you think they have in looks or intelligence. But not always. And that's okay.

I think it's often important to be able to feel you understand your partner and that your partner understands you. But this can't always happen between two people who comprehend things very differently.

[yarksie]

To be a bit more serious. Annie is so unaware of social norms that I don't even think she even knows what homophobia is. I kind of could guess this from her conversation with Jack about Zimmy and Gamma, the two of them likely being together, off the top of my head I cant think what page that is but anyway. Annie's main concern being friendship is kinda sad, she's such a lonely girl, it did get sorted right now in this chapter and not a later chapter which is good. Awesome page.

[polioman]

Dec 19, 2013 7:09:06 GMT King Mir said:

Dec 18, 2013 13:35:07 GMT polioman said:

I agree, it felt more like I was reading something that actually happened than a story, especially considering that real life is almost never as dramatic as fiction.

I'm also just vaguely annoyed that this whole thing was built up so much only for this to be the resolution.  But whatever, it's consistent with the characters, so I'll take it and hope we get something more dramatic next time around.

Drama's borring when it's predictable. I like the resolution the way it is.

Good point, I am glad that Tom's keeping us guessing and generally not falling into cliches.

[zimmyzims]

Dec 19, 2013 23:30:11 GMT rumblettt said:

Dec 19, 2013 22:33:21 GMT zimmyzims said:

I think, what she means is basically that dating a person who is utterly dumb or cannot keep up a reasonable conversation may be dull or even a total pain in the neck. It's not "I can't date you, because you're not smart enough", but "you're so dumb, I can't stand your company". It's unfair to call it shallow. Where the presupposition that we should date anybody comes from? It's utterly okay that we prefer to date people who we want to be with, and not to date those whose company we don't enjoy. For many people, intelligence is not a little matter when they choose who they want to pass their lives with.

So you're saying everyone with low intelligence has a terrible personality and is an undesirable mate?

No, I'm not. I'm precisely saying that this is not an issue of "oh, I can't date her if she has low intelligence". I would totally date a dumb girl if she was super hot. Now that I think of it, shame on me, I have done that a few times. But I see no reason why I precisely should date someone if I do not want to. And I can confess that quite often I would not want to date someone so utterly dumb that she cannot keep up a reasonable conversation at all, unless we have an extremely non-platonic concept of "date" and I would have enough of my own time to satisfy my other needs elsewhere. This is not inconceivable, I know many people do this, but personally I am such a romantic egalitarian that I find this kind of relationship a bit disturbing.

That is also not to say that nobody would want a mate with low intelligence. Many people care little about intelligence. For example, have you noticed how well sport stars and models get together? I think those are great pairings, as both sides get what they're looking for, and quite often you can tell that it is not intelligence (again, no offense meant, to each his own). You don't have to look for intelligence in your mate, but there are quite many who do, and if they appreciate intelligence in their mate, then it is unfair to say that they're just shallow if they don't want to date someone who is dumb.

It is everybody's right to dump a date and I don't quite understand why some people make such a big deal of it. What I do find annoying is instead this thinking that "since I have quality x, people I'm interested in should date me and they are unfair, shallow or stupid because they don't". That quality x can be intelligence, or it can be "nice personality", or it can be "wealth" or it can be "beauty", pick one that you like. But whatever it is, it establishes no right to dates that would positively oblige other people to date a given person with that quality.

And now I find annoying that I started this whole discussion with that stupid comment I posted just for laughs.

[zimmyzims]

Dec 19, 2013 22:59:27 GMT zimmyhoo said:

[boxbot]heeeello zimmyzims, your av text and first part of your sig taken together are very confusingly funny![/boxbot]

Thanks for the note, 'hoobot, I've been considering changing the signature but now I think I'll keep it yet for a while. I kind of like it better now.

[keef]

Dec 20, 2013 10:35:48 GMT zimmyzims said:

And now I find annoying that I started this whole discussion with that stupid comment I posted just for laughs.

Topics like these can easily make you susceptible to Foot in Mouth disease.

[thedoctor]

This thread definitely went into a very entertaining (and well-thought-through) discussion!

[zimmyzims]

Dec 19, 2013 22:59:53 GMT stef1987 said:

Dec 19, 2013 22:33:21 GMT zimmyzims said:

I think, what she means is basically that dating a person who is utterly dumb or cannot keep up a reasonable conversation may be dull or even a total pain in the neck. It's not "I can't date you, because you're not smart enough", but "you're so dumb, I can't stand your company". It's unfair to call it shallow. Where the presupposition that we should date anybody comes from? It's utterly okay that we prefer to date people who we want to be with, and not to date those whose company we don't enjoy. For many people, intelligence is not a little matter when they choose who they want to pass their lives with.

yeah, sorry, I wasn't talking about zimmyzims post alone, It's more that I hear a lot of people lately act like what I tried to describe.
(And I don't mean to call zimmyzims shallow)
I recently heard a couple of girls describe how they (quite crudely and abruptly) dumped there boyfriends, not because they weren't nice, fun or understanding, but because they weren't smart enough. And I just don't understand the high value of intelligence, they acted like it gave them the right to dump their boyfriends in the meanest way, as if they had cheated on them or something.
And I just hear a lot of people talking and acting as if "beeing able to have an intelligent conversation" is the main important factor in a relationship.
And I just don't get that.


(Wow, that's a lot off "And I just", I really need to work on my sentence structuring, or I should just go to bed)

Just a note: I think you mean eyemyself when you say zimmyzims.

Another note: people can be in relationships for reasons such as guaranteeing them high standard of living in future. Often, being with a successfully smart person can do that, if you can hook him/her up for good. Sounds a bit cynical, I know, but it happens, in fact I'd punt that this represents the largest single portion of marriages in history, and I'm not a one to judge it if that's someone's motive to date people. Probably he/she will also provide something of interest to that relationship and it can turn out really good for both. It doesn't have to be romantic for everybody.

Yet another note: maybe you don't understand the high value of intelligence because you're stupid? Just kidding I didn't mean to be mean, I just had to say that, your words forced me. Literally, they came into my room and held a gun to my head. You won't believe it, but it's true.

[eyemyself]

Dec 19, 2013 21:58:36 GMT stef1987 said:

I just realised;
Annie is technically saying she thinks Paz is super hot.

Dec 19, 2013 21:12:20 GMT eyemyself said:

Deep down who wouldn't date a super hot girl? As long as she can carry on a reasonably intelligent conversation, that is.

Not to sound like an ass or douche (or similar), but I never get why basing your love on intelligence is considered correct/mature, while basing it on attractiveness is considered shallow.
I find it to be a least as shallow, if not more, to reject people because they're not smart enough, than to reject because they're not pretty enough.
(No offense meant, a lot of people say what you said, and I've just been wanting to say this for a while)

(also, sorry for the lousy english, I'm tired)

Wow, that is a surprisingly presumptive and defensive comment in response to a relatively flip and playful comment.

Let me be clear about one thing up front. No one should ever be shamed or ridiculed for liking who they like for whatever reasons they like the person or people in questions. 

Different people like different things. I have no judgement for the criteria by which other people select mates, that is their business and more power to them if they know what makes them happy and have the where with all to find it. It to me a long time to figure out what qualities in a mate make me happy. Intelligence, specifically cleverness and inquisitiveness about the world, are things I place a premium on and find incredibly sexy. (Have the ability to keep up with my wordplay and match me quip for quip during a conversation?  OH MY GOD I CAN'T EVEN... soooo sexy.)

Some people are only attracted to one gender presentation. Some, like me, don't really care much about that. Both are ok.

Some people are only attracted to a very narrow set of physical characteristics, and that is ok, too.

Here is the thing about attraction... you don't really pick what you are attracted to, it just sort of happens and you discover it along the way.

And here is the thing about dating and getting romantically involved with people: you can be as picky as you want to be about who you want to be intimate with and share your life with. It is your life, and your happiness. So intelligence isn't something you place a premium on in potential mates, that's fine, I'm sure there are characteristics you do place a premium on and look for and that is cool. For me, big brains matter, a lot, and if I try to ignore that fact I am just going to make myself and whoever I try dating who doesn't have that characteristic miserable. 

[eyemyself]

Dec 20, 2013 4:07:22 GMT lit said:

You need to be able to respect your partner. Everybody has different strengths, and there are even different types of intelligence. Some combinations are more compatible than others. If your partner has strengths that you value, that can outweigh whatever weaknesses you think they have in looks or intelligence. But not always. And that's okay.

I think it's often important to be able to feel you understand your partner and that your partner understands you. But this can't always happen between two people who comprehend things very differently.

I cannot even begin to express how much I agree with lit said.