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Post by scaramousche on Feb 2, 2011 11:23:29 GMT
The top one isn't Antimony's: it's his own, first seen in the chapter Reynardine. Hm, Thanks, now I see this) To wrap it up, it's the symbol for mercury and it marks his Coyote-granted power to take over bodies. So, how long do you think it's going to be until the third book is out?
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Post by jasmijn on Feb 2, 2011 11:33:18 GMT
Mucho interesting. How can you see that? I really can't.
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Post by King Mir on Feb 2, 2011 12:04:46 GMT
Hmm... There's also the shadow of the Court on Renard that's a parallel to Ysengrin turning into trees. I didn't think that was a symbol. But if you think it is, then it does belong on the list. That symbol at the top in the sky looks a lot like the sky symbol used to arrange meetings between forest and court. Good catch. I didn't notice this.
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Post by King Mir on Feb 2, 2011 12:08:58 GMT
Hm, Thanks, now I see this) To wrap it up, it's the symbol for mercury and it marks his Coyote-granted power to take over bodies. I did not realize that. But this page suggests you're right. Amazing that after so many rereads, there are still bits I've missed.
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Post by basser on Feb 2, 2011 12:31:32 GMT
To wrap it up, it's the symbol for mercury and it marks his Coyote-granted power to take over bodies. I did not realize that. But this page suggests you're right. Amazing that after so many rereads, there are still bits I've missed. Mercury is a formless metal that represents change and was thought by alchemists to be the original metal from which all other metals arose, so it makes sense for it's associated power or whatever to be body-switching. Also the ancients thought drinking it would give them eternal life but it actually causes liver failure. Oh those wacky ancients!
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Post by hurston on Feb 2, 2011 12:55:45 GMT
The big symbol at the top looks very much like the winged sun disc seen in egyptian art. In fact the symbol at the top of it (The circle with the dot in the middle) is the sun symbol. The symbol below that is bismuth I assume, but I don't know what the symbol at the bottom is.
I'm wondering at the meaning behind the sun and moon symbols in the topleft and topright both being bisected by vertical lines. Not something I recall seeing before.
Also worth noting is the vines around Annie's arm are in the same place as the band Coyote put around her wrist.
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Feb 2, 2011 13:00:43 GMT
Hmm... There's also the shadow of the Court on Renard that's a parallel to Ysengrin turning into trees. I didn't think that was a symbol. But if you think it is, then it does belong on the list. Strictly speaking that shadow isn't a symbol. It's not an independent object. On the other hand the shadow is coloring Renard the same shade as the Court* and it appears to have a parallel with Ysengrin, so I think there's a good case to be made for its inclusion because it's symbolic. *Assuming my monitor's settings don't need an adjustment.
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Post by zylonbane on Feb 2, 2011 13:11:19 GMT
Great touch with Ysengrin's missing ear still being etherically present.
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coma
New Member
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Post by coma on Feb 2, 2011 13:23:03 GMT
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Post by todd on Feb 2, 2011 13:23:46 GMT
And it looks like we'll be seeing ol' white legs again! Not necessarily. Judging from the treatises so far, they appear to be summaries of the chapters preceding them, rather than predictions of future chapters.
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Post by paxjax123 on Feb 2, 2011 13:33:07 GMT
Wow, absolutely stunning. I am now a happy morning!Pax.
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Post by origori on Feb 2, 2011 14:03:27 GMT
Beautiful page.
Something I noticed, but might not mean anything: Annie and Kat are facing away from each other, and are separated by the sword.
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Post by Yin on Feb 2, 2011 14:28:25 GMT
I'm curious, why are the sun and the moon both divided in two?
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Post by Nicer Atom on Feb 2, 2011 14:49:39 GMT
First of all, I'd like to ask people who managed to stay in the ustream longer than me to come over and tell us what Tom may have told you. Things like the fact that the pigeons represent Parley and Smitty (pretty obvious when someone points it out, eh?) Yeah, Tom pointed that out quite some time ago.
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Post by alliek on Feb 2, 2011 14:51:19 GMT
Beautiful page Also worth noting is the vines around Annie's arm are in the same place as the band Coyote put around her wrist. Thats a really interesting one. So it shows how the band is binding her to the forest.
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Post by aaroncampbell on Feb 2, 2011 14:51:51 GMT
Lets make a list: Moon over the court, Sun over the forest both have a vertical line through the center Night over the court, day over the forest. Bismuth symbol in between antimony and sol/gold, linked by a ring The set of symbols have wings Rey, who caries both the antimony symbol and his own. Yesengrin, who's missing ear has etheric lines, and is growing from the treas. Robot in hoodie Jeane clutching sword green arrow pointing down Kat and Annie with their respective signs next to them Annie looking toward the forest Kat looking toward the court The court is crumbling stone on top of mainframes the forest is trees Robots staring at Kat Annie has the coyote tooth Kat has her apron and tools Annie has a summer dress Kat holds pigeons Annie holds Zimmy's spider. Coyote is a rather minor actor symmetrical to the robots Annie is tied by vines to the forest, particularly at her wrist and arm Kat's arm is tangled in Annie's hair symmetrical to the vines is a gear on the court side Gleaming heart in the middle, with Jeanie's sword stabbing it. heart is on a round background with rays. There are red rays coming from behind the circle Annie's hair turns to fire on the forest side Did I miss anything? Good catch on Coyote's tooth -- I missed that one!
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Post by hanneswall on Feb 2, 2011 15:02:53 GMT
The symbol above the Bismuth is one of the symbols for Gold in Alchemy (it also serves as a symbol for the sun).
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Post by smjjames on Feb 2, 2011 15:27:14 GMT
*DELURKS* Hey everybody, been lurking for quite some time and a fan of Gunnerkrigg as well. Anyways, I'm seeing another detail you guys don't seem to have noticed. There is a Z above coyote's head. This might tie into the earlier statement of Coyote being a minor character, or at least one who is more in the background. However, the Z could mean a sleeping or resting god? Hard to tell whether Coyote actually looks asleep because he has those oval eyes and if you look closely, there is a tiny white line, meaning his eye is there, unlike the previous treatise. Also, the winged symbol sort of looks Egyptian, but I think that is more a design choice by Tom than anything.
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Post by scaramousche on Feb 2, 2011 15:56:58 GMT
There is a Z above coyote's head. Looks to me like tips of leaves protruding from the shadow.
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Post by smjjames on Feb 2, 2011 16:02:26 GMT
There is a Z above coyote's head. Looks to me like tips of leaves protruding from the shadow. Hrm, yea you're probably right. Still, given the way Tom makes things so detailed and the fact that he sometimes hides meaning into the details, it could mean something or it could be nothing more than the edges of leaves.
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shuis112
New Member
whatchu talkin bout Willis
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Post by shuis112 on Feb 2, 2011 16:37:17 GMT
Great analysis and attention to detail thus far. What struck me when I looked at the page (besides the sheer beauty of it) was its emphasis on love.
1. The most obvious: the giant gleaming heart (let's say Jeanne's) which ultimately preserved the divide between the Court and the forest when her love turned to rage. 2. In contrast you have Annie and Kat on two separate sides but still tied to each other (literally) through their love (I mean this in a platonic sense). 3. As msosb pointed out, the lovebirds Parley and Smitty, somewhat of an anomaly on the Court side. 4. And this is my own interpretation but I'd like to think Rey is staring at Annie because either he wants his freedom in the forest OR a win-win: wants to be free in the forest with Annie as he is still tied to her through the symbol and perhaps his concern for her.
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Post by whattheziek on Feb 2, 2011 16:46:54 GMT
Okay, so let's make a list.
Backgrounds:
ON THE COURT SIDE
Night/ Moon Dark purple and blues, with accents of green and red Technology, in the form of gears, robots, tools and what appears to be computer mainframes. Oh, and buildings. Renard - with his spiffy little mercury symbol on his head. Robot - in his hoodie get up Kat
ON THE FOREST SIDE
Day/Sun Light Blues, greens, browns and yellow/red accents Nature, in the form of trees trees bushes and did I mention trees? Ysengrin - with tree legs and a nifty etheric trail from his ear Coyote - Who is very stylized indeed Annie
Characters:
Robot He's looking down, kinda like a surveyor of the scene below/in the foreground. Reminds me oddly of Spiderman/Batman for some reason, must be the whole 'masked watcher' thing. I have a feeling he's staring at Kat in particular.
Reynardine Also an observer, but he looks ready to spring. His gaze appears to be directed at Annie, or the heart. His face is very sleek, and he looks like a blend between fox and wolf.
Coyote Is oddly tiny and super duper stylized. He looks more like a 'drawing' of himself, than himself. I'm putting it down to the lack of black in his colour scheme, which is fine because that's a very dark corner he's emerging from. He also appears to be observing, although what is not easy to tell, 'cos his eye is so dang tiny.
Ysengrin Is scowling. And showing off his awesome tree-bending skills. Nice little show of those etheric crazies, they balance out his skull a bit. He is a lot heavier in build than Rey, and for some reason makes me think of a bear. I'll put it down to the grouchy frown.
Jeanne She's in the middle, the divider. And, as somebody pointed out, left handed. Her sword is driven into the heart and also parallel to the arrow which is suspended in mid-air, seemingly. She's pretty ghostly.
Kat (Ooboy. This is going to be long.) Kat is holding turtledoves/lovebirds. She also has a little cult following of robots behind her. She's also carrying a hammer and a spanner in her apron. We've seen her with a hammer before, but the spanner is new ('A spanner in the works'?) You can also really see the physical differences - Kat has a much wider face, a bigger nose, a broader smile (compared to Annie). I do like the purple highlights in her hair, very cool. Her face is also highlighted blue, like it was in the 3rd treatise. She's wearing a light blue shirt - a reversal of last time when she was wearing green. Her 'masculine' item of clothing this time is a workman's apron. This is pretty funny, aprons by virtue of being aprons are usually thought of as girly. But this one's a manly apron. Her little wiring symbol is also present and as ever, but this time it's directly contrasted to Annie's.
Annie (Mere de dieu, what am I doing.) She is wearing the Coyote tooth. She has a green, sleeveless, josephine/ empire waistline dress. Normally Annie wears empire waistline dresses, which accentuates her juvenile bust. Makes you wonder what it will be like when she... developes. (I swear I'm looking at this from a fashion perspective.) Her arms are bound by vines, obviously her ties to the forest, and her Coyote-bracelet. Her hair is firey, and in the direction of the forest. Now we get it. She also had this in the 3rd treatise. She better watch out with all that flammable stuff around. The other part of her hair is wrapped around Kat's arm, showing her attachment and sort of.. grounding her, I guess? In the 3rd treatise, Kat was holding Annie's hand and leading, and in the second treatise Annie was holding on to Kat. I'm guessing it's going to keep alternating. Her face is much finer, with more detail. Anyone ever notice that she never wears make-up in the treatises? Her eyes are less blue and more grey than usual. That could be because of the firey highlights.. or just me. I dunno. She's holding the Whitelegs too. That's.. not a good thing. But somebody had to, I guess.
THINGS
Kat's Turtledoves. They are adorable. Both a shoutout to baby City Face and the 'lovebirds' Parley and Andrew. Nature in the court, and love and all sorts of warm fuzzy things. Sweet.
Annie's Spider. It's all her dealings with Jack and Zimmy bound into one little white-legged packet. and it's.. IT'S TOUCHING THE LEAVES AAA OHGOD. Maybe Zimmy will go over to the forest? Or something will get loose. That would be a mess.
The Arrow. It's floating and glowing. What a weird thing. Rather ominous really.
The Heart. Oh god, the heart. It's Parley's, yeah. But it could be someone else's too. It's been stabbed by Jeanne's sword - and the blood vessels are growing up it. .. Eek. Very visceral.
Wingdingthing. Gold! Bismuth! Antimony! and wings. Nice. Lots of creative symbolism there. I'm pretty sure that's gold at the top. It's certainly one of the bajillion symbols for gold.
Other: Is it just me, or are the circle things uneven? They look hand-drawn. They probably are.
Aaaaand.. that's it. I'm going to leave it at that. This list took waaaaay too long to type up. Like the better part of three hours.
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Post by smjjames on Feb 2, 2011 17:13:25 GMT
Hasn't Kat always been that way? She has had a wider nose from the start, it's just more contrasted here I guess. Has Anja ever spoken her mother language? I don't think we've ever seen her do so (the fact that she slipped with her english a few times points to english as being a second language). It's hard to tell where Anja is origionally from as she looks asiastic (or maybe it's Toms drawing style of Anja that is making me think that), Russia maybe?
As for the blood vessels, it looks more like they were severed and are just hanging there rather than growing around the sword. Then again, there are two red lines just above the heart which might be arteries, hard to tell for sure.
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Post by aeturnum on Feb 2, 2011 17:23:18 GMT
It's been mentioned before, but I think it's important to consider the character of the whole picture.
Kat is offering a creature to the court. Facing her is Reynardine and Robot, but she is not offering the pigeons to them. Annie is offering a creature to the forest and is being faced by Coyote and Ysengrin. The forest holds Annie and Annie holds kat. The whole picture is divided by Jeanne's sword and the arrow.
I think it's an overall representation of alignments. Kat's future (for now) is in the court while Annie's is in the forest. It's also worth noting that neither girl is lit from "their" side, but rather seem to be catching the light from Jeanne. Jeanne herself is evenly lit - implying that whatever casts light on the forest and shadow on the court does not affect her.
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Post by wanderer on Feb 2, 2011 17:24:01 GMT
My word, Tom, as if we didn't have enough crazy symbolism to try to interpret already!
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Post by Raph on Feb 2, 2011 17:24:16 GMT
I'm thinking the fact both Coyote and the gear (as a symbol for human technology?) are at the same height suggest they both work to their sides in the same fashion, as their sustain.
While Jeanne represents the divide between the Court and the forest, the heart's light represent's all of the pictures light. Maybe Jeanne and her lover also represent one important union between the forest and the Court
And as hurston pointed out before, the fact Annie is holding the whitelegs is the same reason Kat is holding the lovebirds; both sides hold something similar, yet denied(?) by them.
I find curious there are no shadow people, not even Shadow 2.
The vines grabbing Annie's arm are not on the side of the bind. Oh, yes they are... excuse my self.
Annie's eyes are gray, not blue, which I find odd.
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Post by blahzor on Feb 2, 2011 17:43:04 GMT
[/li][li] Ysengrin and Rey seemingly glaring each other down. [/list][/quote] i'd say they are looking down at whatever is emitting the light behind Jeanne (unless it's the heart emitting the light) i'll like to call it now, by the end of the 4th book Kat will finally figure out how to make Robot a new body and it will be massively better then anything Diego made...with some kinks
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Spike
Junior Member
Posts: 67
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Post by Spike on Feb 2, 2011 18:31:40 GMT
Mucho interesting. How can you see that? I really can't. How would you clutch a sword from the pommel?
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Post by beatfox on Feb 2, 2011 18:40:03 GMT
To wrap it up, it's the symbol for mercury and it marks his Coyote-granted power to take over bodies. I did not realize that. But this page suggests you're right. Amazing that after so many rereads, there are still bits I've missed. Yeah, Tom confirmed on his old Formspring that the mercury symbol represents the power Coyote gave him - he doesn't seem to have a symbol of his own. It is easy to miss stuff in a comic this intricate! It's hard to tell where Anja is origionally from as she looks asiastic (or maybe it's Toms drawing style of Anja that is making me think that), Russia maybe? Anja is a Gitano (Romani) from Spain.
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Post by warrl on Feb 2, 2011 18:45:45 GMT
In the fight scene, Jeanne was very definitely fighting right-handed. However it has been previously established that everyone in Gunnerkrigg Court is ambidextrous and uses whichever hand is most convenient for Tom to draw the picture he wants to draw.
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