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Post by netherdan on Apr 22, 2023 2:26:44 GMT
It's a lot of work to carry all the love they have for each other. I'm sure they're just exercising, together, every day, sometimes multiple times a day... Yeah, that's it. Also, I wonder if Loup may be the reason that the "angel" ends up looking the way she does by the end of her journey to godhood. I just hope he doesn't take matters in his own hand and blow up the plane carrying the one who disrespected the Angel... |
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Post by Igniz on Apr 22, 2023 2:58:21 GMT
imaginaryfriend: Exactly what I had in mind. Kat certainly has a similar status/role to Coyote/Loup thanks to her worshipping by the robots, but in this way, the dialogue is more in line with the canon and the characters, and makes more sense. Still, even if this is not a dead goose situation, "Jerrek" reacting like this can also be attributed to him spending so much time with Lana that he has started to share the NP's beliefs and points of view.
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Post by stef1987 on Apr 22, 2023 7:40:35 GMT
I think he sees how the Robots/NewPeople worship her, and believes that this his how he should be treated too perhaps. Or else there is going to be a plotline around whether the body or the mind makes the person, and how the body you are in affects the person you are. Coyote is well established as seeing himself as a greater being, as was ys. Someone that made an entire set of beings to worship them (shadow men) is probably going to see any ehteric being of similar sway as deserving of equal respect. Though I suspect that may change once he knows exactly who The Angel is... Did you forget he already knows Kat? |
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Post by csj on Apr 22, 2023 11:50:25 GMT
Coyote is well established as seeing himself as a greater being, as was ys. Someone that made an entire set of beings to worship them (shadow men) is probably going to see any ehteric being of similar sway as deserving of equal respect. Though I suspect that may change once he knows exactly who The Angel is... Did you forget he already knows Kat? Knowing who Kat is does not necessarily mean Jerrek knows that Kat is The Angel. |
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Post by Geekette on Apr 22, 2023 13:13:36 GMT
Loup's still meant to be pretty omniscience though, unlike Coyote who thought that made things boring.
So, we've known for a long time Coyote has strong feelings about belief shaping the world and godhood, and that belief and divinity seems to be able to be retroactively applied. By that logic: if a god-being like Coyote or Loup believes Kat is a goddess, does that make her one all along?
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Post by blahzor on Apr 22, 2023 15:28:07 GMT
Loup's still meant to be pretty omniscience though, unlike Coyote who thought that made things boring. So, we've known for a long time Coyote has strong feelings about belief shaping the world and godhood, and that belief and divinity seems to be able to be retroactively applied. By that logic: if a god-being like Coyote or Loup believes Kat is a goddess, does that make her one all along? I would think it's not his believe that makes her one but her already/becoming being one is something he just knows now by just knowing certain truths |
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Post by knowit on Apr 22, 2023 15:56:17 GMT
I think the manic swing in opinion on something/someone is very in-character with Loup. His ideals and desires are constantly flip-flopping all over the place, but they're never anything but dramatic
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Post by pyradonis on Apr 22, 2023 18:41:00 GMT
Did you forget he already knows Kat? Knowing who Kat is does not necessarily mean Jerrek knows that Kat is The Angel. He has met Kat several times and has lived among the NP for at least several weeks now, all of whom see Kat as The Angel. |
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Post by liminal on Apr 22, 2023 23:12:27 GMT
Did you forget he already knows Kat? Knowing who Kat is does not necessarily mean Jerrek knows that Kat is The Angel. He does, explicitly, right here. |
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Post by blahzor on Apr 23, 2023 3:34:19 GMT
Knowing who Kat is does not necessarily mean Jerrek knows that Kat is The Angel. He has met Kat several times and has lived among the NP for at least several weeks now, all of whom see Kat as The Angel. Wasn't paying attention, and could argue hasn't ever really looked at her from what we're shown |
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Post by pyradonis on Apr 23, 2023 11:36:49 GMT
He has met Kat several times and has lived among the NP for at least several weeks now, all of whom see Kat as The Angel. Wasn't paying attention, and could argue hasn't ever really looked at her from what we're shown |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Apr 23, 2023 16:44:41 GMT
Remember Smitty's strings that even people who can see into the ether can't see unless they look the exact right way? I think what's going on is that despite being powerful enough, and knowing something about what to look for, Jerroop so far hasn't looked at Kat in quite the right way to figure out what's up with her. He does know something's up, though, so he is counting Kat among the elevated personages who humans (and noomans) should rightly grovel before. That being the case, he sees Paz breaking up with Kat as an outrage. It's yet unclear if Lana knows that "Loup" likely counts himself among the most elevated of elevated personages, because Jerrek by necessity of disguise does not and the differences between Jerrek and "Loup" probably haven't been driven home, but it wouldn't surprise me if in Monday's comic Lana starts to figure out that Lana is in a relationship where abuse can be swiftly justified and that she can't safely exit. Pretty much anything is possible if you know the right people in the Gunnerverse; hopefully Lana can get an introduction to someone who sells plot armor since she desperately needs as much as she can get.  |
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Post by blahzor on Apr 23, 2023 23:14:57 GMT
Remember Smitty's strings that even people who can see into the ether can't see unless they look the exact right way? I think what's going on is that despite being powerful enough, and knowing something about what to look for, Jerroop so far hasn't looked at Kat in quite the right way to figure out what's up with her. He does know something's up, though, so he is counting Kat among the elevated personages who humans (and noomans) should rightly grovel before. That being the case, he sees Paz breaking up with Kat as an outrage. It's yet unclear if Lana knows that "Loup" likely counts himself among the most elevated of elevated personages, because Jerrek by necessity of disguise does not and the differences between Jerrek and "Loup" probably haven't been driven home, but it wouldn't surprise me if in Monday's comic Lana starts to figure out that Lana is in a relationship where abuse can be swiftly justified and that she can't safely exit. Pretty much anything is possible if you know the right people in the Gunnerverse; hopefully Lana can get an introduction to someone who sells plot armor since she desperately needs as much as she can get. View AttachmentFormer library bot dating someone who could technically create anything. She could be living the dream of books if she knew also |
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Post by jda on Apr 24, 2023 6:04:11 GMT
View Attachment^I made a teeny change in the dialogue in that last panel to emphasize what I think the main source of Jerrek's outrage is (at this moment in the comic). Oooooh, nice spoting. I feel that much more reflects Louprred current situation. Would he feel "disrespected" if his partner leaves, for example? |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Apr 24, 2023 7:15:51 GMT
Would he feel "disrespected" if his partner leaves, for example? Hell yes. Additionally, I think "Loup" currently has less emotional maturity than a typical middle-schooler. He will not handle that feeling well. |
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Post by TBeholder on Apr 24, 2023 7:22:55 GMT
imaginaryfriend : Exactly what I had in mind. Kat certainly has a similar status/role to Coyote/Loup thanks to her worshipping by the robots, but in this way, the dialogue is more in line with the canon and the characters, and makes more sense. Why? You would not infer the same without spoon-feeding? i mean, it’s better than recaps, but… Huh. Maybe try less Silver Age and more Frank Herbert? :] Or at least some VN. I didn’t think much of them until recently, but some encourage monkeying around more than those old quests did. Additionally, I think "Loup" currently has less emotional maturity than a typical middle-schooler. He will not handle that feeling well. I would pin him on the lower end of “Nobody understands me!!1”. Which is why he is with Lana now, for one. |
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Post by zbeeblebrox on Apr 24, 2023 7:46:15 GMT
Hold on, does Jerek/Loup know the Angel and Kat are the same person? Edit: Ok yes he did. What a strange reaction from Loup here. He's being very 'Dead Goose' at the moment |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Apr 24, 2023 8:38:44 GMT
Additionally, I think "Loup" currently has less emotional maturity than a typical middle-schooler. He will not handle that feeling well. I would pin him on the lower end of “Nobody understands me!!1”. Which is why he is with Lana now, for one. The more that I think about it, the more I think I/we are still giving him too much credit, at least regarding human emotional maturity. Ysengrin probably had a good understanding about wolves' courtship and reproduction; he may even have raised several litters of pups. He knows enough to try to make one potential but reluctant mate more receptive by showing attention to another mate, for example. He would (and therefore "Loup" should) at least intellectually understand if a mate threw him aside for a stronger, more handsome, better-smelling alternative (which I doubt has ever actually happened) though he'd still be ticked off about it and be plotting to take back his mate, most likely. Ysengrin was a wolf for a long time and is/was set in his ways; "Loup" does have the power to learn and change himself instantly if he wishes, which brought about Jerrek. Jerrek doesn't react the same as "Loup" would so he brings a different set of desires but as a Nooman I don't expect that he brings much in the knowledge and maturity areas. "Loup" probably understands human biology well enough but from his interactions with Antimony I think it's safe to say he does not understand or does not care about human sensibilities, or both. Dating and romance are some of the most complex of human interactions. He should understand being bored with a mate, since Coyote certainly understood boredom, but I think the concept of breaking up with someone because they're (arguably) too powerful/superior would appear to him to be the antithesis of what selecting a mate should be about, even perverse. "Jerrek" will make things more complex by introducing conflicting desires and end goals. I fully expect (and I think we've seen some evidence already) that overall he's going to decide what Lana should ideally want, do that according to his own sensibilities, and then expect her to understand this as consideration and be appropriately grateful; if that doesn't happen he won't be big on listening to her point of view. For some reason Everything you want by Vertical Horizon comes to mind, probably because of the bits about howling and angels. By The Way: He's already firmly demonstrated that loving someone doesn't mean he won't kill them. |
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Post by Gemminie on Apr 24, 2023 15:52:24 GMT
So, those "hidden away" meant Jerrek and Lana. Jerrek probably found out because he's Loup and can see what's going on in other places without needing to go there. Kat and Paz's breakup seems to be the talk of all the New People, so all he'd have to do is look around to see now other New People are doing, and they'd be talking about it, so he'd know. It's not too hard to imagine how he found out, in other words. But Jerrek is outraged about it, very mad at Paz. This is a sign of how deeply Loup has submerged into his created Jerrek personality. Lana, on the other hand, is more focused on how bad Kat must feel. Jerrek is actually calling Kat the Angel and considers Paz "ungrateful." Again, before there was a Jerrek, Loup looked at Kat and said she was nobody special, but now he's calling her the Angel. Loup is very Jerrek. Lana is surprised at how angry Jerrek is about this – probably because she knows he's really Loup, so why would this matter to him? But Jerrek says that as a diving being, Kat should be treated with more respect. And this at least makes some sense to me. If he accepts now that Kat is a divine being, well, Loup is one too, and he also thinks that divine beings should be treated with respect. Clearly this conversation isn't over, and as there's another page, I'm going to hop over to that thread now and comment on that page too.  |
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