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Post by madjack on Aug 10, 2022 7:32:54 GMT
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Anthony
Full Member
No, not THAT guy.
Posts: 112
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Post by Anthony on Aug 10, 2022 7:34:24 GMT
"Ok, we do unscientific stuff, but only for the sake of doing scientific stuff."
Some strong Sunless Sea/Skies vibes from the last few pages.
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Post by aline on Aug 10, 2022 7:47:17 GMT
So, this isn't just a move to the next town over. Most likely it will be one way only, the people who come and those left behind will never see each other again. That brings a new perspective to the whole thing. A rather horrifying one. The ones left behind will have to rebuild a new society with less resources and will still have to deal with the threat of Loup. Or they'll have to take their chances with a normal human world that wouldn't understand them. Either way, friend and family who leave will be out of their reach forever.
Especially the fairies and animals turned human are used and discarded like tissue paper in this scenario. They left the forest behind, had to "crunch numbers" every day (probably etheric calculations of some kind for this travel through the stars) and now that they're no longer of use... Bye.
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 10, 2022 7:49:26 GMT
Good to know it's a real world they're travelling to and not a pocket kingdom in the etherium or something. I mean, first thing any travel agent should do before trying to sell you a package deal is reassure you that the destination is really real, even if the transportation mode is semi-metaphorical.
Of course that doesn't necessarily mean it isn't a real planet. Well, if you experience it then it's real enough for you, right?
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Post by stclair on Aug 10, 2022 7:51:31 GMT
"Let us assure you again, we are not magical beings attempting to deceive you for our own purposes. No, this is all very scientific. Really. Trust us."
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Post by bicarbonat on Aug 10, 2022 8:00:58 GMT
Talk about biting the hand that feeds (and forms) you.
Considering the precedent set in this story and in stories altogether (Babel comes to mind), I predict that a non-zero amount of mayhem will ensue.
Highly organized energy's got a helluva kick when it comes a-loose.
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Post by philman on Aug 10, 2022 8:04:51 GMT
This is all really cool technology and all, but I am still hung up on the "why?", and that I am sure there is a more sinister hidden reason behind all this than just "because science"
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Post by blahzor on Aug 10, 2022 8:22:15 GMT
All the former forest animals doing all the calculations to plot a course to the new planet (maybe even figure out where to look and find it)
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Post by MarineMonarch on Aug 10, 2022 8:26:18 GMT
I'm willing to take this stated goal as pretty face value, considering what we know of the court and its goals. They want a deterministic world, one where the laws of science always work and the future can be predicted with certainty, without pesky illogical things like magic getting in the way. They can't make Earth conform to that, so they're trying to create a new world that works on those rules.
Also does this imply that the court believes that the ether and magic exist because people believe in magic, superstition and religion? They seem to believe that if they exclude any people that either possess those or acknowledge them as legitimate then it won't propogate on their new planet.
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Post by speedwell on Aug 10, 2022 9:16:21 GMT
Not so fast. If they can (or even must) use the Ether to get to the new world, then the Ether is part of the cosmos in which that new world exists. Nice try though.
Alternatively, they don't have any intention whatsoever of relinquishing control of the Ether or of the methods to they use to manipulate it (even if they choose to characterise those methods as exclusively "scientific"). In which case they are being a trifle disingenuous liars.
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Post by csj on Aug 10, 2022 9:23:00 GMT
Not so fast. If they can (or even must) use the Ether to get to the new world, then the Ether is part of the cosmos in which that new world exists. Nice try though. Alternatively, they don't have any intention whatsoever of relinquishing control of the Ether or of the methods to they use to manipulate it (even if they choose to characterise those methods as exclusively "scientific"). In which case they are being a trifle disingenuous liars. nonsense, just put up a big sign saying 'no girls ether allowed' that'll show em |
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Post by blahzor on Aug 10, 2022 11:54:56 GMT
No Ethers
but there's one right behind you!
Her name is Ester
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Post by todd on Aug 10, 2022 13:25:32 GMT
It still seems like the Court's engaging in "shaky foundations" - using ether to get away from the ether. (The best we can say about it is that, even with the Court's level of technology, it'd take centuries or longer to reach another inhabitable planet.)
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Post by maxptc on Aug 10, 2022 13:26:20 GMT
But you could use this to explore the universe? Once we are without magic, how long until we develop "real science" that can explore deep space with travelers? Like are we really about to disregard what is no doubt one of the most impressive bits of science and technology, that makes this trip possible, to program toasters to feel love? Also on that subject, we have no Robots right? Maybe I'm not as excited about trying to build a new society with 12 people, no magic and no labor machines as other people.
Did you use magic to make it a full city? What's the current population and what's the necessary population to maintain sustainability? This is a much harder sell then it is being presented as, at least with the near 0 information most of them have.
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Post by ctso74 on Aug 10, 2022 13:38:38 GMT
Not so fast. If they can (or even must) use the Ether to get to the new world, then the Ether is part of the cosmos in which that new world exists. Nice try though. Alternatively, they don't have any intention whatsoever of relinquishing control of the Ether or of the methods to they use to manipulate it (even if they choose to characterise those methods as exclusively "scientific"). In which case they are being a trifle disingenuous liars. Their use of the Ether stations may have given them the knowledge to block/destroy a weak Ether presence. They could create a gateway, use it, then lock it or burn it down. They might focus the Ether, so only a portion of Courtopia has it at all. But, the Court doesn't seem the type to leave a Ether terminal open, for who knows what to travel through. Pretty page. |
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Post by todd on Aug 10, 2022 13:56:13 GMT
If the planet is inhabitable, is it already inhabited by indigenous life forms? (You'd at least need plants to provide oxygen.) If so, let's hope the Court co-exists with them better than it did with the forest-folk (and if at least some of the native life-forms turn out to be etheric as well.... The Court *did* check on that, right?)
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Post by zbeeblebrox on Aug 10, 2022 13:56:34 GMT
Even for Gunnerkrigg, that’s a really intense foreign exchange program
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Post by Nnelg on Aug 10, 2022 14:42:14 GMT
Honestly, I think that his stated goal makes sense and is way more consistent with known motivations of the Court than what a lot of people here seemed to believe, i.e. "omnipotence" (with undertones of malevolent abuse).
Not to say that I trust thatvthis guy is being completely honest, this scene gives me very strong "To Serve Mankind" vibes. But I suspect that he—or rather, the organization he represents—is being dishonest with itself more than it is being deceitful towards others. They are delusional if they think that "humans" can really be "purely scientific" in this new world: either one or the other principle will have to give. Either they will fail to live up to their goals, or they will cease being human.
Either way, I'm certain they're gone now and there's no way we'll ever see them. Nope, nada, never.
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Post by pyradonis on Aug 10, 2022 15:29:23 GMT
What the hell does "travel the stars in a semi-metaphorical state" mean? Maybe the sentence is just too ambiguous for a non-native speaker, but all I can think of is that the people who embark on this journey will have to be partially transformed into metaphors. Uh... If the planet is inhabitable, is it already inhabited by indigenous life forms? (You'd at least need plants to provide oxygen.) If so, let's hope the Court co-exists with them better than it did with the forest-folk (and if at least some of the native life-forms turn out to be etheric as well.... The Court *did* check on that, right?) Well, it was shown the Court has huge artificial habitats populated by real plants and robot animals like some kid-friendly version of Horizon: Zero Dawn. |
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Post by bedinsis on Aug 10, 2022 15:46:34 GMT
When the court was first founded it was done so by people fleeing... something. I'm starting to wonder if that initial escape is similar in motivation to this exodus. |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 10, 2022 16:03:47 GMT
What the hell does "travel the stars in a semi-metaphorical state" mean? Maybe the sentence is just too ambiguous for a non-native speaker, but all I can think of is that the people who embark on this journey will have to be partially transformed into metaphors. Uh... Leaving aside the fact that the phrase "travelling the stars" is sort-of metaphorical in itself, I think what they mean is that the journey isn't really travelling the stars at all. There will be no space ship as such, no transporter beam, but maybe something like a magical warp drive. I'm thinking we've got a boat with some fancy tech that "harnesses" the ether to sail from one planet to (giving benefit of doubt) another planet. The boat will leave reality as far as those in the Court know it and presumably reenter elsewhere. There may be all sorts of fun sights to see on the journey, like weird constellations and different planets and stars and stuff, but if they're actually there or not is going to be a matter for philosophical debate and overall it's going to be nothing like conventional space travel. |
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Post by Angry Individual on Aug 10, 2022 16:05:07 GMT
When the court was first founded it was done so by people fleeing... something. I'm starting to wonder if that initial escape is similar in motivation to this exodus.
It's thoughts like this that make me wonder if the Court doesn't have "alien" origins in some way. We still haven't gotten an explanation about the Seed of Bismuth, for example, and how it was truly made (other than that it was combined with magic and human technology and that the humans made it "grow too fast").
Is it simply an analogy for human society and growth? Can we even trust any information that Beesmuth gave to begin with? Who are the Seed of Bismuth's brothers if there is indeed actual brothers?
So many questions, and yet all the answers are running away to a new planet using the very essence they despise.
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Post by gpvos on Aug 10, 2022 16:25:56 GMT
Twist: the planet they're going to is our current Earth.
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Post by Sky Schemer on Aug 10, 2022 17:02:02 GMT
Just wait until they meet Space Coyote.  |
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Post by speedwell on Aug 10, 2022 17:06:29 GMT
Not so fast. If they can (or even must) use the Ether to get to the new world, then the Ether is part of the cosmos in which that new world exists. Nice try though. Alternatively, they don't have any intention whatsoever of relinquishing control of the Ether or of the methods to they use to manipulate it (even if they choose to characterise those methods as exclusively "scientific"). In which case they are being a trifle disingenuous liars. Their use of the Ether stations may have given them the knowledge to block/destroy a weak Ether presence. They could create a gateway, use it, then lock it or burn it down. They might focus the Ether, so only a portion of Courtopia has it at all. But, the Court doesn't seem the type to leave a Ether terminal open, for who knows what to travel through. That actually only works optimally if they have exclusive control of the Ether. (After all, what they could do, theoretically anyone else could.) Or if they somehow destroy the Ether completely and prevent any of it from being created again, which we already know doesn't happen (or the Norns would never access a future version of Kat, or, arguably, of anything). |
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Post by guntherkrieg on Aug 10, 2022 17:20:11 GMT
A new life awaits you in the Off-world colonies. The chance to begin again in a golden land of opportunity and adventure!
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Post by guntherkrieg on Aug 10, 2022 17:22:50 GMT
What the hell does "travel the stars in a semi-metaphorical state" mean? Maybe the sentence is just too ambiguous for a non-native speaker, but all I can think of is that the people who embark on this journey will have to be partially transformed into metaphors. Uh... If the planet is inhabitable, is it already inhabited by indigenous life forms? (You'd at least need plants to provide oxygen.) If so, let's hope the Court co-exists with them better than it did with the forest-folk (and if at least some of the native life-forms turn out to be etheric as well.... The Court *did* check on that, right?) Well, it was shown the Court has huge artificial habitats populated by real plants and robot animals like some kid-friendly version of Horizon: Zero Dawn. I believe the method of travel is semi-metaphorical, in that "all language is a spell/magic" sort-of way. This could also be Tom falling into the age-old author trap of "I'm a writer, therefore writing/creative stories are the true magic". See: Stephen King, Clive Barker, Neil Gaiman, and so on and so on and so on. Spoiler: it isn't, but it is if that's your bag. |
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Post by guntherkrieg on Aug 10, 2022 17:24:45 GMT
Also, globular face aside, this is 80% the Elon Musk Martian colony pitch, just replace "ether" with "human dignity".
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Post by mturtle7 on Aug 10, 2022 17:42:05 GMT
What the hell does "travel the stars in a semi-metaphorical state" mean? Maybe the sentence is just too ambiguous for a non-native speaker, but all I can think of is that the people who embark on this journey will have to be partially transformed into metaphors. Uh... Yup, pretty sure the answer which you (quite sensibly) think is too ridiculous to be true is exactly what they mean. Alternatively, I think you could also see it as them being partially transformed into "purely etheric beings" - i.e., human concepts made only kinda-sorta-"real" by the ether, such as a certain trickster god we all know and love. It's really interesting (and unexpected, at least for me) to see that the Court and Coyote actually have very similar ideas about what the ether is and how it works! |
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Post by mordekai on Aug 10, 2022 17:55:36 GMT
What the hell does "travel the stars in a semi-metaphorical state" mean? Maybe the sentence is just too ambiguous for a non-native speaker, but all I can think of is that the people who embark on this journey will have to be partially transformed into metaphors. Uh... Well, it was shown the Court has huge artificial habitats populated by real plants and robot animals like some kid-friendly version of Horizon: Zero Dawn. I believe the method of travel is semi-metaphorical, in that "all language is a spell/magic" sort-of way. This could also be Tom falling into the age-old author trap of "I'm a writer, therefore writing/creative stories are the true magic". See: Stephen King, Clive Barker, Neil Gaiman, and so on and so on and so on. Spoiler: it isn't, but it is if that's your bag.
I suspect they will board magical ships and travel through the Space Ocean like magical vikings... sort of like Marvel Comics Asgardians are sometimes shown having magical ships able to cross dimensions and travel through outer space... But of course, the Court wouldn't say "we will use magical ships to fly to our destination...".
About the final destination being a real planet rather than an etheric dimension... I am not so sure... the Court doesn't really understand how Ether works (that's why they are dumping it), so, what if they think they have found a real world, but what they have really found is some etheric world of myth? Like, they end in Arawn, or Sekhet-Aaru, or Vanaheim, or Akaniṭṭha, or the Navajo Fourth World...?
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