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Post by imaginaryfriend on Mar 21, 2022 7:03:17 GMT
I'm unsure the Court would destroy itself over it, actually. It is important to them, though. |
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Post by rafk on Mar 21, 2022 7:10:42 GMT
OK, now I'm suspicious that Annie knows who she's talking to.
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Post by madjack on Mar 21, 2022 7:18:49 GMT
OK, now I'm suspicious that Annie knows who she's talking to. Perhaps maneuvering Loup into doing some dirty work for them. That Kat doesn't seem to care about the Omega Project is interesting in itself. |
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Post by basser on Mar 21, 2022 7:21:40 GMT
I just realized if you tried to draw Loup as a human you'd pretty much make this dude.
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Post by blahzor on Mar 21, 2022 7:32:38 GMT
OK, now I'm suspicious that Annie knows who she's talking to. Thinking that they were suspicious of him and then whatever Lana said made it seem even more suspicious because he was acting like Rey would and not like the other NP's |
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Post by Tenjen on Mar 21, 2022 9:43:53 GMT
His half loup-morphed face in the second panel is hilarious.
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Post by speedwell on Mar 21, 2022 9:50:35 GMT
I just realized if you tried to draw Loup as a human you'd pretty much make this dude. Maybe. Loup is still a strong, fit large predatory animal, and Jerrek's body is a wiry, small, unremarkable sort. I would have at least expected someone of middle height but looking like they did a bit of hard work. |
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Post by aline on Mar 21, 2022 10:38:59 GMT
OK, now I'm suspicious that Annie knows who she's talking to. Thinking that they were suspicious of him and then whatever Lana said made it seem even more suspicious because he was acting like Rey would and not like the other NP's Not convinced. Surely the NP are as different from each other as humans. What he did wasn't so out of whack as to make him suspicious. He got a bit violent trying to protect a friend (but did not injure anyone). Annie did the same on her first school week. |
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Post by ohthatone on Mar 21, 2022 12:08:17 GMT
So how much info did Tony divulge and how much did he keep back? Though I imagine he didn't have all the knowledge to begin with.
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Post by The Anarch on Mar 21, 2022 13:42:42 GMT
We really ought to find out more about this Steadman Device.
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 21, 2022 13:52:57 GMT
So, Annie finally talks to her father about the Omega Device and of course it was offscreen.
Maybe she could try to summarize what he said instead of talking in vague hints? No... I understand.
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Post by ctso74 on Mar 21, 2022 14:31:29 GMT
Go on...
I imagine, Tony brought out spreadsheet after spreadsheet, while Rey poured coffee to keep Annie awake.
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Post by Gemini Jim on Mar 21, 2022 15:53:45 GMT
It almost looks like she's avoiding looking at him directly. IF she does suspect something, and she's trying to get him to talk... And yeah, those ears in the second panel  |
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Post by maxptc on Mar 21, 2022 16:21:38 GMT
So, Annie finally talks to her father about the Omega Device and of course it was offscreen. Maybe she could try to summarize what he said instead of talking in vague hints? No... I understand. Right? I mean if we get a summary now and this happening off screen was just to avoid another exposition chapter with Annie and Tony that's fine and I get it. But if we don't get any more information and have to figure out the details of what happened from commentary and its left kinda in the air again, I'm gonna be a little annoyed. |
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Post by fia on Mar 21, 2022 16:54:03 GMT
what machine??
what strange theory???
I really want to know but I also don't actually want Annie to tell Loup everything she knows. I really do hope she's suspected him. But it's a bit odd of her to go the indirect route, if she does know; typically she's been pretty head-on with Loup.
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 21, 2022 18:56:34 GMT
what machine?? what strange theory??? I really want to know but I also don't actually want Annie to tell Loup everything she knows. I really do hope she's suspected him. But it's a bit odd of her to go the indirect route, if she does know; typically she's been pretty head-on with Loup. Hot take: She does suspect him and deliberately talks vague to see if he betrays himself. |
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Post by Runningflame on Mar 21, 2022 19:05:40 GMT
So, Annie finally talks to her father about the Omega Device and of course it was offscreen. Maybe she could try to summarize what he said instead of talking in vague hints? No... I understand. Right? I mean if we get a summary now and this happening off screen was just to avoid another exposition chapter with Annie and Tony that's fine and I get it. But if we don't get any more information and have to figure out the details of what happened from commentary and its left kinda in the air again, I'm gonna be a little annoyed. If that is how this goes, it wouldn't be the first time. (We did get a fuller explanation of what Jones is, eight chapters later.) |
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Post by Eily on Mar 21, 2022 19:59:41 GMT
OK, now I'm suspicious that Annie knows who she's talking to. I did wonder about Loup's disguise in the Ether. It seems Coyote did manage to hide is Ether self pretty easily, so I guess it wouldn't be unexpected for Loup to do so as well, even if he is much less in control. But there are many people from the Forest in the Court, who seem to judge people on some sort of Etheric signature. Surely to them the New People feel way different, and unless Coyote's hiding power included that part, Loup would have been easily spotted. A good clue on that point would be how Lana behaves and Jerek from now on. I don't expect Annie, and Kat even less, to let her just be her clueless self around Loup without a warning. |
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Post by Alkazar on Mar 21, 2022 21:42:09 GMT
Loup's getting pretty predictable in one's old age.
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Post by jda on Mar 22, 2022 3:14:58 GMT
So, Annie finally talks to her father about the Omega Device and of course it was offscreen. Maybe she could try to summarize what he said instead of talking in vague hints? No... I understand. My exact thought. At this rate, the comic will end offscreen. We... will understand. |
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Post by blahzor on Mar 22, 2022 5:35:08 GMT
Thinking that they were suspicious of him and then whatever Lana said made it seem even more suspicious because he was acting like Rey would and not like the other NP's Not convinced. Surely the NP are as different from each other as humans. What he did wasn't so out of whack as to make him suspicious. He got a bit violent trying to protect a friend (but did not injure anyone). Annie did the same on her first school week. She's a fire elemental I'm sure they've been arounthe NP's enough to know their general behavior and there's no reason to not be cautious to any new people even if Kat made em |
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Post by drmemory on Mar 22, 2022 5:40:25 GMT
Oh, just a strange theory? Ok then. No reason the readers would want to know more than that.
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Post by drmemory on Mar 22, 2022 5:50:52 GMT
OK, now I'm suspicious that Annie knows who she's talking to. I did wonder about Loup's disguise in the Ether. It seems Coyote did manage to hide is Ether self pretty easily, so I guess it wouldn't be unexpected for Loup to do so as well, even if he is much less in control. But there are many people from the Forest in the Court, who seem to judge people on some sort of Etheric signature. Surely to them the New People feel way different, and unless Coyote's hiding power included that part, Loup would have been easily spotted. A good clue on that point would be how Lana behaves and Jerek from now on. I don't expect Annie, and Kat even less, to let her just be her clueless self around Loup without a warning. She still looked pretty huffy here.
As for warning her, or not... hmmm. It comes down to how human the NPs are, or at least how alive they are versus how close to robots or computers. For example, with Kat's remote manufacturing and delivery service, she may well be able to completely replace a destroyed NP body in short order. If NPs are automatically backed up in KatCloud (tm), then using her for bait might seem reasonable.
But if they are alive, or close, perhaps backing up their minds isn't so easy.
So we're again back to the basic question about whether the robots were in some sense alive, and how that changed due to Kat's work. Are the NP more like upgraded computers, making the ocean like a hardware upgrade, or more like Pinocchio? I'm sure Kat would claim the former but that doesn't necessarily make it so!
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Post by aline on Mar 22, 2022 9:19:59 GMT
Not convinced. Surely the NP are as different from each other as humans. What he did wasn't so out of whack as to make him suspicious. He got a bit violent trying to protect a friend (but did not injure anyone). Annie did the same on her first school week. She's a fire elemental So you're telling me that's not something kids do in real life? There's no reason to be more careful of NP than of any other kids in the Court. If anything, who would expect Loup to defend a girl? It sure as hell took US by surprise. We discussed for pages why he would even do that. If Annie had been there she might have realized something was weird, but all she got was some second hand account, there's no way that's enough to suspect Jerrek, much less conclude that he's Loup. |
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 22, 2022 12:23:16 GMT
Right? I mean if we get a summary now and this happening off screen was just to avoid another exposition chapter with Annie and Tony that's fine and I get it. But if we don't get any more information and have to figure out the details of what happened from commentary and its left kinda in the air again, I'm gonna be a little annoyed. If that is how this goes, it wouldn't be the first time. (We did get a fuller explanation of what Jones is, eight chapters later.) Considering how eight chapters later Annie barged into Jones' apartment asking "What are you?!" I doubt we missed much not being shown Ysengrin's "explanation".
As for warning her, or not... hmmm. It comes down to how human the NPs are, or at least how alive they are versus how close to robots or computers. For example, with Kat's remote manufacturing and delivery service, she may well be able to completely replace a destroyed NP body in short order. If NPs are automatically backed up in KatCloud (tm), then using her for bait might seem reasonable. Without telling her? Sounds quite unethical to me. Even if the NP could be fully restored even after complete destruction of their new bodies (which I doubt, with the new bodies having organic brains instead of CPUs) the experience of being ripped apart by Loup in a fit of rage would be incredibly traumatizing. |
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Post by liminal on Mar 22, 2022 15:25:55 GMT
For example, with Kat's remote manufacturing and delivery service, she may well be able to completely replace a destroyed NP body in short order. If NPs are automatically backed up in KatCloud (tm), then using her for bait might seem reasonable. |
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Post by Gemminie on Mar 22, 2022 15:27:40 GMT
Going on with what has Annie preoccupied, she asks whether Jerrek's heard of the Omega Device. This causes Loup to almost pop out of Jerrek form. His ears go pointy, his right ear goes Coyoteish, and his nose and mouth go wolfy. Annie isn't looking in his direction, so she doesn't see.
Inwardly, Loup is very interested in this Omega thing; searching for it seems to be the very thing that has motivated him to masquerade as Jerrek. He manages to restabilize his façade before Annie looks his way.
Annie tells us offhand that she's talked to her father about it. Cool cool. Yes, I ... understand. I'm guessing that Tom isn't filling us in on this because he doesn't want to make up a bunch of Court technobabble that he'd have to keep consistent later and that wouldn't contribute much to the plot. It's based on a "strange theory," and that's all we're getting, at least for now. From what Annie's gathered about it, which may be more than we readers have by this time, it doesn't make sense for the Court to want to pull up roots and move just because of the Omega Device.
But is that really why the Court is moving? Annie says she doesn't "see why the Court would destroy itself over it." I don't either. But I thought the Court was moving to get away from Coyote, Loup, and the Forest. It wants to get away from all these outside etheric influences, not to mention attacks. Maybe Tony told Annie more, perhaps saying that the Omega Device can't function well with all of this etheric nonsense going on. But that's speculation; we don't know much about what he said to her at this point.
It's possible that Jerrek/Loup will try to subtly press Annie for more information about the "machine based on a strange theory" in upcoming pages. Or perhaps not, not wanting to blow his cover by seeming too interested. I guess we'll see.
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Post by drmemory on Mar 22, 2022 16:19:25 GMT
As for warning her, or not... hmmm. It comes down to how human the NPs are, or at least how alive they are versus how close to robots or computers. For example, with Kat's remote manufacturing and delivery service, she may well be able to completely replace a destroyed NP body in short order. If NPs are automatically backed up in KatCloud (tm), then using her for bait might seem reasonable. Without telling her? Sounds quite unethical to me. Even if the NP could be fully restored even after complete destruction of their new bodies (which I doubt, with the new bodies having organic brains instead of CPUs) the experience of being ripped apart by Loup in a fit of rage would be incredibly traumatizing. ARE they organic brains? That's pretty much what I was trying to ask, rephrased. Their minds are transferred into bigger minds in the new bodies, but are those new minds still circuits, or no?
As for unethical... Hmmm. I guess Kat and Annie would probably think that. Again, it comes back to whether these are living beings. Consider this: Kat thinks of all of this as engineering. Still, right? Despite what she's learned about Diego's work and the arrow? I haven't heard her say anything that contradicts that anyway.
You're probably right tho, especially in the case of Annie. She takes everyone at face value, treating them as living beings and giving the benefit of the doubt, even when they are clearly not alive in a traditional sense. So she would object to using one as bait. I still can't quite rule it out entirely, but I think you are right that they wouldn't do this without telling her and giving her a choice, even if Kat could indeed completely recreate her. Whether or not that is possible.
Incidentally, if anyone is to figure out that Jerrek isn't a real ex-robot, I bet it would be S13. Our friend the cult leader still has a CPU hosting his mind, and I imagine he has a nice little spreadsheet of who has been converted, who hasn't been yet, and their old and new information. As a computer, he shouldn't really forget anything or remember it incorrectly. We also know that he is more directly involved with the NPization process - he's the one talking to them individually about the ocean and new body options and such. So if anyone is walking around knowing that Jerrek isn't who he claims to be, I'd have to think it would be Robot. |
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Post by alevice on Mar 22, 2022 20:16:07 GMT
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 23, 2022 9:47:56 GMT
Whoops, totally forgot!
Without telling her? Sounds quite unethical to me. Even if the NP could be fully restored even after complete destruction of their new bodies (which I doubt, with the new bodies having organic brains instead of CPUs) the experience of being ripped apart by Loup in a fit of rage would be incredibly traumatizing.
ARE they organic brains? That's pretty much what I was trying to ask, rephrased.  Their minds are transferred into bigger minds in the new bodies, but are those new minds still circuits, or no? As for unethical... Hmmm. I guess Kat and Annie would probably think that. Again, it comes back to whether these are living beings. Consider this: Kat thinks of all of this as engineering. Still, right? Despite what she's learned about Diego's work and the arrow? I haven't heard her say anything that contradicts that anyway. You're probably right tho, especially in the case of Annie. She takes everyone at face value, treating them as living beings and giving the benefit of the doubt, even when they are clearly not alive in a traditional sense. So she would object to using one as bait. I still can't quite rule it out entirely, but I think you are right that they wouldn't do this without telling her and giving her a choice, even if Kat could indeed completely recreate her. Whether or not that is possible. Incidentally, if anyone is to figure out that Jerrek isn't a real ex-robot, I bet it would be S13. Our friend the cult leader still has a CPU hosting his mind, and I imagine he has a nice little spreadsheet of who has been converted, who hasn't been yet, and their old and new information. As a computer, he shouldn't really forget anything or remember it incorrectly. We also know that he is more directly involved with the NPization process - he's the one talking to them individually about the ocean and new body options and such. So if anyone is walking around knowing that Jerrek isn't who he claims to be, I'd have to think it would be Robot. Hmm, okay, I thought it had been said Arthur's brain was organic, but apparently I just assumed that. It's only been established that it is a newly designed brain that is not a CPU. Also remember she started the whole mass-transformation of robots into NP because she thought the Court's plan of overriding their bodies was unethical (I still don't understand why that would be worse than having them stand there keeping the shield up, but okay).
Agree with the assessment that S13 is the most likely to notice there's a NP running around he doesn't know.
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Their minds are transferred into bigger minds in the new bodies, but are those new minds still circuits, or no?