|
|
Post by crater on Aug 9, 2021 15:39:29 GMT
I am in hell.....
|
|
|
|
Post by blazingstar on Aug 9, 2021 16:14:28 GMT
On further reflection, maybe Aata wasn't targeted because "Loup" doesn't see him as human. Reminiscent of Jones standing in the path of the bombs, to me. ..is Aata another being with similarities to Jones, maybe not semi-immortal, but impervious to physical attack? Or perhaps he made himself like that, in a failed attempt to become god-like? Not sure I believe this, but.... I was thinking something along these lines, as well. He didn't kill Aata, because he knew Aata couldn't be killed. So Loup took out Shel, which he figured would hurt much more. It seems he was right. Which, of course, begs the question: WHAT is Aata, and what does Loup know about him?! |
|
mzpx
Junior Member
Posts: 71
|
Post by mzpx on Aug 9, 2021 16:54:23 GMT
Oh noes! Poor Shel didn't deserve this. (I mean, it's war, and she was fully aware of potential consequences, but still.)
Aata's behaviour is interesting. I'm guessing he can either take the attack (which ability may be disrupted due to his present emotional turmoil), or he accepted sacrificing himself (maybe he can be reborn, or he just considered this a worthwhile way to go). Clearly, he expected Loup to act reasonably and focus the attack on the general of the Court, i.e. on Aata, not on nameless goons (I know we know Shell's name, you know what I mean). But he forgot that Loup is always one step away from full-blown fury and that Coyote often does unspeakable things just for fun, so they will just try to cause maximum damage rather than to act honourably.
I guess this just underlines how right they are to try and stop Loup forever - humans will never be safe while gods without empathy like these are around (Mecha!Kat will be different, as she started off as a human and the whole reason why she will become a god is that she cares, even about robots). I mean, it's a shame that in this universe, that effort could also wipe out the entire world, but Tom seems really keen to illustrate that they are definitely living in existential fear.
|
|
|
|
Post by hp on Aug 9, 2021 17:27:57 GMT
I think Loup is just saving Aata for later. Coyote had the power to simply handwave him out of his ethereal chat with Anne and Loup was able to thrash Court terrain by making a gesture like a Sith lord. No way Loup depends on those roots to kill people.
In an unrelated topic... I wonder what will become of Coyote's tooth if it's actually used to kill Loup? Will it vanish? Or will it just remain "out there" as some sort of Coyote seed?
I don't think Annie will be able to bring herself to kill Loup tho. Maybe she will just return the tooth to him and appeal to Ysengrim and Coyote's love for her
|
|
|
|
Post by pyradonis on Aug 9, 2021 17:34:29 GMT
The nickname is "Shell" with two Ls...
Interesting. Due to the arcing way the wooden tendrils are drawn in panel 1 I first read it as Aata directing them around himself and Shell getting hit by accident. But Aata looks much too surprised in panel 2 for that to be the case. The question whether he was ready to die, would have had any kind of defense, or might not even be killable by destroying this body remains open for now.
At least three of Loup's root-like tendrils stab Shell in the abdomen; oddly, Shell doesn't appear to be bleeding or screaming in pain, just looking afraid. Andrew reacted the same way when he was stabbed.
Will eglamore get fired for failure to protect the Court (even though he was busy protecting annie- who is the forest medium and therefore technically not part of the court)? Annie is a student of the Court, living in the Court, of course she is part of it. Also, I doubt the Court leadership would want Annie to die. Not because they care for her, but even without Coyote and Ysengrin around she is the daughter of one of their most important researchers for the Omega Device. If Annie died, all bets are off on what Tony would do, but he would certainly not calmly stay and continue working for them.
I see what you did there. |
|
|
|
Post by hp on Aug 9, 2021 18:22:15 GMT
Will eglamore get fired for failure to protect the Court (even though he was busy protecting annie- who is the forest medium and therefore technically not part of the court)? That crew is facing 2 gods combined. I doubt even Eggs+Parley can do something about Loup. Even when Eglamore saved Annie from Ysengrim, best he could hope for was fleeing fast and stunning Y. Besides, Annie is a student and part of their mission (is she still a medium now that Loup declared war?) and shadow men seem more capable of protecting themselves than the regular court dweller. |
|
|
|
Post by itrogash on Aug 9, 2021 18:25:50 GMT
Shel does seem surprisingly unaffected at being pierced by 3 Loup-roots... more surprised than pained. Odd..... I think that's just how Tom depicts characters being stabbed. I don't remember Smitty losing much blood either when he was stabbed. Speaking of which, I really don't think there is a lot of hope for Shel. Smitty was injured much closer to Court and had to deal with only one wound, and the only thing that saved him was Annie striking a deal with the Guides. Parley couldn't just teleport him to hospital, and now she's much further from Court and without Smitty's power too. Unless Aata has some crazy healing powers I don't think there is many options left for her. |
|
|
|
Post by warrl on Aug 9, 2021 18:34:31 GMT
Curious that either Aata wasn't targeted or perhaps he was just too short. Shell on the other hand gets hit repeatedly. I'm a bit disappointed Aata didn't get to show off some sort of cool etheric power(s). Maybe next page. My take is that he was targeted but made the strands flow around him - meaning the person behind him got it hard. |
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 9, 2021 18:35:39 GMT
Curious that either Aata wasn't targeted or perhaps he was just too short. Shell on the other hand gets hit repeatedly. I'm a bit disappointed Aata didn't get to show off some sort of cool etheric power(s). Maybe next page. My take is that he was targeted but made the strands flow around him - meaning the person behind him got it hard. Possibly but I wonder if the points pointing at Aata in panel 1 are a result of perspective/artistic license and they weren't coming as close as I first thought. Also on review of this page I think the cluster of roots that nailed Shell was one that passed him close on the left (his right) most of which weren't going to hit him in any case. The three roots on the left side in panel one are the right-most three in panel four (one of which misses because Shell has apparently moved a bit to Aata's right). Currently leaning in the "it was an area attack and he's just short" direction. When and why did Shell lose an L from her nickname? Not mad, just not keeping up apparently. I blame myself. I've known a bunch of "Shels" (several Michelles and one Echelle) and as far as I know they all spelled it with one "L." If I started the thread with the canon "Shell" everyone else probably would have hit the mark. Heh. |
|
|
|
Post by Gemminie on Aug 9, 2021 20:02:12 GMT
In an unrelated topic... I wonder what will become of Coyote's tooth if it's actually used to kill Loup? Will it vanish? Or will it just remain "out there" as some sort of Coyote seed? From how I read it, when Annie eventually stabs Loup with the blade, that will count as "returning Coyote's gift," so it'll become part of Loup in the process of killing him. But I'm not denying the possibility that it might remain. |
|
|
|
Post by pyradonis on Aug 9, 2021 20:31:40 GMT
Shel does seem surprisingly unaffected at being pierced by 3 Loup-roots... more surprised than pained. Odd..... I think that's just how Tom depicts characters being stabbed. I don't remember Smitty losing much blood either when he was stabbed. Speaking of which, I really don't think there is a lot of hope for Shel. Smitty was injured much closer to Court and had to deal with only one wound, and the only thing that saved him was Annie striking a deal with the Guides. Parley couldn't just teleport him to hospital, and now she's much further from Court and without Smitty's power too. Unless Aata has some crazy healing powers I don't think there is many options left for her. Actually, that Parley Wassername wanted to teleport to a doctor, but Annie told her to wait because she preferred the psychopomps to heal Andrew. |
|
caber
Junior Member
Posts: 77
|
Post by caber on Aug 9, 2021 21:17:38 GMT
I think that's just how Tom depicts characters being stabbed. I don't remember Smitty losing much blood either when he was stabbed. Speaking of which, I really don't think there is a lot of hope for Shel. Smitty was injured much closer to Court and had to deal with only one wound, and the only thing that saved him was Annie striking a deal with the Guides. Parley couldn't just teleport him to hospital, and now she's much further from Court and without Smitty's power too. Unless Aata has some crazy healing powers I don't think there is many options left for her. Actually, that Parley Wassername wanted to teleport to a doctor, but Annie told her to wait because she preferred the psychopomps to heal Andrew. You know, upon reflecting on what Annie says there... that seems to leave open that a court doctor might actually have been able to save Smitty, despite a pretty grave wound. Then again that could simply be because Annie herself didn't know enough about medicine to be able to make that call. Tangent: that's one of the things I love about this series; their technology and understanding of science is clearly waaay ahead of ours (partially due to weird physics and literal magic), but it manifests in truly bizarre ways compared to our world (looking at you, robot horses that speak poetry). |
|
|
|
Post by drmemory on Aug 9, 2021 23:17:39 GMT
At first I was thinking the lack of blood might be a hint that Shell isn't human, but after further thought I think it's just Tom keeping the comic safe for kids and people that read it at work. I can only remember one actually sort of gory page in the entire comic, when Ysengrin killed and ate Coyote, and even then it wasn't actually a modern American horror movie, with the blood and the guts and all that. I'm pretty sure that what Coyote told Loup is different from what he told Annie - note that he talked to them quite separately this time! So he may well have passed along some strategic info like "You can't hurt Aata because he's not vulnerable to physical attacks, but his minions do not share this protection". As was pointed out above, Ysengrin was a general of the forest forces, and would know what to do with that sort of information. He's also not afraid to get his hands (paws? branches?) dirty!
So what happens next? They still have a pissed off, immature but powerful god there, so even if they'd prefer to stop everything and try to save Shell, they really can't. I also wouldn't really expect Aata to send Parley off with her (because it would weaken his forces, and he seems rather heartless). I wouldn't be entirely shocked if he turns out to be displeased at James saving Annie - that may turn out to be career limiting, assuming he they both survive current events.
|
|
|
|
Post by DonDueed on Aug 9, 2021 23:27:28 GMT
Curious that either Aata wasn't targeted or perhaps he was just too short. Shell on the other hand gets hit repeatedly. I'm a bit disappointed Aata didn't get to show off some sort of cool etheric power(s). Maybe next page. My take is that he was targeted but made the strands flow around him - meaning the person behind him got it hard. That was my initial reaction as well.
However...
Consider the fact that it was Shell who actually attacked Loup. He may not have realized that Aata was the agent in charge here, since he (Loup) was not privy to the conversation between Coyote, Annie, and Buddha-Aata. Loup has never been the sharpest tack in the drawer.
In other words, Loup may simply have lashed out at the person who seemed to be responsible for attacking him.
|
|
|
|
Post by todd on Aug 9, 2021 23:34:58 GMT
Also, I doubt the Court leadership would want Annie to die. Not because they care for her, but even without Coyote and Ysengrin around she is the daughter of one of their most important researchers for the Omega Device. If Annie died, all bets are off on what Tony would do, but he would certainly not calmly stay and continue working for them. also, if Annie dies, Reynardine is free, and I don't think that the Court would want that - they'd then have to worry about two super-powered canids rather than one. (I doubt Reynardine would wreak havoc - he's shown genuine remorse over Daniel's death - but the Court might not know that, and is probably ready to think the worst about any etheric being.) |
|
|
|
Post by SilverbackRon on Aug 9, 2021 23:46:24 GMT
Consider the fact that it was Shell who actually attacked Loup. He may not have realized that Aata was the agent in charge here, since he (Loup) was not privy to the conversation between Coyote, Annie, and Buddha-Aata. Loup has never been the sharpest tack in the drawer.
In other words, Loup may simply have lashed out at the person who seemed to be responsible for attacking him.
Wow, I like this explanation. Obvious answer is obvious! Shell did run up and attack him, while Aata simply said "Now". Still, I hold out the possibility that Aata had some way of bending the attack around himself, he seemed braced for it. |
|
|
|
Post by pyradonis on Aug 9, 2021 23:48:35 GMT
Also, I doubt the Court leadership would want Annie to die. Not because they care for her, but even without Coyote and Ysengrin around she is the daughter of one of their most important researchers for the Omega Device. If Annie died, all bets are off on what Tony would do, but he would certainly not calmly stay and continue working for them. also, if Annie dies, Reynardine is free, and I don't think that the Court would want that - they'd then have to worry about two super-powered canids rather than one. (I doubt Reynardine would wreak havoc - he's shown genuine remorse over Daniel's death - but the Court might not know that, and is probably ready to think the worst about any etheric being. And, keeping the Court's history of conflict-solving in mind, I wouldn't be surprised if a hastily put together plan to capture Renard again might result in him being forced to kill again to stay free. |
|
|
|
Post by SilverbackRon on Aug 9, 2021 23:53:09 GMT
I suspect that if anyone from the court dies today, it will probably be Shell and possibly a couple other Shadow Men. First batch of murderous cookies are in order; it remains to be seen if the second part of the prediction would be true. Yum! I like my Murder Cookies while they are still warm and sticky. Here is another prediction. Or rather just an observation of something already known. Eglamore and Parley aren't going to try to attack Loup. They want to evacuate whoever they can. Remember when Annie got attacked by Ysengrin? Tom wrote at the bottom of the page "Jimmy's job is to keep Annie safe, not to fight a tree wolf guy". I think the two court protectors are going to have their hands full getting as many people away from the fight as they are able. |
|
|
|
Post by mturtle7 on Aug 10, 2021 1:55:12 GMT
Well crud. This...actually feels like a rather cheap trope/tactic on Tom's part to make a despicable character (Aata) suddenly sympathetic, but it WORKS, dammit, and works well. Aata's progression of facial expressions, from determination to varying forms of surprise and then actual horror, is an absolute gut-punch, all the more so because he was always so frustratingly serene and cheerful in nearly all of his appearances up until now. Jeez...
|
|
|
|
Post by mturtle7 on Aug 10, 2021 2:04:53 GMT
Consider the fact that it was Shell who actually attacked Loup. He may not have realized that Aata was the agent in charge here, since he (Loup) was not privy to the conversation between Coyote, Annie, and Buddha-Aata. Loup has never been the sharpest tack in the drawer.
In other words, Loup may simply have lashed out at the person who seemed to be responsible for attacking him.
Oh goodness...I hadn't thought of it from that perspective AT ALL, but I suppose it is rather obvious, isn't it. Or rather, it would be obvious if we (and Annie, and Aata) hadn't been totally distracted by the time stop. To everyone not in the time stop, including Loup, she just threw that stupid stick at him like two seconds ago! |
|
|
|
Post by drmemory on Aug 10, 2021 3:04:29 GMT
Well crud. This...actually feels like a rather cheap trope/tactic on Tom's part to make a despicable character (Aata) suddenly sympathetic, but it WORKS, dammit, and works well. Aata's progression of facial expressions, from determination to varying forms of surprise and then actual horror, is an absolute gut-punch, all the more so because he was always so frustratingly serene and cheerful in nearly all of his appearances up until now. Jeez... Heh it doesn't really work so well on the old and cynical, such as myself. It's very possible for someone to be a horrible person and do terrible things, and thus be worthy of great scorn, while still being kind to puppies or whatever. If I see someone doing bad thing, bad thing, bad thing, really bad thing, then one human reaction that hints he might have a soul, that doesn't give him a pass on all those bad things! Heck, even Paz only did like one bad thing, and it was really more of a manipulative teenage girl thing rather than, say, trying to steal the power of a god. That is forgivable - she just needs to apologize and stop doing that and she's fine in my book. Aata has shown a bad pattern of behavior over a period of time, and if he feels bad because one of his schemes caused damage to one of the people he included in his plans and brought along and caused to be an active participant in said scheme... that doesn't buy him a lot with me. Like Coyote told him a minute or so ago, Loup was about to attack in rage and it would be all HIS fault. Aata's, that is. Even if he hadn't said that, it was fairly predictable - Annie got Loup to pause by throwing him the lake water but that really couldn't be expected to cause him to immediately become calm and more mature.
I'm not entirely sure we're even seeing Aata progress from "evil smug" to "concern for another person". There are other ways one could interpret his reaction, such as "I didn't realize she was standing behind me" or "oops, my plan to focus his attention on me if we didn't get his power didn't work". In short, it could be more of a startle reaction than compassion or fear for another person's well-being. Much less guilt. If he's even a person... I still suspect he may be something other than human. I still have no credible theory about his origin but I do have a strong feeling he's been around and manipulating events for a long time.
Frankly, none of this is Annie's problem. We know how she is and can be certain she'll do everything she can to help, but she didn't initiate any of this - it was Aata that inserted himself in the situation, and apparently did a lot of things to create the events that led to this situation.
We'll just have to see what Tom wants to show us. I think the next page or two is going to tell us a lot about Aata.
|
|
|
|
Post by rylfrazier on Aug 10, 2021 5:45:56 GMT
This is all happening in a very quick time period. I think Ata is using magic to protect himself and the death of a friend / fellow shadow man is the unintended consequence.
This is a critical moment in the comic - Coyote and Loup have always carried the threat of violence but this is the first time the game between Annie, Coyote, Loup and the Court have killed an innocent or relative innocent in the present. This feels like the end of Annie's innocence / young adulthood and transition to adulthood such as it is.
|
|
|
|
Post by warrl on Aug 10, 2021 6:31:39 GMT
Her name is George Parley. Her father is a great psychic and filled out the birth certificate in advance, but got one detail wrong. Her parents decided to not fix her name as well. I'm wondering if it caused some confusion when Andrew told his parents who he's in love with... |
|
|
|
Post by TBeholder on Aug 10, 2021 7:50:03 GMT
This puts the last page in an interesting light. I thought Loup's explosion just hit everyone in the radius indiscriminately. If his roots were targeted, does that mean he chose to attack Annie? Others have observed that she might have not been targeted exactly, but who then? Now that we know he doesn't lash out, it explains that, indeed. Loup sends only 2 spikes in Antimony's direction, and despite her standing closer, those are successfully neutralized by Eglamore. No way he would take either of these two less seriously than Aata's minions (presumably unaugmented humans). And for that matter, he didn't even really target Aata (who seems to be his primary opponent), only feinted at him. Thus it was also a tactical move: quick check, which pins Eglamore next to Annie (much less mobile and somewhat confused). And it's a fool's errand to play these games with Parley, so she is just… left standing there disoriented and on defense. |
|
|
|
Post by pyradonis on Aug 10, 2021 17:50:52 GMT
and if he feels bad because one of his schemes caused damage to one of the people he included in his plans and brought along and caused to be an active participant in said scheme... Interesting observation: Almost the same could be said about Annie since Jeanne was freed.
Her name is George Parley. Her father is a great psychic and filled out the birth certificate in advance, but got one detail wrong. Her parents decided to not fix her name as well. I'm wondering if it caused some confusion when Andrew told his parents who he's in love with... I know her name, I was quoting Red from the page I linked to.
Regarding possible confusion, he calls her Georgie, and might have introduced her like that as well. |
|
|
|
Post by SilverbackRon on Aug 10, 2021 18:26:14 GMT
My mind is stuck on topic of the upcoming reactions of Eglamore and Parley. Those two are the ones with the real power to DO something in the next few seconds. (Excepting Annie of course, as she could Flame-On, though I doubt that would do anything to cool the rage from Loup). Aata we have no idea what he can do. We know that Eglamore can grab one, possibly two people and leap away, zoom back to the court. We know Parley can teleport a sizeable group of people all at one go. Even if she just took them to the edge of the forest, they would be much safer than where they are right now. But it won't be easy. The largest number of people I can think of Parley teleporting at once was the team that went to fight Jeanne: Annie, Kat, Andrew, Robot, the two ex-fairies and herself of course. And that was simply from the top of the ravine down to the bottom, probably not more than a couple hundred meters considering she also had to go up/down stream to get to the right spot. For Parley to teleport people they have to be fairly close together. I think the Aata has set the Shadow Men up for disaster. I don't know if anyone ever got a clear count on how many Shadow Men are out here (I count at least 12 in addition to the two named leaders), but it is clear Aata and Shell were lining up the team, fairly evenly spaced out between the transmitter device at the forest edge on one end and Shell at or near the front. Parley might be able to grab a couple nearby, James launches out with Annie, but that leaves the rest of the people scattered along that line back to the court. They are going to be on their own for a bit. |
|
|
|
Post by laaaa on Aug 10, 2021 18:29:47 GMT
Nooooo not the one with the FACE
|
|
|
|
Post by DonDueed on Aug 10, 2021 18:36:57 GMT
and if he feels bad because one of his schemes caused damage to one of the people he included in his plans and brought along and caused to be an active participant in said scheme... Interesting observation: Almost the same could be said about Annie since Jeanne was freed.
Her name is George Parley. Her father is a great psychic and filled out the birth certificate in advance, but got one detail wrong. Her parents decided to not fix her name as well. I'm wondering if it caused some confusion when Andrew told his parents who he's in love with... I know her name, I was quoting Red from the page I linked to.
Regarding possible confusion, he calls her Georgie, and might have introduced her like that as well. Heck, when I was a kid I was confused by the song "Georgie Girl"!
Of course, Andrew could easily explain the name as a nickname for Georgia or Georgina, and/or as a mixup on the birth certificate (which is more or less true).
|
|
|
|
Post by DonDueed on Aug 10, 2021 18:42:10 GMT
Consider the fact that it was Shell who actually attacked Loup. He may not have realized that Aata was the agent in charge here, since he (Loup) was not privy to the conversation between Coyote, Annie, and Buddha-Aata. Loup has never been the sharpest tack in the drawer.
In other words, Loup may simply have lashed out at the person who seemed to be responsible for attacking him.
Oh goodness...I hadn't thought of it from that perspective AT ALL, but I suppose it is rather obvious, isn't it. Or rather, it would be obvious if we (and Annie, and Aata) hadn't been totally distracted by the time stop. To everyone not in the time stop, including Loup, she just threw that stupid stick at him like two seconds ago! Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Of course, Coyote might have said something there at the end of the time freeze, but it could just as easily have included "That woman tried to steal your power!" as anything else. |
|
|
|
Post by drmemory on Aug 12, 2021 2:13:13 GMT
and if he feels bad because one of his schemes caused damage to one of the people he included in his plans and brought along and caused to be an active participant in said scheme... Interesting observation: Almost the same could be said about Annie since Jeanne was freed.
Fair. Annie pulled a lot of people into the Jeanne situation. Of course, she told them all she knew about it, let them provide input to the plan, etc. She certainly didn't expect Andrew to get hurt! But then, nobody did - we know what was going on in Jeanne's head but nobody in the Scooby gang did. Not before, during, or after. But still, you certainly have a point. Red was rude about it afterwards but not entirely incorrect. Not that she's a model of maturity either. 
I think of that whole situation as a powerful but young girl figuring out how to get something done with the help of her friends, than an old, cynical, possibly very evil manipulator trying to lie, cheat and steal his way into more power. I hesitate to mention it because it could be turned around as well, but her motives were certainly good - she wanted to save a spirit that was unjustly imprisoned and unable to go to her rest. She ended up succeeding at that, and freed the elven lover as well for bonus karma points!
If there was manipulation going on in that whole thing, I have to point at the psychopomps, not at Annie.
|
|
