|
|
Post by Timberwere on Mar 1, 2021 8:15:01 GMT
Nice to see Zimmy and Gamma's quiet satisfaction with the budding romance here. |
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Mar 1, 2021 8:25:01 GMT
It's also nice to see that Zeta and Gamma, though they have their own problems, can either enjoy watching other people having fun or at the very least not resent seeing other people enjoying an activity they weren't participating in. I've blocked out most of my memories of dating around their age but I do recall being with girls who were unable to do so.
Still wondering what happened to the twins, though. I wonder if Zeta has arranged some sort of object lesson/learning experience for them to better understand themself or if just enough time has passed that they've simply wandered off.
|
|
|
|
Post by migrantworker on Mar 1, 2021 9:55:34 GMT
Kellin is breaking the Irial's Law of Attraction! ...or maybe she's just making sure the Kamlen's Necessary Condition is met. The beauty of the thing is, you never know...  |
|
|
|
Post by pyradonis on Mar 1, 2021 11:40:05 GMT
Still not getting it.
|
|
|
|
Post by TBeholder on Mar 1, 2021 12:20:48 GMT
Or Zimmy is sleeping and Gamma is half-asleep herself.
|
|
|
|
Post by ohthatone on Mar 1, 2021 12:29:31 GMT
Some nice quiet pages we have here.
So what eldritch horror are we going to find the Annies with...?
|
|
|
|
Post by noozoo on Mar 1, 2021 14:28:54 GMT
Me neither. Wondering if I should go back and re-read the last two months, or just give up. |
|
|
|
Post by ctso74 on Mar 1, 2021 15:49:43 GMT
I'm guessing, we're looking at an event, that happened before the ill-advised Zimmy chase.
So what eldritch horror are we going to find the Annies with...? Courtnie:"NO! NO! NOW, REY IS CRYING BLOOD! WHY?!" Rey:"Y͔̖̕o̫ų̗͚̥͓r̨ͅ ̶͚̫͕̳̬̪ͅf͉̥͞aͅt̺̠͔͍̖͟h̙e̙͎ŕ̮̰̩ ͍̖̲̤d͚̬̪̹̰͕̱i͇͍͉̻͔ḍ̺̪̰̠͉͘ ̞ṯ̵̱̣̺h̴i̶̠̝̦s̞͉͎̬͙̜͢"
Good times.
|
|
|
|
Post by Gemminie on Mar 1, 2021 17:00:46 GMT
It appears that Tam and Lise are interacting via the ball game – from what we've seen, Tam fancies Lise but is keeping his emotional distance for now. Then there's Kellin – it looks as if a blonde human girl and another tree girl are giving her some encouragement. Rob looks like he's taking a bit of a rest after some strenuous running about, and Kellin brings him one of these weird Court drinks that come in metal cans but are pretty good once you've figured out how they open. Rob looks appreciative; blushing conversation ensues. And again we see Gamma and Zimmy looking on, seemingly happy about this. Zimmy may believe herself undeserving of happiness, but apparently she can be happy for other people.
The blonde human girl is probably not Becky Ground; Becky's shade of blonde is lighter, and her hair was considerably shorter last time we saw her.
Is any of this really happening? How exactly did they leave Zimmingham? Do they remember their experience there? Or were they never actually in it at all – is everything we've been seeing in Zimmingham just from the Annies' point of view, with everyone else there just an illusion, fragments of Zimmy's personality mixed with behavior that Zimmy's observed the elf teens (and Renard) doing?
If that last is true, that might explain why we haven't seen the Annies – they're still in Zimmingham, and the tree kids have never really been in there at all. Perhaps the chapter began in Zimmingham, with its dark skies as opposed to the bright sunshine we see here, and the Annies were already inside from the start, and the tree kids we saw were already imaginary Zimmy illusions.
Or perhaps this is another illusion, something Zimmy and Gamma are imposing upon the elf kids' minds to see how things play out. If the Court's weather has really changed to the dark, threatening skies we saw early in the chapter, that's significant, because it contradicts Tony's observations of recent weather patterns. But if the weather remains clear in the real Court, that means the dark skies we saw weren't real, and the Annies were in the illusion from the very beginning. Of course, nothing prevents this sunny day we're seeing here from also being an illusion. What if the Annies are already out of Zimmingham, somewhere else?
The thing Zimmy can do to help the Annies? What if she does something crazy – like sending them to the alternate reality where Annie didn't come back from the Forest after going in to talk to Loup? Or merging them into one? Or showing them the It's a Wonderful Life world where they died after falling off the bridge and alternate-Kat is taking the Court in a dark direction? Or she permanently alters Forest Annie's favorite color to be green and Court Annie's to be purple so they won't argue over clothes ever again? We'll just have to see.
|
|
|
|
Post by mturtle7 on Mar 1, 2021 19:27:09 GMT
Me neither. Wondering if I should go back and re-read the last two months, or just give up. I'm not entirely sure what you two are trying to "get"...do you want a clear-cut explanation of how Zimmingham works? Because that's not really going to happen. I mean, I presume that soon enough, we'll find out where the Annies & Renard were/are, and maybe get a vague understanding of how they also got zapped into the illusion, but... Zimmy and Gamma themselves are never going to ENTIRELY make sense, because they literally live in their own separate reality most of the time. Think about the Spring Heeled incident for a moment - how exactly do you think that worked? How did Zimmy & Gamma get on the roof? Why was Annie only zapped into Zimmingham when she opened the door? How come they did all that walking and climbing around, but when the rain fell they were just on the roof again? Or the Divine incident - was that all literally inside Kat's dream? Or did it just feel like it to her? If it was just Kat's dream, where did Gamma go when she left the room? If it was reality, how did Zimmy & Gamma actually get in and out of the room?
Personally, I feel like we're being given precisely enough information to understand the story here. Zimmy freaked out because she was scared of this "Omega" stuff taking Gamma away from her, so she started reliving that traumatic beating by pretending these 4 elf kids she saw playing soccer were actually her tormentors (they still acted more or less like themselves, just versions of themselves who would beat up a kid for being a demon). Then the Annies and Renard accidentally got sucked up into the madness, and Annie went through this scenario where she's helping some of these elf kids go through Zimmingham, and then she finds her mom as a Nobody and Zimmy's emotional turmoil starts spilling out through her. Meanwhile, Renard had a chat with Gamma until she could finally find Zimmy and talk her down (turns out Zimmy was watching all this happen, but thought she was Tam instead of herself). So now things are resolved, and Zimmy and Gamma are just watching the kids play soccer. There's not really that much more to "get", except for what happened to the Annies & Renard, which like I said, we'll probably be learning soon.
I hope something in there somewhere cleared things up for you guys, or at least helped you get comfortable with your confusion.
|
|
|
|
Post by mturtle7 on Mar 1, 2021 19:36:27 GMT
Also, I really like how Zimmy and Gamma are clearly just a couple of overly romantic dorks who just start gushing at every adorable budding teenage romance they can possibly find. And they really do seem to have a knack for finding them, even before the kids involved have admitted it to themselves. |
|
|
|
Post by pyradonis on Mar 1, 2021 21:09:44 GMT
I'm not entirely sure what you two are trying to "get" Right now I am trying to make sense if the last two pages happen before or after the rest, if they happen at all, if what we saw before was just a dream, if what we are seeing now is just a dream, if both are dreams etc. etc. etc. you know what I mean. I guess they took the stairs? As seen in "Torn Sea", an Etheric distortion has borders that can be crossed under circumstances. In "Power Station", Zimmy explained they were not moving around in the physical world, which was proven when the illusion ended and everyone was still standing in the same spots. I see no reason why it should have been different in "Spring Heeled". While, yes, I have no idea about most of what happened in "Divine" either, and I'm not exactly...satisfied with that.  See above. And also, see most other posts in this thread and the previous one. What we have seen on the current page and the one before is so out of place from the rest that right now it's totally unclear what does/did happen when and where and if it was real or not. I didn't even intend to complain about that, mind you. The chapter is not finished yet. It's more that I enjoy talking about every new page on here, but right now I can't say anything, because I have no idea how these two pages fit with the rest of the chapter. |
|
|
|
Post by fia on Mar 1, 2021 21:17:11 GMT
I'm not entirely sure what you two are trying to "get" Right now I am trying to make sense if the last two pages happen before or after the rest, if they happen at all, if what we saw before was just a dream, if what we are seeing now is just a dream, if both are dreams etc. etc. etc. you know what I mean.  Just think laterally, not literally. Dreams don't occur in a clear succession of events, and I take it that's how the ether-psyche-Zimmyverse works too. Maybe they were thoughts occurring to Zimmy before/during, things she was imagining that manifested in some real way because of her abilities, or they were events anticipating what might happen later, or it happened at the same time. What we can tell from this I think is that either the elf kids were not involved at all that they consciously remember, or they are not involved yet. My money's on the former, just because I think the elf-kids in Zimmyham were described as kind of like projections by Gamma. So like, Zimmy or Annie saw them at some point, and projected traits onto them, some mixed with reality, but maybe separate from the elves themselves being aware of it. Different from Annie and Jack, who seem to be deeply aware of changes in the ether when they happen around them. And Annie seems able to affect the ether in turn based on what she's thinking about (or maybe that's specifically a power she 'borrows' or amplifies or something from Zimmy). |
|
|
|
Post by arf on Mar 2, 2021 0:28:31 GMT
Some nice quiet pages we have here. So what eldritch horror are we going to find the Annies with...? End of chapter sign with this pair* sitting bolt upright: "Annies!"Extra page shows Annies still in the toyshop furiously hurling Zimmingham teds at each other. * Well, Gamma at least. |
|
|
|
Post by DonDueed on Mar 2, 2021 3:29:11 GMT
I'm not entirely sure what you two are trying to "get" Right now I am trying to make sense if the last two pages happen before or after the rest, if they happen at all, if what we saw before was just a dream, if what we are seeing now is just a dream, if both are dreams etc. etc. etc. you know what I mean. While I can't really offer anything but conjecture regarding these specific questions, the fact that you raise them at all is remarkable.
There are very few storytellers in any medium who can produce such delicious ambiguities in such a seemingly effortless way. Here we have two full pages without dialog, but still communicating emotionally while (presumably) moving the plot along -- though we have to wait a bit to determine which direction it's taking. But the overall story has primed us with enough twists and surprises that we can't even nail down where these pages fit in the narrative.
Astonishing work, Tom.
|
|
|
|
Post by drmemory on Mar 2, 2021 5:04:59 GMT
Zimmy: "I know something that will help Carver understand herself a little better!"
*Takes everyone out of Zimmyland but the Annies, leaving them work out their differences via uninterrupted fighting*
|
|
|
|
Post by Gemminie on Mar 2, 2021 5:26:43 GMT
Right now I am trying to make sense if the last two pages happen before or after the rest, if they happen at all, if what we saw before was just a dream, if what we are seeing now is just a dream, if both are dreams etc. etc. etc. you know what I mean. While I can't really offer anything but conjecture regarding these specific questions, the fact that you raise them at all is remarkable.
There are very few storytellers in any medium who can produce such delicious ambiguities in such a seemingly effortless way. Here we have two full pages without dialog, but still communicating emotionally while (presumably) moving the plot along -- though we have to wait a bit to determine which direction it's taking. But the overall story has primed us with enough twists and surprises that we can't even nail down where these pages fit in the narrative.
Astonishing work, Tom.
I agree! I read GC because it just invites so much speculation about what's actually happening. And then something gets explained, in such a way that it raises even more questions. It's so confusing, but at the same time it makes so much sense. Zimmy: "I know something that will help Carver understand herself a little better!" *Takes everyone out of Zimmyland but the Annies, leaving them work out their differences via uninterrupted fighting* Well, just about anything could be happening to the Annies right now – since we aren't looking at them, anything we see them doing next could easily be "Meanwhile ..." |
|
|
|
Post by Gemminie on Mar 2, 2021 5:44:29 GMT
Right now I am trying to make sense if the last two pages happen before or after the rest, if they happen at all, if what we saw before was just a dream, if what we are seeing now is just a dream, if both are dreams etc. etc. etc. you know what I mean. Just think laterally, not literally. Dreams don't occur in a clear succession of events, and I take it that's how the ether-psyche-Zimmyverse works too. Maybe they were thoughts occurring to Zimmy before/during, things she was imagining that manifested in some real way because of her abilities, or they were events anticipating what might happen later, or it happened at the same time. What we can tell from this I think is that either the elf kids were not involved at all that they consciously remember, or they are not involved yet. My money's on the former, just because I think the elf-kids in Zimmyham were described as kind of like projections by Gamma. So like, Zimmy or Annie saw them at some point, and projected traits onto them, some mixed with reality, but maybe separate from the elves themselves being aware of it. Different from Annie and Jack, who seem to be deeply aware of changes in the ether when they happen around them. And Annie seems able to affect the ether in turn based on what she's thinking about (or maybe that's specifically a power she 'borrows' or amplifies or something from Zimmy). Yes, at this point I think that in the thing we call "reality" Zimmy and Gamma have been sitting there, just like that, the whole time – well not just like that; maybe their facial expressions changed or they moved a few inches apart and then back together. Zimmy saw the teens and had a flashback to being chased by teenagers, with these ones playing the parts. She was so upset and the flashback was so intense that she emotionally shut Gamma out of it. And in the midst of that, the Annies and Renard walked into range, physically or ethereally or both. The Annies got swept up in the scenario and altered it in turn, while Renard, a different kind of being, remained on the ethereal outside, along with Gamma. Until finally the flashback ended, Zimmy calmed down enough to let Gamma in, and here we are. The Annies, I suspect, have been in a sort of Zimmingham-within-Zimmingham, a scenario that they created, rather than Zimmy, based on their expectations. So what's going to happen to them now that Zimmy's calmed down and her flashback's over? I guess we'll see. What's Zimmy know that will "help Carver understand herself better?" I wonder if it's got something to do with masks and makeup, or the identity of the fire spirit that's her soul. Could she have a real conversation with her mother, considering that her mother is actually inside her, in a way? |
|
|
|
Post by aline on Mar 2, 2021 6:53:57 GMT
I am reminded of the chapter "Divine", when Zimmy and Gamma not only saved Annie's life but also helped Kat feel less stressed about her brand new lesbian relationship.
It seems those two frequently undo those kind of knots in others, like particularly creepy guardian angels.
|
|
|
|
Post by mturtle7 on Mar 2, 2021 7:50:00 GMT
I'm not entirely sure what you two are trying to "get" Right now I am trying to make sense if the last two pages happen before or after the rest, if they happen at all, if what we saw before was just a dream, if what we are seeing now is just a dream, if both are dreams etc. etc. etc. you know what I mean. I guess they took the stairs? As seen in "Torn Sea", an Etheric distortion has borders that can be crossed under circumstances. In "Power Station", Zimmy explained they were not moving around in the physical world, which was proven when the illusion ended and everyone was still standing in the same spots. I see no reason why it should have been different in "Spring Heeled". While, yes, I have no idea about most of what happened in "Divine" either, and I'm not exactly...satisfied with that. See above. And also, see most other posts in this thread and the previous one What we have seen on the current page and the one before that is so out of place from the rest that right now it's totally unclear what does/did happen when and where and if it was real or not. I didn't even intend to complain about that, mind you. The chapter is not finished yet. It's more that I enjoy talking about every new page on here, but right now I can't say anything, because I have no idea how these two pages fit with the rest of the chapter. You know, that's actually pretty fair. I'm really sorry; I think I got a little too triggered because you seemed to be complaining about a part of Tom's style I really like, and ended up acting kind of condescending and dismissive. I still like the way this chapter is going, and feel mostly satisfied with the last couple of pages, but I can totally understand you not feeling the same way now. |
|
|
|
Post by pyradonis on Mar 2, 2021 9:44:15 GMT
I am reminded of the chapter "Divine", when Zimmy and Gamma not only saved Annie's life but also helped Kat feel less stressed about her brand new lesbian relationship. It seems those two frewuently undo those kind of knots in others, like particularly creepy guardian angels. Brand new relationship? Kat didn't get the love letter until 3 chapters later...
Just think laterally, not literally. Dreams don't occur in a clear succession of events, and I take it that's how the ether-psyche-Zimmyverse works too. I know, but that doesn't help as long as I don't know what was even part of the dream. 
Yes, at this point I think that in the thing we call "reality" Zimmy and Gamma have been sitting there, just like that, the whole time – well not just like that; maybe their facial expressions changed or they moved a few inches apart and then back together. Zimmy saw the teens and had a flashback to being chased by teenagers, with these ones playing the parts. She was so upset and the flashback was so intense that she emotionally shut Gamma out of it. And in the midst of that, the Annies and Renard walked into range, physically or ethereally or both. The Annies got swept up in the scenario and altered it in turn, while Renard, a different kind of being, remained on the ethereal outside, along with Gamma. Until finally the flashback ended, Zimmy calmed down enough to let Gamma in, and here we are. The Annies, I suspect, have been in a sort of Zimmingham-within-Zimmingham, a scenario that they created, rather than Zimmy, based on their expectations. So you mean that while they have been sitting on that wall, another fake Zimmy ran into the Annies, who got brought into Zimmingham without even having seen the real Zimmy, but all of the kids playing football next to her were unaffected? And how do all of Zimmy's insecurities ("she don't deserve Gamma" etc.) fit into this? ...eh, here's to hoping today's page clears something up.
You know, that's actually pretty fair. I'm really sorry; I think I got a little too triggered because you seemed to be complaining about a part of Tom's style I really like, and ended up acting kind of condescending and dismissive. I still like the way this chapter is going, and feel mostly satisfied with the last couple of pages, but I can totally understand you not feeling the same way now. Don't worry about that. Spending time having discussions about the comic in this forum with you guys is one of the few comforting pastimes I have left in these times, so I was just sort of disappointed I couldn't find anything to say. |
|
|
|
Post by blahzor on Mar 2, 2021 9:52:45 GMT
Seeing as Zimmy can see inside people's mind while Gamma sleeps in certain she keeps talking to her
|
|
|
|
Post by speedwell on Mar 2, 2021 9:55:10 GMT
I got two things out of this actually... the first is that this is after the Zimmy-world sequence, and the romantic gestures we see on this page are a result of the kids being forced to confront their feelings, much as Parley was forced to confront hers in Jeanne-world. The second is that Zimmy is a damaged version of a sentimental dork and Gamma is actually the hard-headed practical member of the duo (though wiser, healthier, and more mature in many ways), and it's Zimmy's idea that Annie(s) need(s) to confront her (their) blocked feelings about pair bonding, and part of the Zimmy-world sequence represents Zimmy's compassion toward Annie. Gotta face it, in most of the significant moments we see about Zimmy, she is putting the needs of others first, and this is increasing.
Not entirely tangentially, I doubt very much Annie is literally asexual or meant to be; the element of fire is a symbol, if not the foremost symbol, for sexual passion in the alchemical tradition.
|
|
|
|
Post by Gemminie on Mar 2, 2021 19:19:49 GMT
Yes, at this point I think that in the thing we call "reality" Zimmy and Gamma have been sitting there, just like that, the whole time – well not just like that; maybe their facial expressions changed or they moved a few inches apart and then back together. Zimmy saw the teens and had a flashback to being chased by teenagers, with these ones playing the parts. She was so upset and the flashback was so intense that she emotionally shut Gamma out of it. And in the midst of that, the Annies and Renard walked into range, physically or ethereally or both. The Annies got swept up in the scenario and altered it in turn, while Renard, a different kind of being, remained on the ethereal outside, along with Gamma. Until finally the flashback ended, Zimmy calmed down enough to let Gamma in, and here we are. The Annies, I suspect, have been in a sort of Zimmingham-within-Zimmingham, a scenario that they created, rather than Zimmy, based on their expectations. So you mean that while they have been sitting on that wall, another fake Zimmy ran into the Annies, who got brought into Zimmingham without even having seen the real Zimmy, but all of the kids playing football next to her were unaffected? And how do all of Zimmy's insecurities ("she don't deserve Gamma" etc.) fit into this? ...eh, here's to hoping today's page clears something up. Well, not "another fake Zimmy," but rather, the part of Zimmy that was experiencing the flashback. She was physically on the wall, or so my theory goes, but in the flashback she was running from the teens in her memory. And then along came the Annies and Renard, who somehow got swept up in it. How were the teens playing football right in front of Zimmy not affected? Um, I don't know, really. Only certain other people have ever gotten swept up into a Zimmingham excursion. Maybe you have to have a certain affinity for it – you have to be tuned into the right frequency or something. Zimmy's insecurities may fit into this because at some level she believes she deserved to be chased and beaten up by those teens years ago, which ties into how she feels as if she doesn't deserve happiness because of that unspecified bad thing she did before she met Gamma, so the flashback is just a carnival for her feelings of self-loathing. |
|
Just think laterally, not literally. 
