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Post by blazingstar on Mar 20, 2018 14:36:20 GMT
Something that just occurred to me... He is talking to himself...so which language is he using? A God should be able to speak any language. But which language do they prefer to hear themselves talk? And which language do they speak among each other? I assume a God's preferred language is that of the people who first created them. But what language does a fusion God prefer? And in which did they communicate before? English? A Native American language? Barks, yips and growls? The common language of the Forest? Or each their own, because as Gods, of course they understand everything the other says? I've always assumed that the ether transcends language, and etheric creatures (including Gods) communicate by thought, with the thoughts being translated into the native language of whoever can hear. Because, you know, magic. For example, I doubt Coyote would use the word abalone, being derived from Spanish roots; he'd probably use a Native American term. There are a thousand translations for "demon", and we don't know which one Reynard means. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2018 17:47:08 GMT
"I learnt about their lives, their homes, their languages"Coyote probably speaks English to those who understand it, which includes the readers, of whom he is possibly aware. If the psychopomps can put time on hold, as mentioned in that page, technically nothing stops them from learning how to translate from one language to another (translating from thought into language is much more artful). Related question: who would have their soul sent off by Veles these days? Edit: Of course, Mort was claimed by [the] Ankou. I can't tell why; possibly because he was "first to die" in that particular German bombing. In any case, the psychopomp is apparently not chosen consciously (maybe that only holds for children). "Abalone" does not have Spanish roots; it was only transmitted via Spanish.Jones presumably speaks all languages she has ever heard, enjoying as she must a perfect memory, and I assume she doesn't consider any of them native. Case in point: Some time before "The Stone", Tom was asked what kind of accent his characters speak English with; Annie's was described as "light Yorkshire" iirc (and compared, of course, to Kate Rusby's). Jones was placed at the end of the list, with this description: "None".
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 20, 2018 22:24:20 GMT
Something that just occurred to me... He is talking to himself...so which language is he using? A God should be able to speak any language. But which language do they prefer to hear themselves talk? And which language do they speak among each other? I assume a God's preferred language is that of the people who first created them. But what language does a fusion God prefer? And in which did they communicate before? English? A Native American language? Barks, yips and growls? The common language of the Forest? Or each their own, because as Gods, of course they understand everything the other says? I've always assumed that the ether transcends language, and etheric creatures (including Gods) communicate by thought, with the thoughts being translated into the native language of whoever can hear. Because, you know, magic. For example, I doubt Coyote would use the word abalone, being derived from Spanish roots; he'd probably use a Native American term. There are a thousand translations for "demon", and we don't know which one Reynard means. Woah, until now I never realized that "abalone" is an actual word, I actually thought he had misheard Antimony's name when she had introduced herself.  But why did he call her by that word, then? |
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Post by Zox Tomana on Mar 20, 2018 23:05:25 GMT
I've always assumed that the ether transcends language, and etheric creatures (including Gods) communicate by thought, with the thoughts being translated into the native language of whoever can hear. Because, you know, magic. For example, I doubt Coyote would use the word abalone, being derived from Spanish roots; he'd probably use a Native American term. There are a thousand translations for "demon", and we don't know which one Reynard means. Woah, until now I never realized that "abalone" is an actual word, I actually thought he had misheard Antimony's name when she had introduced herself. But why did he call her by that word, then? Especially since an abalone is a kind of mollusk  |
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Post by todd on Mar 21, 2018 0:12:25 GMT
I didn't say he's a short-time thinker, I said he's an opportunist. Yes, he's been messing with Ysengrin for a long time with the hope to use that someday. But I don't believe he predicted this particular outcome when he messed with his memories, or when Ysengrin dropped those seeds back in chapter 14. I also don't believe he had some grand plan to make Annie free Jeanne like some people have suggested. I'm pretty sure he saw Annie as someone who would stir things up, someone who wouldn't just do as she's told, and kept her around because of that. But he didn't calculate every little thing. And Coyote's admitted, in the stories about him, to making goof-ups (the creation of the Shadow Men, or putting the stars in the sky). I think Coyote would have to have a lot more control or foresight than would be feasible for the story to have these events turn out exactly the way he planned them. |
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Post by fia on Mar 21, 2018 0:28:59 GMT
Woah, until now I never realized that "abalone" is an actual word, I actually thought he had misheard Antimony's name when she had introduced herself. But why did he call her by that word, then? Especially since an abalone is a kind of mollusk I thought it was because she is small and encloses herself in a shell... maybe? As for the seeds. Are we to expect a beanstalk to grow soon? And Jack to climb it? |
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Post by arf on Mar 21, 2018 0:34:54 GMT
I wonder if Ysengrin has only just recalled the seeds. He was 'misbehaving' at the time. Coyote had to knock him out and carry him off.
'Abalone' actually comes *through* Spanish from American Indians around Monterey Bay. It has meanings other than a shelfish. Coyote's use of the term to a 12 yo schoolgirl after also misbehaving was definitely not kosher. I note he hasn't used it since.
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Post by arf on Mar 21, 2018 0:42:05 GMT
As for the seeds. Are we to expect a beanstalk to grow soon? And Jack to climb it? Time for some "Adventure"! > add water > You water the plant. ... the tiny plant bursts into furious growth. You are standing in the Court's Botany Laboratory. From a broken glass case, a six foot beanstalk is bellowing "WATER! WATER!" >_ |
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Post by fia on Mar 21, 2018 1:57:12 GMT
I reiterate the hypothesis that Coyogrin is more Coyote than Ysengrin, on the basis that he has black and not green eyes. Eyes are the windows to the soul, n'est-ce pas? |
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Post by jda on Mar 21, 2018 6:58:04 GMT
Especially since an abalone is a kind of mollusk I thought it was because she is small and encloses herself in a shell... maybe? As for the seeds. Are we to expect a beanstalk to grow soon? And Jack to climb it? Tom has spoken. www.chrysoprax.org/gunnerkrigg/results?term=abalone |
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Post by calpal on Mar 21, 2018 17:02:48 GMT
Especially since an abalone is a kind of mollusk I thought it was because she is small and encloses herself in a shell... maybe? As for the seeds. Are we to expect a beanstalk to grow soon? And Jack to climb it? I... I think Coyote was making a joke there... a bad joke, of sorts  |
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Post by Nnelg on Mar 21, 2018 17:04:29 GMT
Why the hell didn't they destroy those seeds. |
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Post by Runningflame on Mar 21, 2018 20:31:08 GMT
"I learnt about their lives, their homes, their languages"Coyote probably speaks English to those who understand it, which includes the readers, of whom he is possibly aware. If the psychopomps can put time on hold, as mentioned in that page, technically nothing stops them from learning how to translate from one language to another (translating from thought into language is much more artful). Related question: who would have their soul sent off by Veles these days? Edit: Of course, Mort was claimed by [the] Ankou. I can't tell why; possibly because he was "first to die" in that particular German bombing. In any case, the psychopomp is apparently not chosen consciously (maybe that only holds for children). "Abalone" does not have Spanish roots; it was only transmitted via Spanish.Jones presumably speaks all languages she has ever heard, enjoying as she must a perfect memory, and I assume she doesn't consider any of them native. Case in point: Some time before "The Stone", Tom was asked what kind of accent his characters speak English with; Annie's was described as "light Yorkshire" iirc (and compared, of course, to Kate Rusby's). Jones was placed at the end of the list, with this description: "None". I would add that "abalone" is only a plausible pun for "Antimony" in English, given that both words are pronounced rather differently (and differently from each other) in Spanish or any other language. |
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Post by pyradonis on Mar 21, 2018 20:36:22 GMT
Double woah, so it IS a word, but Coyote DID simply mispronounce her name. |
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Post by blazingstar on Mar 21, 2018 20:48:03 GMT
And all this time I thought it was because abalone is a precious shell, the source for mother-of-pearl. I thought he was calling her a cute endearing term, like "pearl" or "honey" or something like that. |
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Post by saardvark on Mar 22, 2018 12:50:16 GMT
And all this time I thought it was because abalone is a precious shell, the source for mother-of-pearl. I thought he was calling her a cute endearing term, like "pearl" or "honey" or something like that. I think he was probably doing all of the above, being the sly Trickster he is.... EDIT: meaning, it was a playful "mistake" which both complemented her as something precious, but also tweaked her as very guarded (self-enclosed in a shell) |
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Post by keef on Mar 22, 2018 23:12:28 GMT
And all this time I thought it was because abalone is a precious shell, the source for mother-of-pearl. I thought he was calling her a cute endearing term, like "pearl" or "honey" or something like that. I want to believe Tom Siddell hardly knows the god he has created. Does Tom write Coyote, or... |
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Post by jda on Mar 22, 2018 23:44:08 GMT
And all this time I thought it was because abalone is a precious shell, the source for mother-of-pearl. I thought he was calling her a cute endearing term, like "pearl" or "honey" or something like that. I want to believe Tom Siddell hardly knows the god he has created. Does Tom write Coyote, or... Heresy! Heresy! The sacred Word of Tom woould never fail us! Unless he remembers he is Coyote too! |
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Post by todd on Mar 23, 2018 0:10:21 GMT
I think that it's just a case of the readers overanalyzing the line, and that Tom never intended it to be more than a throwaway bit.
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Post by saardvark on Mar 23, 2018 1:49:30 GMT
I think that it's just a case of the readers overanalyzing the line, and that Tom never intended it to be more than a throwaway bit. overanalyze? *US*? nevaaah.... |
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Post by faiiry on Mar 23, 2018 2:04:16 GMT
I never thought the whole abalone thing was anything more than a simple joke. Coyote is trolling her by calling her something she's not. He's just pulling a Walter.
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Post by The Anarch on Mar 30, 2018 14:19:29 GMT
Ah, baloney.
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Post by jda on Apr 2, 2018 5:32:02 GMT
Just quick note: THOSE BETTER NOT BE IN ANY LAB PAZ IS WORKING IN, BECAUSE IF SHE GETS HURT, Well,they were not, thankfully. |
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But why did he call her by that word, then?
