[283] Story Discussion - Such lame excuses

[Mezzaphor]

Early update.

"Someone's not being honest"? Tom has said that, under the contract of ownership, Rey can't lie to Antimony, but does this mean he can't lie to other people? His line in the last panel seems like he's trying to be evasive without actually lying.

Coyote seemed nice at first (just like his cousin), but in these last two pages he's becoming increasingly creepy. Panel four is nightmare fuel.

[mudmaniac]

I remember some asian folklore where the longer someones neck, the bigger the scheme or lie they are planning.

[fjodor]

Oh boy. Anyone share my feeling that Annie'd better step away from Coyote, like, right now?

[todd]

So it turns out that the possessed Robot's errand was not to assassinate Reynardine (as I'd assumed), but to bring him back to the forest.

I agree that Coyote's renewed interest in Annie is getting creepy. (Though the good news is that the conference has been detoured from the trouble between the Court and the Wood that her actions have unintentionally brought about, at least for the moment. I had wondered - and even worried - about the possibility that everyone would find out that Annie's sending Robot across the bridge had led to these problems, with the result that she'd have both the forest-folk and the faculty angry with her - even leading to her either getting turned over to Ysengrin and Coyote to avert a war, expelled, or at the least, placed under such intense supervision that she'd have no more opportunity for further adventures, any of which would make it difficult to continue the story. But now Coyote, at the least, is paying more attention to Reynardine than to the forest's grievances; I wonder if Reynardine deliberately planned his entrance for the purpose of distracting the Wood's emissaries from Annie. Particularly since he showed up immediately after her involvement with the "dead" Tic-Toc Bird was revealed.)

[UbiquitousDragon]

mudmaniac said:

I remember some asian folklore where the longer someones neck, the bigger the scheme or lie they are planning.

Whatever it means it makes the Coyote very creepy! In panel 4, his ears almost look like horns.

With Rey saying he broke their laws, he seems to be referring to the Court, so does this mean he's bound to the Court, or is it just as the Coyote says: a lame excuse? Makes me wonder which laws he broke, murder?

[nikita]

I'm not sure. If he broke the laws of the court, he'd probably don't care at all. Even though he murdered people all the times (each time when switching his body).
So it's either a very lame excuse or he actually broke some laws of the forest.

[shishio]

fjodor said:

Oh boy. Anyone share my feeling that Annie'd better step away from Coyote, like, right now?

I'm not sure how much good that would do. I mean, if he really wants to hurt her, it's not like she can outrun him, so she'll just have to hope that Coyote won't go that far (For fear of starting a war at this time.) or hope that the Hedmaster/Eglamore/someone else can protect her.

I like Todd's theory, but perhaps Reynardine is meant to be a spy for the forest. And this is a staged performance to lower everyone's guard by showing that Reynardine doesn't like Coyote, which may, in addition to the fact that he knows him, may make the Court more trusting of him.

[Count Casimir]

Their conversation is code for "I don't have enough information to return yet!"

Coyote is a creeeeper. I don't think he's trying to hurt Annie quite yet, though, just trying to convince Reynardine to spill the beans.

EDIT: Rey says he broke their laws, and he couldn't LEAVE if he wanted to (as opposed to return). That makes it far more likely he's talking about the Court.

[AluK]

Coyote seems to imply that Reynardine is bound to Annie in some way. Either he's suspicious of the ownership bond that Annie has over Reynardine or that he might have some kind of affective bond.

From the way he talked about Surma, one could guess many things.

[Riess]

Anyone else think we're in for another laughing fit once Coyote learns that Annie owns Renard now?

[fjodor]

riess said:

Anyone else think we're in for another laughing fit once Coyote learns that Annie owns Renard now?

Teeheehee.... yeah...I guess he'll have a major fit ;D

[fuzzysocks]

shishio said:

fjodor said:

Oh boy. Anyone share my feeling that Annie'd better step away from Coyote, like, right now?

I'm not sure how much good that would do. I mean, if he really wants to hurt her, it's not like she can outrun him, so she'll just have to hope that Coyote won't go that far (For fear of starting a war at this time.) or hope that the Hedmaster/Eglamore/someone else can protect her.

I like Todd's theory, but perhaps Reynardine is meant to be a spy for the forest. And this is a staged performance to lower everyone's guard by showing that Reynardine doesn't like Coyote, which may, in addition to the fact that he knows him, may make the Court more trusting of him.

I don't think that's true... while in all speculation Reynardine COULD be a spy, his personality seems more or less not obligated to anyone but himself. Even in his childish banter that has nothing to do with the forest it always seems directed towards his own personal satisfaction.

I don't think he's a spy... he just doesn't seem the spying type.

[aoeniac]

All this talk about how Coyote is creepy when he's excited made me realize that between Ysengrin, Annie, and Reynardine, Coyote's the only one who isn't casting a shadow!

Now that could merely be a result of his supposed godhood or how his people are similar to shadows, but it still makes him a little more frightful.

Although he seems more like the kind of person who doesn't necessarily have explicitly bad intentions, but is just naturally creepy.


And I suspect Coyote already knows Reynardine is bound to Antimony. I mean, as foolish as he appears, he's probably very knowledgeable about magic and alchemy, having attempted to create his own race of people and all that! It doesn't help that Reynardine has the antimony symbol branded on his forehead, which is probably similar to Surma's (Stibnite). And we already know Surma is very familiar to the forest folk, and perhaps Coyote knew something or other about Reynardine's past with his poor Surma...

[todd]

Coyote also seems to be either easily distracted or else uninterested in the diplomatic tensions between the Court and the Wood that the meeting is (officially) about. Almost all of his comments have been directed towards other topics: his creation of the shadow-folk, Annie's parentage, Reynardine, etc.

Ysengrin has been far more focused (even showing impatience over Coyote's digressions) about the purpose of their visit to the Court (though he then weakened his case by jumping to the conclusion that Annie's discarded sweater belonged to Anthony, making himself look ridiculous in the eyes of the Headmaster, at least).

[Mezzaphor]

An odd thought that occurred to me: Of our unholy trinity of magic canines, not one of them looks like himself. Reynardine, the fox, fluctuates between looking like a wolf and looking like a teddy bear. Ysengrin is more tree than wolf now. And Coyote looks like a horse-dog hybrid straight out of a surrealist painting. Of course, Rey and Y have changed their external appearance, while there's no evidence yet that Coyote looked any different originally.

I gotta agree with aoemiac, Coyote is most likely very intelligent and cunning. He'd be a very poor Trickster if he weren't. The "Fool" persona he's presented so far might just be an act, to make others underestimate him. As for whether he's smart enough to know that Rey is under Annie's control, that's anyone's guess.

As for the fact that Coyote and Ysengrin seem to have different agendas, I suspect that Coyote's sphere of authority extends beyond Gillitie, and the General is Coyote's officer in charge of the Wood. So Gillitie business means the world to Ysengrin, while Coyote has bigger things on his mind. Or Coyote trusts the General to do his job, and merely came along to the meeting to satisfy his own curiosity about the goings-on in the Court.

[nikita]

*He throws a shadow here: www.gunnerkrigg.com/archive_page.php?comicID=278 Maybe Tom just didn't notice this mistake - if it is one.

Suppose Coyote isn't even really there, but only his spirit or something. His appearance isn't normal after all. He has some kind of glow around him (green in the first page of the chapter, red after that), he doesn't seem to have a shadow* and, for a wolf living in the forest, he looks incredibly clean. There's no trace of dust or dirt on his feet or his black "skin".
He also doesn't seem to be of some known solid material - stretching his neck this long didn't even make a sound.

Maybe ordinary people aren't able to see him, unless he wants it?
That'd explain why noone ever talks directly to Coyote except Annie. Noone seems to react to his actions either (except the 3 mediums.. media?)

[ceezedby]

Coyote actually appears to be the source of illumination for the shadows cast by A, R & Y in this little drama. And has been the case for a few pages. But not when he first appeared. Coyote's divinity (spirit-ness) is perhaps becoming more overt? Are we about to witness a god-out?

[aoeniac]

Hey you're right it does kind of look like he's the light source by the way their shadows are cast.

[todd]

Connected to Mezzaphor's post (but based on a speculation that I'd had since last evening):

Maybe the real reason for Coyote's visit is a second attempt to get Reynardine to return to Gillitie Wood (this time by urging him to do so rather than by kidnapping him), and the remains of the Tic-Toc Bird were just a pretext. (Though I believe that, if this is the case, Ysengrin doesn't know that; he strikes me as anything but guileful.)