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Post by eightyfour on May 3, 2010 8:03:57 GMT
However, Jack really did think that Annie would come with him after trapping Reynardine. He really thought he had her figured out. Of course he did. In Jack's mind, he is the hero. Annie would probably be something like the Damsel in Distress (i.e. rescuing her from Reynardine).
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Post by hal9000 on May 3, 2010 8:06:11 GMT
That's not option 3, that's option 2 that I said. And my point was that since Annie can spoil said plan to get Rey blamed, and put the authorities right back on Jack's trail, I'm surprised that he didn't force her to come with him (grab her and take off) or otherwise... incapacitate her from blabbing, like he did Rey. You know, from what he's said here, and how he reacted to being told off by Annie, I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that he genuinely thought taking rey out would be doing her a favor.
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Post by Mezzaphor on May 3, 2010 8:10:52 GMT
That's not option 3, that's option 2 that I said. And my point was that since Annie can spoil said plan to get Rey blamed, and put the authorities right back on Jack's trail, I'm surprised that he didn't force her to come with him (grab her and take off) or otherwise... incapacitate her from blabbing, like he did Rey. I thought it was well-established that Jack's not at full mental capacity. Failing to consider the consequences of every possible course of action is to be expected. I see two possible scenarios here: One, he turns on the Power Station to try to draw out Zimmy, and brings Annie and Rey along to take the blame if the authorities come, using them to delay the authorities while he flies around looking for Zimmy. Two, he turns on the Power Station with them present for no other reason than to draw the authorities to this location, trap Rey there and get him blamed, to free him up to go look for Zimmy. The only difference is whether turning on the Power Station was half plan half ruse, or just all ruse. Upon further thought, I still think scenario one is more likely. Because the one time that Jack mentions turning on the power station to attract Zimmy, he's not talking to Annie. He's babbling to himself, in full-on mad scientist mode.
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Post by thelizard on May 3, 2010 8:24:04 GMT
Also, made this side by side for the wiki. Nice! There's another good smiling Jack in #715 if it needs extending.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2010 8:37:04 GMT
Of course he did. In Jack's mind, he is the hero. Annie would probably be something like the Damsel in Distress (i.e. rescuing her from Reynardine). Damn, thank you! It's great to know somebody else sees that, eightyfour! Seriously! Doesn't it come off like Jack really did want Annie's help? I don't necessarily mean psychological. His body language just screams it. Jack is like... seriously becoming one of my favorite characters. He's so confusing, and interesting. This bears both repeating and seconding.
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Post by dietcokeslamma on May 3, 2010 9:21:03 GMT
Neat trick!
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Post by todd on May 3, 2010 10:37:55 GMT
Maybe Jack figured that since Annie's been in trouble with the Court once before (the bridge incident), and they thought it was because of Reynardine luring her out, when they find Annie and Reynardine there, they'll think that Annie was Reynardine's accomplice and that her story about Jack was a lie to keep out of trouble.
I certainly don't blame Annie for staying behind. Someone has to tell the Court authorities when they show up what's happened to Jack, which she'll have no opportunity to do if she runs off with him - if anything, doing that would make her (or at least, make her seem) his accomplice. Even given her distrust of grown-ups, Annie has to realize by now that only the adults at the Court can handle Jack; he won't listen to her.
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jon77
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Post by jon77 on May 3, 2010 10:39:50 GMT
So given that Jack can fly, and could get into and out of the Power Station at will whenever he wanted, then mustn't his entire purpose in bringing out Annie and Rey have been to set them (or at least Rey) to be the fall guy; to trap him at the station so that he could run amok looking for Zimmy? I see two possible scenarios here: One, he turns on the Power Station to try to draw out Zimmy, and brings Annie and Rey along to take the blame if the authorities come, using them to delay the authorities while he flies around looking for Zimmy. That's how I see it as well. Though I'm thinking he's probably got some other way of finding Zimmy rather than just flying around and looking for her. After all, someone flying around is still likely to draw attention, maybe even more than an etherically-paralyzed-wolf/plush-toy in an alley. I wonder what Annie's going to do now?
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blue
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Post by blue on May 3, 2010 12:00:58 GMT
Ah dang, they had the short argument and THEN he showed her what he meant by carry. I had everything completely backwards!
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Post by legion on May 3, 2010 12:55:18 GMT
Panel 6 > super creepy. There's nothing like a dark figure in dark lighting floating mid-air and looking back creepily behind him.
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Post by phyzome on May 3, 2010 13:01:28 GMT
I love how Jack's hairline has started to look like legs gripping his head... like spider legs, even...
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Post by the bandit on May 3, 2010 14:39:46 GMT
Spring Heeled? Pshaw! The pulley is clearly visible in the last panel.
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Post by Yin on May 3, 2010 15:08:33 GMT
You'd think a series like this would have more careful cameramen.
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Post by TBeholder on May 3, 2010 15:30:15 GMT
Anyone else see cobwebs in that silvery "wake" he's leaving? Even a bit wing-like. Cool, now I want to go and get bitten by an etheric spider from twisted dreamland. Flying is worth psychosis. What's point to fly if he grew so oblivious that sooner or later he'll refuse to take into account a wall or something? Also, he's all covered with ether-cobweb (it's not something unobstructive - he scratches). Eww... There's nobody who can even ATTEMPT to moderate Jack's behavior now. A lot of good she managed to do before. It's worse that now he's really up to something and no one sees. But maybe Reynardine can make himself useful and track Jack as a hound?
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Post by Tobu Ishi on May 3, 2010 15:35:09 GMT
Alas, but I agree with those who are expressing a backwards sort of sympathy for Jack. He's very much the hurt young man rebuffed by a potential friend here, albeit at the same time also a seriously deranged, grievously possessed, and unquestionably dangerous young man.
It seems like he really did believe Annie would be effusive with delight and gratitude for his getting the snarly supernatural canine off her metaphorical back. And, interestingly, it seems to be her declaration that Rey is her FRIEND that really throws him for a depressed, tall-building-leaping loop.
Annie spells it out in unmistakable terms. The vicious wolf is her friend, and Jack is not. Harsh, at least from his point of view, and his reaction is to impulsively blurt what amounts to 'well, forget you anyway! I don't really need you to come with me!' and jet out of there. Literally.
Hmm.
He may indeed have a constant source of company in his arachnid acquaintance, but...could it be? Is our man Jack...lonely?
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Post by Casey on May 3, 2010 15:58:48 GMT
I dunno, from his eyebrows, he looks angry that his plan isn't going perfectly, not emo-hurt because he failed to make a friend. Of the person he duped into breaking and entering, for his own purposes.
But let's say for the sake of argument that we are in fact seeing Jack's emotions here. I want to know how Jack could be so completely under the influence of the spider that he has done all these things that are so out of character for the real Jack--that he is powerless to the point that the spider gets him to lie, steal, murder and torture--and yet he still has enough Jackness left in him to be hurt because Annie "rejected" him? That just doesn't make any sense.
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Post by beatfox on May 3, 2010 17:37:13 GMT
So given that Jack can fly, and could get into and out of the Power Station at will whenever he wanted, then mustn't his entire purpose in bringing out Annie and Rey have been to set them (or at least Rey) to be the fall guy; to trap him at the station so that he could run amok looking for Zimmy? I see two possible scenarios here: One, he turns on the Power Station to try to draw out Zimmy, and brings Annie and Rey along to take the blame if the authorities come, using them to delay the authorities while he flies around looking for Zimmy. Two, he turns on the Power Station with them present for no other reason than to draw the authorities to this location, trap Rey there and get him blamed, to free him up to go look for Zimmy. The only difference is whether turning on the Power Station was half plan half ruse, or just all ruse. In either case though, someone pointed out that as long as Rey was bound like he is, he wouldn't be able to explain himself to the authorities. But Annie can. So isn't Jack just shooting a huge hole in his plan by leaving Annie there? He must really think that the authorities aren't going to believe Annie. If I were the authorities, and I had been looking all over for Jack, and then this happens and Rey got trapped by some mysterious things on the wall and Annie told me "Jack did it and he got away", I would believe her. I don't think Jack intended to put the blame on Rey (or Annie) at all. Remember, the authorities were already after him at the start of the chapter. I think he simply wanted to use Rey as a diversion - the Court has been wanting to recapture Rey, but they were afraid to for fear of breaking Annie's ownership contract and freeing him up to possess bodies again. Anyone else see cobwebs in that silvery "wake" he's leaving? Even a bit wing-like. Like someone mentioned earlier, it's just the generic ether-aura that's sometimes shown to indicate the use of etheric power. You can see the same sort of thing between Zimmy and Gamma in the Power Station chapter, as well as surrounding Ysengrin when he gets back into his tree-body in The Old Dog's Tricks. But let's say for the sake of argument that we are in fact seeing Jack's emotions here. I want to know how Jack could be so completely under the influence of the spider that he has done all these things that are so out of character for the real Jack--that he is powerless to the point that the spider gets him to lie, steal, murder and torture--and yet he still has enough Jackness left in him to be hurt because Annie "rejected" him? That just doesn't make any sense. I don't see why it's so inconceivable that he could be driven crazy by the spider while still being Jack. I don't get the impression that it has absolute control over him - his ultimate goal still appears to be bringing Zimmy out so he can find out what happened to him and try to remedy it.
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Post by the bandit on May 3, 2010 19:10:20 GMT
You obviously missed the clear metaphor that the circle on the spider's abdomen represents the steering wheel of Jack's mind.
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cathect
New Member
At last the birds take off.
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Post by cathect on May 3, 2010 19:28:31 GMT
You obviously missed the clear metaphor that the circle on the spider's abdomen represents the steering wheel of Jack's mind. Gah! It's so obvious! How could I have missed it?
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Post by foresterr on May 3, 2010 19:31:04 GMT
But let's say for the sake of argument that we are in fact seeing Jack's emotions here. I want to know how Jack could be so completely under the influence of the spider that he has done all these things that are so out of character for the real Jack--that he is powerless to the point that the spider gets him to lie, steal, murder and torture--and yet he still has enough Jackness left in him to be hurt because Annie "rejected" him? That just doesn't make any sense. I think (possibly wrongly, of course) that you assume that Jack's spidery craziness has more to do with loss of emotional capacity - in other words, the boy is becoming something of a psychopath - while his observational faculties and reasoning capacity remain relatively intact. I see him as more... delusional. The world he sees now probably is rather removed from what normal people perceive (this would fit with Zimmy's hallucinations, BTW), and because of that, it makes sense to me - because it can make sense to Jack in his current state. Even if it actually makes no sense ;-)
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Post by beatfox on May 3, 2010 19:36:07 GMT
steering wheel of Jack's mind
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Post by tustin2121 on May 3, 2010 19:37:49 GMT
CHEATER! Jack's cheating! It would be a LOT cooler if Jack didn't fly, but could do awesome jumps and parkour in order to get around. (Edit: Like Elgamore!!) My opinion of him has diminished.
Also, in the interest of actually contributing to the discussion: I think Jack was interested in having Annie by his side, perhaps at a subconsciously romantic level, but more likely at a "sidekick in etheric crime" sort of deal. Now, with Annie rejecting him, he's gonna become one hell of a enemy Annie will have to bring down later on.
Perhaps this post should have gone in the wild speculation thread...
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Post by Ulysses on May 3, 2010 19:41:10 GMT
Although this is a serious page, I still had to chuckle when Jack said "No you're crazy!". Spoken like a true crazy person. Now we just need him to say "They called me mad! Mad!! Well I'll show them! I'll show them all!" and the transformation will be complete.
I'm loving the combined confused/angry eyebrows. Tom's so good at showing emotions.
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Post by wolkenser on May 3, 2010 20:08:27 GMT
Well now we know why he's called spring heeled Jack.
The spider webs around him were freaky, so were his zimmy-ish eyes. He's looking more and more liker her. Next thing you know his teeth will turn pointy and he'll never change his clothes.
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Ruushi
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Touch the onion!!!
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Post by Ruushi on May 3, 2010 20:28:31 GMT
And they'll look like twins...
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Post by Ulysses on May 3, 2010 20:47:24 GMT
The spider webs around him were freaky, so were his zimmy-ish eyes. He's looking more and more liker her. Next thing you know his teeth will turn pointy and he'll never change his clothes. I was going to say "Zimmy changes her clothes", but then I actually looked and she really doesn't, except in her flashback in Dobranoc, Gamma, and that does't count. But if he's becoming more like Zimmy, does that mean Zimmy can fly too? Is there someone who will counteract Jack like Gamma does for Zimmy? If not, perhaps we'll get to see what Zimmy would have become if she hadn't found Gamma.
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Post by Snes on May 3, 2010 21:12:31 GMT
...well I didn't exactly see that one coming. I guess it's a bit unexpected for Jack to suddenly be revealed as he lost son of Krypton.
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guyy
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Post by guyy on May 3, 2010 21:42:17 GMT
Huh. More like "antigravity-heeled" than spring-heeled, I guess.
The question now is, will Ether-Annie fly up there and drag him back down?
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Post by elppa284 on May 3, 2010 21:48:18 GMT
panel four-Jack: I got rejected because of a doll!?
On another thought........do you guys think that this could almost reflect what happened with Annie's mom and Reynardine? Annie = her mom. Reynard = Jack
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Post by Mishmash on May 3, 2010 22:23:09 GMT
I love that Annie physically pushes Jack in panel three. It gives the whole scene more urgency (not that it lacked urgency to begin with!)
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