nijimei
New Member
Srsly?
Posts: 28
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Post by nijimei on Mar 31, 2010 14:38:48 GMT
Paz would make sense, she said "let's see how pretty you are" to the cows (was that the translation? Provably not, I fail at referencing). Actually she was saying "...to see if they are nice", which makes a lot more sense now that we know she can talk to them
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Post by Ulysses on Mar 31, 2010 14:40:49 GMT
I can't stop!
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Post by Mishmash on Mar 31, 2010 16:57:50 GMT
I love how Tom includes little details about the other people in the story, like Jack mentioning how Paz can talk to animals. There are so few stories where every character is developed enough to have a life outside of their interactions with the protagonist.
Also I love Rey and Annie's expressions on this page. I always love the facial expression in this comic, but recently they have been amazing!
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Post by wynne on Mar 31, 2010 17:42:38 GMT
That panel 2 is just amazing. I seriously hope Jack gets the help he needs in this chapter.
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Post by evilanagram on Mar 31, 2010 18:08:19 GMT
I love how Jack acts like a hybrid of the court and the forest. He uses the Internet, but he can sense being spyed on by the blinker stone; he plays with laser cows, but hates the court authority. I'm pretty sure that when spying with a blinker stone is rarely very stealthy. People with etheric experience will know what's up immediately, and most laymen seem to be able to sense it in some way. Jack doesn't demonstrate any special ethereal aptitude in that regard.
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Post by yazzydream on Mar 31, 2010 18:08:51 GMT
Did anyone else notice the new chapter icons at the bottom of the site? It looks like it's from a panel we haven't seen yet. Maybe Friday's? Haha.
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Post by linnabean on Mar 31, 2010 18:19:32 GMT
Yeah, the new chapter icon looks to be them walking into the power station. I hope it's Friday cause that means we'll get to see the power station!
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Post by evilanagram on Mar 31, 2010 18:26:43 GMT
Btw, I loved the expressions on this page. And Jack has definitely moved up a few pegs in my book, possibly because he reminds me slightly of myself in the latter half. (I've occasionally insulted people pretty badly by accident while talking about things I'd learned that I found interesting, and I would probably act exactly like Jack did in the last panel if something like that happened to cross my mind.) haha, oh Jack. His unhinged enthusiasm about "Did you know there's a kid in your class who can talk to animals?" is hilarious. Reynardine's downcast expression in panel 6 is great too. I missed that one until you pointed it out. It's interesting that Annie gets angry and Rey feels sad. So Rey's downcast face is a reaction to what? 1) How he tried to kill Annie? (Panel 4) 2) How Annie's Dad ditched her? (Panel 5) 3) Panel 6 I'm thinking it's #2. I think Rey isn't feeling sad so much as he's feeling ashamed. He starts looking downcast in panel 4 after Jack casually mentions how Rey tried to kill her, and by panel 6 he looks miserable out of both shame for his own actions and empathy for Annie. Mostly out of shame for his own actions. In fact, looking at it now, I'd say that both Annie's and Reynardine's expressions in panel 6 are simplifications and exaggerations of their expressions in the previous two panels, so it's more likely that Rey's feeling more shame about trying to kill her than sadness about her dad being a douche. Annie, of course, is just pissed. How dare he look up her file!
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Chrome
Full Member
The Shiny One
Posts: 232
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Post by Chrome on Mar 31, 2010 20:53:30 GMT
Annie's good enough to possibly weasel some more out of Jack. Just get him all excited and willing to chat with her, and well...he may say more than he intended. She's already got Reynardine, Coyote, and others telling her all kinds of things, and has been able to put some stuff together from what they happily tell her.
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troll
Junior Member
Posts: 53
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Post by troll on Mar 31, 2010 21:37:57 GMT
If Surma had ever gotten a premonition of Panel 2, she would have completely gotten the wrong idea.
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Post by Refugee on Mar 31, 2010 21:57:31 GMT
Panel five: "You sure are cute when you're mad."
I'm sorry, but Annie is just stunningly beautiful there.
I don't think Jack is trying to be mean here; I think he's babbling from stress. This is kid is shaken to his core and he is desperate for help. It's not to his advantage to piss off the person he thinks can help him, but he can't stop himself.
I note that Jack mentions his findings that two people close to Annie have hurt her, or tried to, but he mentions nothing casting she herself in a bad light. Odd as it sounds, I think he's actually trying to express sympathy for her.
===
Update: He's also doing her the substantial service of letting her know the kinds of information the school keeps in her file, and either how poorly the system is secured, or how puissant a hacker he is.
He's clumsy as hell, but I believe he's on her side.
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Post by linnabean on Apr 1, 2010 2:44:07 GMT
Update: He's also doing her the substantial service of letting her know the kinds of information the school keeps in her file, and either how poorly the system is secured, or how puissant a hacker he is. He's clumsy as hell, but I believe he's on her side. I tend to agree here. I don't see these comments to be in the same tone as the "Ice Queen" one was. He's trying to relate to her, or at least help her relate to him and see that he needs and wants her help. I think refugee was spot on in saying that jack isn't trying to be mean, he's just babbling along as he rows. Maybe I'm biased since I've always liked Jack, but I don't think anything he's said in these panels was meant to specifically hurt Annie. (or even Rey)
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Post by Casey on Apr 1, 2010 3:11:28 GMT
Personally, I think the emphasis you see on the word "you" carries an accusatory tone, and I think the word "ditched" instead of something like "abandoned" also implies that he is making digs at both of them. But not necessarily to hurt them: I feel it's more along the lines of he's trying to bring them down a peg, as he in his current mental state perceives Annie's reticence as a better-than-thou attitude, which is in line with his "ice queen" comment.
If he were trying to relate to her, I don't think he would use a word like "ditched". That carries a negative connotation of something left behind that was worth so little to the person doing the abandoning, that they were effectively tossed in the ditch. I really think that it paints a good image of Jack implying to Rey "you're a hypocrite, protecting the one you tried to kill" and to Annie "you think you're so special, but your dad tossed you aside like garbage". Word choice is pretty important.
But even if you don't buy the above argument, I would at least point to refugee's statement that he's just babbling along as he rows... as you said. And if you accept that he's just babbling, then you can't at the same time say that he's trying to relate and seek help. Either he's mindlessly babbling or he isn't.
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Post by warrl on Apr 1, 2010 4:26:54 GMT
But even if you don't buy the above argument, I would at least point to refugee's statement that he's just babbling along as he rows... as you said. And if you accept that he's just babbling, then you can't at the same time say that he's trying to relate and seek help. Either he's mindlessly babbling or he isn't. I'd go for a mixture. He's trying to impress her AND be sympathetic... but because of stress, he's doing a really bad job of it (including babbling).
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Post by Casey on Apr 1, 2010 5:05:59 GMT
Well, I cannot see how telling someone that their dad tossed them aside like garbage would be meant to impress that person, but, I guess everyone sees things through their own interpretation. Nothing seems to ever come of a discussion about whether every interpretation is equally plausible, so...
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Post by hal9000 on Apr 1, 2010 5:16:04 GMT
Personally, I think the emphasis you see on the word "you" carries an accusatory tone, and I think the word "ditched" instead of something like "abandoned" also implies that he is making digs at both of them. But not necessarily to hurt them: I feel it's more along the lines of he's trying to bring them down a peg, as he in his current mental state perceives Annie's reticence as a better-than-thou attitude, which is in line with his "ice queen" comment. If he were trying to relate to her, I don't think he would use a word like "ditched". That carries a negative connotation of something left behind that was worth so little to the person doing the abandoning, that they were effectively tossed in the ditch. I really think that it paints a good image of Jack implying to Rey "you're a hypocrite, protecting the one you tried to kill" and to Annie "you think you're so special, but your dad tossed you aside like garbage". Word choice is pretty important. But even if you don't buy the above argument, I would at least point to refugee's statement that he's just babbling along as he rows... as you said. And if you accept that he's just babbling, then you can't at the same time say that he's trying to relate and seek help. Either he's mindlessly babbling or he isn't. The same words in the same contexts can have different implications for different people. Sure, he could be phrasing it that way as a way of bringing her down, but he could also just be using it because it's a part of the common vernacular for people of his age and geographic region.
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Post by xanbcoo on Apr 1, 2010 5:20:25 GMT
Is Reynardine's expression in these panels an admission of guilt about trying to kill Annie?
And if so, what does that do to the long-running "He did not really try to kill Annie" theory?
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Post by hal9000 on Apr 1, 2010 5:21:51 GMT
Is Reynardine's expression in these panels an admission of guilt about trying to kill Annie? And if so, what does that do to the long-running "He did not really try to kill Annie" theory? Disproves it?
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Post by xanbcoo on Apr 1, 2010 5:33:14 GMT
I was sort of saying that without saying it, but at the same time I guess it's not 100% conclusive. Ulysses, don't stop.
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Post by Charlotte on Apr 1, 2010 7:40:28 GMT
I don't know why anyone thinks that Rey tried to kill Annie, either here or in the story. It makes no sense to me. If you were an escaped convict and had a choice of two hideouts, and in one, the screws would know you were there and be full of rage and in the other, no one would know where you were and might even guess you had died or dissolved into the ether, which one would you choose?
I think Rey's downcast expression is because he feels bad that people think this of him and for some reason he cannot defend himself. I'm hoping that on Friday Jack will say, "So Ren, if you knew the wolf toy was good, why didn't you go for it first? Oh, wait -- let me guess -- you had to make everyone think you were trying to possess Annie or the concealed hideout wouldn't work."
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Post by hal9000 on Apr 1, 2010 8:12:39 GMT
I don't know why anyone thinks that Rey tried to kill Annie, either here or in the story. It makes no sense to me. If you were an escaped convict and had a choice of two hideouts, and in one, the screws would know you were there and be full of rage and in the other, no one would know where you were and might even guess you had died or dissolved into the ether, which one would you choose? I think Rey's downcast expression is because he feels bad that people think this of him and for some reason he cannot defend himself. I'm hoping that on Friday Jack will say, "So Ren, if you knew the wolf toy was good, why didn't you go for it first? Oh, wait -- let me guess -- you had to make everyone think you were trying to possess Annie or the concealed hideout wouldn't work." www.gunnerkrigg.com/archive_page.php?comicID=53Edit: We know that he knew his body-swapping antics would be fatal to the host from the chat with Coyote in this strip. The evidence is pretty damning.
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Post by Casey on Apr 1, 2010 11:52:00 GMT
Yes, because appearances are ALWAYS exactly what they seem.
Where have we heard this argument before? Isn't there a whole thread dedicated to it?
(This too is a set of rhetorical questions.)
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Post by todd on Apr 1, 2010 12:21:44 GMT
If you were an escaped convict and had a choice of two hideouts, and in one, the screws would know you were there and be full of rage and in the other, no one would know where you were and might even guess you had died or dissolved into the ether, which one would you choose? Reynardine was probably too desperate to escape to analyze the situation on that level. It's easier to approach problems from such a painstaking perspective when you're at home and safe, pondering them over, than when you're in the middle of the action.
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Post by Casey on Apr 1, 2010 14:56:45 GMT
If you were an escaped convict and had a choice of two hideouts, and in one, the screws would know you were there and be full of rage and in the other, no one would know where you were and might even guess you had died or dissolved into the ether, which one would you choose? Reynardine was probably too desperate to escape to analyze the situation on that level. It's easier to approach problems from such a painstaking perspective when you're at home and safe, pondering them over, than when you're in the middle of the action. At least some amount of time did pass between when Rey first saw the doll, and when he enacted his plan to use the doll. He even specifically mentioned the doll when they first met. Furthermore, your rebuttal assumes a certain frame of mind itself, and we don't have any factual evidence to say how desperate Rey was, or how much time he spent planning an escape that would throw his captors off of his trail, thinking him dead. BUT AS I SAID, shouldn't this conversation be relegated to the thread that was made specifically for discussing it? Posting anything here is only going to ensure that it is lost in the sands of time, whereas posting in that thread gives folks a chance of finding it again in the future. That is, if you guys -really- want to open up this old argument, again, hehe...
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Post by the bandit on Apr 1, 2010 15:13:00 GMT
Is Reynardine's expression in these panels an admission of guilt about trying to kill Annie? Could be. Doesn't have to be. Don't be a smart aleck.
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Post by Per on Apr 1, 2010 16:13:08 GMT
"You're not sorry you tried to possess and kill me, you're just sorry you failed!"
There's probably a page on TV Tropes for that kind of sentiment.
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Post by hal9000 on Apr 1, 2010 16:54:02 GMT
Yes, because appearances are ALWAYS exactly what they seem. Where have we heard this argument before? Isn't there a whole thread dedicated to it? (This too is a set of rhetorical questions.) A cigar may not always be just a cigar, but sometimes it is. Anyway it'd be enough for a prosecutor to convict him of attempted murder in a court of law, so it's proof enough for me.
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Post by shouqi on Apr 1, 2010 18:10:42 GMT
One thing I don't get - Carver doesn't have the stones to whack Jack, no matter how offensive he might be. Some of the people making comments need to wrap their minds around that basic restriction.
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Post by the bandit on Apr 1, 2010 18:21:33 GMT
Not doing something and not having the stones to do something are two entirely different things, even if they have the same outcome.
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Post by Mr Pitchfork on Apr 1, 2010 18:55:12 GMT
One thing I don't get - Carver doesn't have the stones to whack Jack, no matter how offensive he might be. Some of the people making comments need to wrap their minds around that basic restriction. She smacked a god. She smacked a god.
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