[2004] Do you regret setting her free?

[haspen]

Also, that must've been some fast recap!

[madjack]

I wonder if Jones is asking that question because she wants to assess Annie's motivations... Or because she's genuinely curious as to what someone would actually feel about the unintended consequences of their actions and she trusts Annie enough to use her as a reference. Perhaps both?

Also this explains the lack of boots, lightweight shoes would be better for climbing the rubble.

[bedinsis]

Does Jones look far too short to anyone else?

Even comparing her to the previous page it seems she has lost some height.

[ffkonoko]

I don't think she's drawn any shorter, but she does look it, if that makes sense. I think it's a mix of the slanted angle and her hair/head looking too big, it makes the rest seem scaled down?

[fjodorii]

I like how the dialog is exactly the discussion we have been having here on the forum. Cookies for everyone!

[arf]

Annie's new getup still features that hair clip.

[faiiry]

It's not an easy question. "I don't know" is a reasonable answer.

I, for one, think freeing Jeanne was done with the purest of intentions, but not the clearest of minds. If Annie had, for example, asked Coyote - or, even better, Ysengrin, who isn't so keen on bending the truth - she might have learned Jeanne's function. A little more research was in order either way.

[bedinsis]

Where is the light source causing the highlights of Annie's and Jones' hair in the first panel?

I might have overlooked something, but shouldn't they be on the same side of their heads, instead of left-forward for Jones and right-backward for Annie?

[electricguitarsolo]

Jun 22, 2018 11:25:42 GMT bedinsis said:

Where is the light source causing the highlights of Annie's and Jones' hair in the first panel?

I might have overlooked something, but shouldn't they be on the same side of their heads, instead of left-forward for Jones and right-backward for Annie?

I think they make sense if the light source is directly above?

[Per]

Jun 22, 2018 9:49:10 GMT arf said:

Annie's new getup still features that hair clip.

Also she has an orange hair thingy that changes colour in panel 3, disappears in the ensuing ruckus and gets handed back to her by a ghost giraffe in chapter 112.

[todd]

Jun 22, 2018 11:11:01 GMT faiiry said:

It's not an easy question. "I don't know" is a reasonable answer.

I, for one, think freeing Jeanne was done with the purest of intentions, but not the clearest of minds. If Annie had, for example, asked Coyote - or, even better, Ysengrin, who isn't so keen on bending the truth - she might have learned Jeanne's function. A little more research was in order either way.

why them? Neither were involved in the Founders' councils. Unless the theory here is that she'd have learned that there was more behind their motives than Diego's thirst for revenge, and that was indicated in the documentation Annie had gotten.

[fia]

Is that the former entrance hall? It can't be, it looks quite different.

[fjodorii]

could be that this door leads to the entrance hall, and it's the actual hall itself that is completely destroyed.

[pyradonis]

It's beautiful. The ruins, I mean.

[ctso74]

No matter how much power/knowledge we have, whether we're waitstaff at a diner or a divine etheric being, we can only help when we can and where we can. As mere humans we can do no more, as good people we should do no less.

Annie really could have gotten more info before charging in to help Jeanne, but if I saw an animal suffering in an abandoned trap, I'd immediately try to free it, even if I might get hurt myself. Mind you, Smitty got more than hurt, and this abandoned trap was preventing someone else from acting out, but still...

[todd]

It still presents an unsettling scenario - keep the Court safe, but at the cost of two people being tortured in the afterlife (in a way that corrupts one into a slaughter-machine who'll kill anyone, even the people she's supposed to be protecting), or free them and leave the Court open to attack. The kind of situation that demands a third option, but none seems to have presented itself yet. (The third option could be "Give up those mad scientist experiments with the ether, leave, return to the regular human world where you won't be living next door to Gilltie Wood and its inhabitants and won't need to embark on such drastic measures to protect yourself" - and it wasn't the last time the Court did that, either, in light of Renard - but I can't see the Court leadership even momentarily contemplating it.)

[faiiry]

Jun 22, 2018 12:52:41 GMT todd said:

Jun 22, 2018 11:11:01 GMT faiiry said:

It's not an easy question. "I don't know" is a reasonable answer.

I, for one, think freeing Jeanne was done with the purest of intentions, but not the clearest of minds. If Annie had, for example, asked Coyote - or, even better, Ysengrin, who isn't so keen on bending the truth - she might have learned Jeanne's function. A little more research was in order either way.

why them? Neither were involved in the Founders' councils. Unless the theory here is that she'd have learned that there was more behind their motives than Diego's thirst for revenge, and that was indicated in the documentation Annie had gotten.

Because Ysengrin might have said, "Oh, that annoying ghost lady that sits around in the ravine? I've had a hell of a time trying to get past her with my evil armies of malicious forest creatures who want to attack the Court."

[Per]

"So how many cookies would you pay to have her removed?"

[blazingstar]

Jun 22, 2018 7:56:09 GMT bedinsis said:

Does Jones look far too short to anyone else?

Even comparing her to the previous page it seems she has lost some height.

Jun 22, 2018 8:10:15 GMT ffkonoko said:

I don't think she's drawn any shorter, but she does look it, if that makes sense. I think it's a mix of the slanted angle and her hair/head looking too big, it makes the rest seem scaled down?

Here's a simpler answer: Annie's grown taller since their last meeting (which was here, IIRC, and even then, they weren't standing near each other.)

Quite some time has passed, Annie is a growing teenage girl, and the art has evolved a little since then, too.

[youwiththeface]

Jun 22, 2018 14:47:22 GMT faiiry said:

Jun 22, 2018 12:52:41 GMT todd said:

why them? Neither were involved in the Founders' councils. Unless the theory here is that she'd have learned that there was more behind their motives than Diego's thirst for revenge, and that was indicated in the documentation Annie had gotten.

Because Ysengrin might have said, "Oh, that annoying ghost lady that sits around in the ravine? I've had a hell of a time trying to get past her with my evil armies of malicious forest creatures who want to attack the Court."

I'm still not sure how relevant Jeanne's freedom is to what happened. After all, the attack didn't come from the ravine, it came from right on top of the bridge. Plus, we know from shadow that even with Jeanne there, things have gotten into the court anyway. 

[ohthatone]

Jun 22, 2018 18:47:01 GMT youwiththeface said:

Jun 22, 2018 14:47:22 GMT faiiry said:

Because Ysengrin might have said, "Oh, that annoying ghost lady that sits around in the ravine? I've had a hell of a time trying to get past her with my evil armies of malicious forest creatures who want to attack the Court."

I'm still not sure how relevant Jeanne's freedom is to what happened. After all, the attack didn't come from the ravine, it came from right on top of the bridge. Plus, we know from shadow that even with Jeanne there, things have gotten into the court anyway. 

yeah, I'm still kind of stuck on this too. when Annie fell in the ravine it's implied the Tic Tocs carried her to the forest shore, since Jeanne died on the Court side and Muut said she couldn't cross over the river (even though she did).

So that means when Kat rescued her, she had to cross the river.

Tony and Jones believe the freeing Jeanne might be related, but not directly.  So I'm also in agreement asking Ysengrin about Jeanne would have been a good start.  I find it strange the topic never seemed to have come up between them.

[gillyc]

Jun 22, 2018 19:48:58 GMT ohthatone said:

Jun 22, 2018 18:47:01 GMT youwiththeface said:

I'm still not sure how relevant Jeanne's freedom is to what happened. After all, the attack didn't come from the ravine, it came from right on top of the bridge. Plus, we know from shadow that even with Jeanne there, things have gotten into the court anyway. 

yeah, I'm still kind of stuck on this too. when Annie fell in the ravine it's implied the Tic Tocs carried her to the forest shore, since Jeanne died on the Court side and Muut said she couldn't cross over the river (even though she did).

So that means when Kat rescued her, she had to cross the river.

Tony and Jones believe the freeing Jeanne might be related, but not directly.  So I'm also in agreement asking Ysengrin about Jeanne would have been a good start.  I find it strange the topic never seemed to have come up between them.

Maybe because when you're getting rid of a defence system you don't tell the people it's defending you from? I'm assuming she was hoping they wouldn't notice. 

[imaginaryfriend]

The dialogue in this strip reminded me of this.

[edit]Dammit, proboards. I get redirected to this post in this thread though the link itself looks fine on editing. If the same thing happens when you click on that click or copy/paste from here: youtu.be/A5saB2MQeQk?t=958 [/edit]

Jun 22, 2018 20:04:35 GMT gillyc said:

I'm assuming she was hoping they wouldn't notice.

Also after having visited the Wood so many times and having so much fun she probably thought that the idea of the Wood attacking the Court now was silly. Those two times she got attacked were flukes (three if you count the wisp separately or four if you count that time with the shadowman on the bridge).

[todd]

Jun 22, 2018 18:47:01 GMT youwiththeface said:

I'm still not sure how relevant Jeanne's freedom is to what happened. After all, the attack didn't come from the ravine, it came from right on top of the bridge. Plus, we know from shadow that even with Jeanne there, things have gotten into the court anyway. 

I still think that this is irrelevant; the big question is "Was what the Court did to Jeanne wrong?" And the answer is definitely "Yes".

1. It murdered two people.

2. It then trapped their ghosts in constant torment, warping one of the ghosts into a hate-filled, slaughter-machine who will attack and kill anyone who gets nearer, even if that person doesn't bear any hatred for the Court. Even if that person is one of the Court. Especially if that person is one of the Court.

3. It then covered it up to such an extent that the very memory of Jeanne was extinguished, "1984"-style.

4. Not to mention mixing into the motive of protecting the Court the baser reason of jealousy and revenge from Diego.

Even if Jeanne could have kept the Court safe from this attack, it would have been a safety brought about by ill-gotten and immoral means. That's what matters most. The Founders, in fear for their lives, broke practically every part of the moral code except "concern for their home", even though all those other rules are just as much part of the moral code as that one. And there's no suggestion anywhere (and I believe it would be difficult to make such a twist convincing) that the story Annie got in "Sky Watcher and the Angel" and "The Coward Heart" was a lie.

I still feel concerned that the story comes close to justifying or excusing the Founders' act by depicting its results as good for the Court (keeping it safe from its enemies) and the undoing as bad for the Court (leaving it open to its enemies), and producing a possible response of "Well, yes, what the Founders did was kind of unsettling, but without it Ysengrin and his army would have overrun the Court long ago, so maybe it was okay after all, done for the greater good...." Fortunately the story's not over yet, and there's still room for further developments and revelations that may sort out that problem.

[Runningflame]

Is anybody else feeling some dissonance between the chapter's title and its contents? It's called "Evac," with a title page to match, and yet there's only about four pages (in tell-not-show mode, too) about the evacuation, and now it looks like the bulk of the chapter will be about Annie and Jones going toward the Forest. I'm not sure whether that means 1) poor chapter naming, 2) an intentional bait-and-switch, or 3) an awesome twist five pages from now that will make it all make sense.

[faiiry]

Jun 22, 2018 18:47:01 GMT youwiththeface said:

Jun 22, 2018 14:47:22 GMT faiiry said:

Because Ysengrin might have said, "Oh, that annoying ghost lady that sits around in the ravine? I've had a hell of a time trying to get past her with my evil armies of malicious forest creatures who want to attack the Court."

I'm still not sure how relevant Jeanne's freedom is to what happened. After all, the attack didn't come from the ravine, it came from right on top of the bridge. Plus, we know from shadow that even with Jeanne there, things have gotten into the court anyway. 

After Jeanne died, Coyote noticed and looked very happy about it. Last chapter, Coyote tells Ysengrin "What would you do if you knew the ghost was gone?" and only then do they act. It has everything to do with Jeanne.

[bedinsis]

Jun 23, 2018 3:55:11 GMT Runningflame said:

Is anybody else feeling some dissonance between the chapter's title and its contents? It's called "Evac," with a title page to match, and yet there's only about four pages (in tell-not-show mode, too) about the evacuation, and now it looks like the bulk of the chapter will be about Annie and Jones going toward the Forest. I'm not sure whether that means 1) poor chapter naming, 2) an intentional bait-and-switch, or 3) an awesome twist five pages from now that will make it all make sense.

If we assume that next page will be the last of the chapter, I still think it would be a good title for the chapter. The most important thing that happened in this chapter is the fact that lots of people have had to evacuate following Ysengrin's attack. A title which one can read on the main page as a chapter among others and immediately realize what it is about unlike other vaguely named chapters such as "thread", "the tree" or "quicksilver".

[youwiththeface]

Jun 23, 2018 4:53:23 GMT faiiry said:

Jun 22, 2018 18:47:01 GMT youwiththeface said:

I'm still not sure how relevant Jeanne's freedom is to what happened. After all, the attack didn't come from the ravine, it came from right on top of the bridge. Plus, we know from shadow that even with Jeanne there, things have gotten into the court anyway. 

After Jeanne died, Coyote noticed and looked very happy about it. Last chapter, Coyote tells Ysengrin "What would you do if you knew the ghost was gone?" and only then do they act. It has everything to do with Jeanne.

How? The only way it seems connected is that it's possibly what made Coyote decide to give Y his strength, but again, it's not even used to go through where Jeanne would've been guarding.