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Post by faiiry on Jul 14, 2017 17:18:46 GMT
Also, I want to know what Tony said to make Kat laugh about that. He REALLY doesn't seem like a funny guy. The only joke we've ever seen him make is that time he quipped about Feng Shui. There was also the "get that into my house" comment about the bottle Donny brought with him. I'm sure Tony has tons of dry jokes like these up his sleeve. It's a shame Annie is the main protagonist so we don't ever get to see them, haha... ha... *sigh* Annie seemed to get some of the worst qualities of her parents: her father's social awkwardness and anxiety, and her mother's anger and unwillingness to follow rules (sometimes). Some of their best qualities were lost in translation, such as Tony's dry humor, and also, and this is just an assumption but one I'm confident on, his academic success. Can't think of one for Surma - we don't really know her that well! This is not a criticism of Antimony, by the way. She's a great character, and I sort of identify with her.
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Post by faiiry on Jul 14, 2017 17:32:53 GMT
I don't want to knock on Tom's story writing or anything but if this ends with forced "Anthony is just misunderstood but a good guy" then I am really going be pissed. I do have faith in Tom though. Chapter 53 has already explained to us in great detail how Anthony is actually a great guy and everything questionable he did was for an understandable, if slightly selfish, motive. Basically his only character flaws are awkwardness and mysteriousness. Oh, and cutting off his arm to bring his wife back from the afterlife even though he didn't know what state she'd be in, but I'm not sure what the word for that is. Idiotic selfishness, maybe?
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Post by The Anarch on Jul 14, 2017 17:47:08 GMT
Also, I want to know what Tony said to make Kat laugh about that. He does a really amazing Christopher Walken impression.
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Post by TBeholder on Jul 14, 2017 17:55:16 GMT
One internet to everyone who can come up with a unique, work-safe, and plausible theory of what Antimony is examining while crouching in panel #1. Kat's solar plexus, as one of the points included in Standard Aura Diagnostics Routine? Who is she dragging Kat off to, though? Rey? One of Foleys would provide maximum Wacky Hijinx potential. And Tony's best friend is Kat's dad, who shares many personality traits with his daughter. And they both have an intense interest in science. It's not that it doesn't make sense, but it's still a kind of betrayal of Annie to become buddy with her father after everything that happened, and not even tell her. Also, right now Annie mirrors Kat's earlier attitude. As if mocking her. Still I'll forgive everything, if this leads to Tony having an actual conversation with Annie. This may also lead to Wacky Comedy. Especially if Paz joins. Though she may play the voice of reason again. Annie, to Anthony, represents a constant physical reminder of his utter failure as a father (since he abandoned and then accidentally almost killed her) Well, he probably didn't figure out this part (yet). and his utter failure as a "brainiac genius scientist" (since he couldn't save Surma). Plus, she looks a lot like Surma, possesses half her "soul" (the fiery part) and at least some of her personality traits (e.g., being sometimes a bit manipulative, but also a good friend). Well, yeah. And his sanity wasn't exactly having good times even before he met Coyote and Ol' Jonathan threw him to the dogs just like that. Holding out hope Kat realizes what is going on and uses her leverage with Tony to make him actually have a conversation with his own daughter. Or she may realize that levering a still-hissing chunk of radioactive slag toward anyone isn't the best idea.
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Post by bgb16999 on Jul 14, 2017 18:43:33 GMT
Annie: REYNARD! You have to explain to Kat how terrible a person my dad is! Kat: No, see, he's totally different when no one else is around. You have to believe me! Rey: I believe you, Kat. Annie: What? No, Rey, don't believe anything she says! Rey: I have to, didn't you hear? Annie: Gah, fine, let's go see Ysengrin.
ANNIE and KAT leave and enter the forest.
Ys: Annie is totally right, Anthony Carver is a terrible creature. Annie: See, Kat, I told you so.
COYOTE climbs out from under the stage.
Coyote: He he, I see Fire Head Girl is cocky today. Kat: Coyote, wouldn't it be more interesting if Anthony was actually completely different when Annie wasn't around? Coyote: Hmm, yes yes, it would be more entertaining. Hence, I pronounce that FIRE HEAD GIRL IS WRONG!
COYOTE vanishes into the trees. ANTHONY then enters from stage right.
Annie: What? Dad, you aren't supposed to be in the forest at all! Anthony: Well, I wasn't until today. But then I remembered, I AM ALSO COYOTE! Annie: Nooooooooooooo!
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Post by mordekai on Jul 14, 2017 19:19:04 GMT
Annie is just a little out of control. No she isn't. Her behaviour is perfectly justified in the world she lives in. They can clone human bodies and magically implant fairy souls in them, and they have reality warping magical computers... brainwashing is a piece of cake compared to that... And Anthony was able to cut the flesh from the bones of his hand in order to try to speak with the spirit of his late wife, on the advice of a group of demons... a bit of brainwashing on the teenaged daughter of his best friend in order to get her help to create a new hand? That positively mundane, compared to that! That said, I don't think Anthony needed to brainwash Kat... Kat is just enthusiastic about the project, and Anthony knows how to be likeable if he really needs to... Still, I'm worried about Kat... she has spend just a little time with Anthony, and she already looks and sounds way less cool... That guy is infectious...
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Post by unbalanced on Jul 14, 2017 20:39:49 GMT
Kat's two speech bubbles in the first panel are a bit weirdly positioned to me. It looks like you should read left-to-right as usual, but they make more sense the other way around (which suggests you read that whole panel clockwise).
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Post by Per on Jul 14, 2017 21:01:11 GMT
I don't hope or expect that the Tony arc will end with him punching through some neurological barrier to acceptable normalcy.
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Post by keef on Jul 14, 2017 21:01:49 GMT
It's good to see Annie keeping her cool, taking the initiative to save Kat! But can Kat still be rescued?? Find out, next week on Gunnerkrigg Creep! Also, right now Annie mirrors Kat's earlier attitude. As if mocking her. That was my first impression. But no, she must be completely serious. (whatever, it shows what she really thinks of Tony) Also: Best page in months!
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Post by Runningflame on Jul 14, 2017 21:39:57 GMT
I really, really hope this means we're going to talk with Renard now. The last time we saw him was page 1657 (or 1650 if you don't count bonus pages). That's two hundred pages ago! Never have we gone this long without Renard before. It's time. or else Kat calls him out for doing this to her and refuses to work with him any further until he sits down and has a talk with Annie that's more than sitting there acting like a pair of robots. Yes, that would be good. She could give the two of them this speech. With the wire strippers.
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Post by Jelly Jellybean on Jul 14, 2017 23:17:07 GMT
Maybe because Jones never got a woman pregnant. To be fair, people have also theorized that Tony is not Antimony's real dad. I am still grasping (against many indications to the contrary) to the idea that Surma gave birth to Annie by spontaneous pregnancy. But if Tony isn't Annie's father, then up is down and maybe Tony is Kat's biological father. I'll let myself out now.
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Post by jda on Jul 14, 2017 23:26:08 GMT
Also, I want to know what Tony said to make Kat laugh about that. He does a really amazing Christopher Walken impression. Are we already nominating a Cast for the miniseries? I'll support this one.
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Post by todd on Jul 15, 2017 0:10:06 GMT
After reading this page, I'm understanding better why Tom took the approach with Kat's thaw towards Anthony that he did. By just showing us the two being suddenly, if not friends, at least getting on well together, without the journey to how they became that way, we can feel some of Annie's shock and disbelief.
I think that Annie is handling the situation poorly - she ought to listen to Kat's explanation instead of jumping to the conclusion that she's under some etheric influence - but it's a believable "handling the situation poorly".
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Post by saardvark on Jul 15, 2017 0:33:29 GMT
Annie seemed to get some of the worst qualities of her parents: her father's social awkwardness and anxiety, and her mother's anger and unwillingness to follow rules (sometimes). Some of their best qualities were lost in translation, such as Tony's dry humor, and also, and this is just an assumption but one I'm confident on, his academic success. Can't think of one for Surma - we don't really know her that well! This is not a criticism of Antimony, by the way. She's a great character, and I sort of identify with her. Maybe Surma's ability to form strong friendships.... she seems pretty close to Anya, as Annie is to Kat.
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Post by saardvark on Jul 15, 2017 0:50:01 GMT
Annie, to Anthony, represents a constant physical reminder of his utter failure as a father (since he abandoned and then accidentally almost killed her) Well, he probably didn't figure out this part (yet). It seems pretty clear he at least figured out he almost killed her: www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=1557(tho maybe you were being sarcastic and I misread you...[?] sorry...)
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Post by warrl on Jul 15, 2017 0:51:51 GMT
This is not a criticism of Antimony, by the way. She's a great character, and I sort of identify with her. There is no correlation between how good a character someone is, and how good a person.
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Post by faiiry on Jul 15, 2017 1:15:03 GMT
This is not a criticism of Antimony, by the way. She's a great character, and I sort of identify with her. There is no correlation between how good a character someone is, and how good a person. Well, she's both. Let me clarify: this isn't a criticism of Tom's writing of Antimony as a character. It's praise, rather. And I also don't think she is a bad person necessarily because she inherited some bad traits from her parents.
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Post by saardvark on Jul 15, 2017 2:31:01 GMT
He does a really amazing Christopher Walken impression. Are we already nominating a Cast for the miniseries? I'll support this one. me too! and how about... Surma = a young Julianne Moore Dr Disaster = Christopher Lloyd Jones = Tilda Swinton (?) Ysengrin = Ron Perlman (?)
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Post by phantaskippy on Jul 15, 2017 3:48:33 GMT
Antimony is more than just a reminder of Tony's failure as a father, she holds the spirit of the wife he couldn't save, the one she looks just like. Annie reminds him of all of his failure, and everything he's lost.
And now he is back at a place he never wanted to come back to, because in his negligence his daughter has pissed off the Court and is cheating her way through school.
Annie is a breathing and walking beacon of light, shining out to the world everything Tony hates about himself. And she loves him, and he can't even handle looking at her. And he hates himself for that too.
As for Kat, look at this from what Kat knows. Kat knows Annie's father was not around, doesn't remember the time Zimmy came and helped Annie, was angry for the hair cutting and Annie being isolated and Annie not standing up for herself.
Well, Annie is clearly no longer grounded. She pulled off releasing Jeanne, her hair and style are back to more normal conditions and she got Renard back. And from Annie's words her Dad has his reasons and everything is fine.
Kat not realizing what is going on with Annie is quite plausible. She just needs to figure it out soon.
Anyone else wondering about the "business with James" and how that might come to a head with Tony back and befriending Kat?
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Post by TBeholder on Jul 15, 2017 5:17:30 GMT
It's good to see Annie keeping her cool, taking the initiative to save Kat! But can Kat still be rescued?? Find out, next week on Gunnerkrigg Creep! WHAT A CLIFFHANGER! That was my first impression. But no, she must be completely serious. Mostly seriously. As in, the only alternative to this cute fuss (other than "run off screaming") is to discuss this with Kat seriously. And for this Annie isn't ready right now. (whatever, it shows what she really thinks of Tony) That's my point: this little revelation contributes to Kat's confusion. Well, yes, but. He has a good reason to believe that his magic dabbling did somehow mess with Annie so much that a third party noticed. That's all. It was clear enough to send him on another loop of regret and self-pity, but there's nothing specific, whether from Zimmy or from him.
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Post by saardvark on Jul 15, 2017 8:29:07 GMT
Well, yes, but. He has a good reason to believe that his magic dabbling did somehow mess with Annie so much that a third party noticed. That's all. It was clear enough to send him on another loop of regret and self-pity, but there's nothing specific, whether from Zimmy or from him. I read it as being pretty clearly heavily implied by him.. he just couldn't actually bring himself to say the all words: www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=1557"My own daughter, i almost... [killed her. And because of that unforgivable act...] ... I didn't deserve to see her again. [The concept of me, worthy of being...] her father died out there in those caves..." so he sees his worthiness as a father dying when Annie almost dies at his hands.
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Post by mordekai on Jul 15, 2017 10:39:20 GMT
(Seriously, people theorized Jones was a robot for years, and nobody made the same argument about Anthony. Weird.) Gunnerkrigg Court's robots are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more empathic and emotionally expressive than Anthony is. If he is a robot, he must be a cheap knock-off created by some student, rather than a true Court robot... Or maybe the court tried to create a robot without the usual quirks and Anthony is what they got... As for Surma... wouldn't it be funny if Eglamore was her real father? I don't think that's true, but just imagine Eglamore's reaction to the news...
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Post by TBeholder on Jul 15, 2017 11:03:38 GMT
Gunnerkrigg Court's robots are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more empathic and emotionally expressive than Anthony is. ...which is why my first guess on where this scene rolls was - "Kat, WHY did you make a robot in the shape of my father?"
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Post by todd on Jul 15, 2017 14:04:05 GMT
I wonder if some of Kat's thawing towards Anthony could be due to the discovery that he's been a pawn of the Court, manipulated by its leaders to do what they wanted, to satisfy their own agenda (and who then left him on his own when Coyote showed up and started knocking buildings down). We know that she's shown a lot of distrust towards the Court leadership ever since she found out about what the Founders did to Jeanne, and reaiizing that Anthony was used by them, a victim of their machinations, if in a different way than Jeanne was, could have softened her views of him.
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Shire
Junior Member
Posts: 77
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Post by Shire on Jul 15, 2017 14:24:33 GMT
Maybe because Jones never got a woman pregnant. That we know of. Wait, what?
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Post by Runningflame on Jul 15, 2017 17:55:57 GMT
Maybe because Jones never got a woman pregnant. That we know of. Wait, what? I believe that was Coyote disguised as Jones.
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Post by Igniz on Jul 16, 2017 10:58:43 GMT
These last two pages kind of remind me of the first, old chapters, both in tone and (though evolved) artistic style. Am I the only one?
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Post by pyradonis on Jul 16, 2017 22:11:16 GMT
There was also the "get that into my house" comment about the bottle Donny brought with him. I'm sure Tony has tons of dry jokes like these up his sleeve. It's a shame Annie is the main protagonist so we don't ever get to see them, haha... ha... *sigh* Annie seemed to get some of the worst qualities of her parents: her father's social awkwardness and anxiety, and her mother's anger and unwillingness to follow rules (sometimes). Some of their best qualities were lost in translation, such as Tony's dry humor, and also, and this is just an assumption but one I'm confident on, his academic success. Can't think of one for Surma - we don't really know her that well! This is not a criticism of Antimony, by the way. She's a great character, and I sort of identify with her. I see blindly following all rules as a far worse quality than sometimes not following them. For those who have started (again?) theorizing that Anthony is not Annie's real dad, here is the Word of Tom (brought to you by Chrysoprax): Also in several other answers, Tom stated that the majoity of the inherited parts of Annie's personality come from Anthony.
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Post by todd on Jul 16, 2017 23:42:18 GMT
For those who have started (again?) theorizing that Anthony is not Annie's real dad, here is the Word of Tom (brought to you by Chrysoprax): I think part of the trouble may be all those stories out there where the people who seemed to be the protagonist's parents really weren't, and his/her real biological mother and/or father were somebody else.
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Post by warrl on Jul 17, 2017 3:39:03 GMT
Here's a reality, according to some people who have studied the question.
Gather up birth and marriage records and identify your four great-grandfathers.
There's a better than 50% chance you're wrong about at least one of them.
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