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Post by Nepycros on Jun 26, 2013 15:56:46 GMT
Despite how distant Anthony Carver seems to be from Antimony, I can't help but feel that finding her fingerprint on the moon might strike as startling to the inquisitive and analytic man. For that matter, Antimony has no doubt made herself known throughout most of the Court, given all her happenings.
He no doubt knew of her nightly brigades with the Guides at Good Hope, and still sent her to a school where her skills in the ether would develop, either as a countermeasure to give her the skills she needs to grow, or otherwise to instill some kind of trait or quality used to his advantage in the future. His love for Surma being what it is, and how he doesn't compare apples to oranges, he could very well see her 'fire' as a transferable and ethereal quality he could identify as Surma's, despite being in Antimony. That's worrisome, but such body-swapping qualities have already been presented in the story.
Then there's Microsat 5. Why medical supplies? Are the Court's simply of a higher grade? He worked in a hospital for years, no doubt he'd have easy access anywhere with his resourcefulness. As much as he probably wanted to talk with Annie, I don't see where he'll get the thought in his head to recruit his old friends, no doubt knowing the stir it would raise by him popping in and out of their lives.
The points of interest I have in this story centered around her activity with Anthony are: Page 292, when she states she won't hear a word from him for over 2 years. Page 501 is when she discovers she, in fact, did place her print on the moon. Page 1000 ends the chapter with her receiving word from her long-missing parent. Such massive gaps, and yet his methodical exploits with medical research haven't ended, in all the time since Surma's died.
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 26, 2013 17:47:00 GMT
>I can't help but feel that finding her fingerprint on the moon might strike as startling to the inquisitive and analytic man.
At the very least it would reinvigorate the space program to figure out what the hell it is.
>sent her to a school where her skills in the ether would develop
Right? What a nice guy. The only thing he could have improved on was the "being a father and not a murky presence on the edge of her life" part.
>Why medical supplies? Are the Court's simply of a higher grade?
Very likely. Or there were compounds/medicines he couldn't get anywhere else. As a graduate of the court he no doubt has connections there as well.
Welcome to the forum.
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Post by Nepycros on Jun 26, 2013 18:24:15 GMT
>At the very least it would reinvigorate the space program to figure out what the hell it is.
But Anthony's involvement in the ethereal research isn't fully known. To that end, would he even make the connection that his daughter is in contact with Coyote? I'm sure he'd compare fingerprints if he had the chance. That would be terrifying, setting your Fire Elemental daughter up with the Trickster God.
>Right? What a nice guy. The only thing he could have improved on was the "being a father and not a murky presence on the edge of her life" part.
Here's to hoping he hasn't taken on a side relationship with poor ol' Brinnie, wherever she may be.
>Very likely. Or there were compounds/medicines he couldn't get anywhere else. As a graduate of the court he no doubt has connections there as well.
Speaking of, he knows just about every adult Antimony would be in contact with. To some extent, that's actually good parenting, setting up your daughter in an area with people you know she can trust. The only real problem I can find with this is tension with Eglamore. He did freak out and shout 'SURMA!' when Annie fell off the bridge.
>Welcome to the forum.
'Tis a good welcome. Couldn't ask for better.
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 26, 2013 18:52:31 GMT
I'm sure he's tried to delve into the etheric sciences, but I always got the impression that he was like Jack's dad, and didn't really care for what he perceived as "magic". If he was aware of his daughter's eventual role as medium, then he must have known she would come into contact with Coyote.
>Speaking of, he knows just about every adult Antimony would be in contact with. To some extent, that's actually good parenting, setting up your daughter in an area with people you know she can trust. The only real problem I can find with this is tension with Eglamore. He did freak out and shout 'SURMA!' when Annie fell off the bridge.
Yeah, to some extent. It would have been nice if he stuck around to do some actual parenting, but hey, maybe he is out saving the world. Who knows.
Eglamore's outburst also intrigued me, and it's certainly fodder for the "Annie IS Surma" theory, although a counterpoint would be that Antimony inherited her father's coldness, showing that she is still half and half and not a clone. Then again, the coldness could just as easily be a result of emotional loss and neglect as biological predisposition.
>'Tis a good welcome.
'Tis a good forum. You'll like it here.
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Post by Per on Jun 26, 2013 19:04:53 GMT
Can we change the topic to read "McCarver"?
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Post by Steam Engine on Jun 26, 2013 19:16:12 GMT
Isn't "no parents" what all teenagers strive for?
And personally I think that Antony does something important to his daughter. I suspect he is trying to find a way to safely "extinguish" her inner fire that will cause her death if she has a child. And in "Divine" he might have made the first attempt to do it. He used narcosis and started the operation. But it was interrupted! Oh, NEXT time he'll make sure that her friends (who love her, worry for her, there's no doubt, but just don't see the whole picture!) won't interfere in the process.
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Post by lachcat on Jun 26, 2013 20:36:45 GMT
>Eglamore's outburst also intrigued me, and it's certainly fodder for the "Annie IS Surma" theory, although a counterpoint would be that Antimony inherited her father's coldness, showing that she is still half and half and not a clone. Then again, the coldness could just as easily be a result of emotional loss and neglect as biological predisposition.
I'd always assumed it was simply unresolved feelings on Eglamore's part (as hinted by keeping his old knife, among other things). Or perhaps Surma was in a similar bridge-falling-off situation before... ahh, speculation...
>And personally I think that Antony does something important to his daughter. I suspect he is trying to find a way to safely "extinguish" her inner fire that will cause her death if she has a child.
Extinguishing her inner fire would seem to me be akin to destroying half of her soul... he might have goodwill behind it as you suggest, but it's still a terrible thing to do someone (especially without consent!)
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Post by Nepycros on Jun 26, 2013 21:41:16 GMT
>I'd always assumed it was simply unresolved feelings on Eglamore's part (as hinted by keeping his old knife, among other things). Or perhaps Surma was in a similar bridge-falling-off situation before... ahh, speculation...
Probably the former. Recall when Jones suggested he stop undressing the female students. He looked at Annie, and started saying, "Oh... Oh god..." and ran off. He can't stop seeing Surma in Annie. This is why it's actually dangerous, because we don't know how emotionally attached he's making himself.
Annie doesn't seem to like or trust him, though. She often shoots a glare his way for hardly anything.
>Extinguishing her inner fire would seem to me be akin to destroying half of her soul... he might have goodwill behind it as you suggest, but it's still a terrible thing to do someone (especially without consent!)
I think he means to say removing her supernatural nature. Making her fully human. Though that makes no sense if he sends her off to an ethereal world.
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 26, 2013 21:45:40 GMT
Isn't "no parents" what all teenagers strive for? Until it's time to do laundry. Then they yearn for the days of yore. And in "Divine" he might have made the first attempt to do it. I knew it! I knew that bone laser was up to no good.
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Post by Mezzaphor on Jun 26, 2013 21:57:44 GMT
Despite how distant Anthony Carver seems to be from Antimony, I can't help but feel that finding her fingerprint on the moon might strike as startling to the inquisitive and analytic man. As far as Tony knows, it's just some random fingerprint on the moon. Strange, but nothing personal. There's no particular reason for him to know Annie's fingerprints. (I don't know any of my family's fingerprints.) And Tom has stated that Annie's fingerprints aren't on file in any databases, so there's no way anyone outside the Court could trace the mark on the moon back to her.
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tpman
Full Member
Posts: 161
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Post by tpman on Jun 27, 2013 0:12:23 GMT
I'm betting that there wasn't anything special about the Court's medical supplies. Anthony just didn't have access to any in whatever far-flung place it is he happens to be inhabiting. MicroSat 5 was his only method of acquiring surgical insturnments in a timely or discreet manner.
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 27, 2013 5:00:40 GMT
I'm betting that there wasn't anything special about the Court's medical supplies. Anthony just didn't have access to any in whatever far-flung place it is he happens to be inhabiting. MicroSat 5 was his only method of acquiring surgical insturnments in a timely or discreet manner. It would raise the question of how they get the supplies back from orbit. Any object that wanted to return to the atmosphere would need retro-rockets to slow it down independent of the satellite, and a GPS system to both select the right landing site and provide a beacon to show where it did land. Seems a bit much for a few scalpels.
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Post by feraldog on Jun 27, 2013 7:38:34 GMT
Am I the only one who liked laundry as a teenager?
(The cat box, on the other hand).
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 27, 2013 8:23:53 GMT
Am I the only one who liked laundry as a teenager? (The cat box, on the other hand). Cleaning out a cat box is a punishment I wouldn't inflict on my worst enemy. Laundry is all right if you're in a meditative mood. I didn't like doing it as a youngin, but it was that or let dear old mom find the weed in my pockets.
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Post by philman on Jun 27, 2013 10:13:04 GMT
I think saying that Annie IS Surma is a bit much, again I think the analogy of a phoenix is relevant. Born in fire, and when it lays an egg it dies in a self-immolating fire that causes the egg to hatch, so the mother and child phoenix cannot be alive at the same time. I'm sure we saw a phoenix feather in the most recent treatise so I'm sure it will be extrapolated upon at some point. Annie and Surma are different people, but have a shared spark of life.
It's interesting that someone mentioned Tony trying to save Annie by extinguishing the fire within her, and maybe that had something to do with the bone laser. Maybe he couldn't bear to see his wife die as Annie got stronger, and doesn't want to see his daughter die on him the same way. So he is trying to save her, but at the same time doesn't want to get too close to her, so won't want to have the same feelings of hurt if he fails. He's a coward, certainly, but doesn't mean he is bad.
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Post by Steam Engine on Jun 27, 2013 19:00:35 GMT
but at the same time doesn't want to get too close to her, so won't want to have the same feelings of hurt if he fails. That is not what I thought. I see him working his fingers to the bone to save his daughter, sleeping only when he feels that his brain cannot work at all, spending all his time in the library or laboratory. Time is working against him - he has spent more then two years just to make a first attempt, and it has failed! If he succeeds, he will beg Antimony for forgiveness, but right now... Right now he has work to do. A huge amount of work to do. And so little time...
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Post by stef1987 on Jun 27, 2013 20:46:48 GMT
I suspect he is trying to find a way to safely "extinguish" her inner fire that will cause her death if she has a child. And in "Divine" he might have made the first attempt to do it. He used narcosis and started the operation. But it was interrupted! yeah I think that's the general assumption. But does no one find it odd how Annie's sudden (father-related) illness happened right after the call from her dad? It just reminds me of those FBI/CIA/KGB movie stuff where people are brainwashed but acting normal, but then they get into a different mental-state by triggering them with some "activation" code-words. It looks a lot to me like it was the call that got her ill, rather than those medical supplies they send or whatever. like the whole medical supplies request was just a cover for the actual activation-words in the message. Well it probably isn't, but you know, it just seems a bit like that to me.
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Post by philman on Jun 27, 2013 21:44:14 GMT
I suspect he is trying to find a way to safely "extinguish" her inner fire that will cause her death if she has a child. And in "Divine" he might have made the first attempt to do it. He used narcosis and started the operation. But it was interrupted! yeah I think that's the general assumption. But does no one find it odd how Annie's sudden (father-related) illness happened right after the call from her dad? It just reminds me of those FBI/CIA/KGB movie stuff where people are brainwashed but acting normal, but then they get into a different mental-state by triggering them with some "activation" code-words. It looks a lot to me like it was the call that got her ill, rather than those medical supplies they send or whatever. like the whole medical supplies request was just a cover for the actual activation-words in the message. Well it probably isn't, but you know, it just seems a bit like that to me. That was my thought, or at least something similar. Something in that phone call or what Annie and Donny did triggered it. And really, he can do all that and not even say hello to the daughter he is supposedly trying to save?
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Post by fuzzyone on Jun 28, 2013 1:52:53 GMT
Perhaps his mentality is more, "Every moment I'm not working on this cure, is a moment I cannot get back. It makes it that much more possible and even likely that she is in danger. All of my attention must be on this cure. She can hate me for my distance. She can hate that I wasn't there. She could even hate that I took this particular thing away from her. But she'll live to hate me."
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 28, 2013 6:44:46 GMT
I wonder if the fact that the fire will die out if the carrier does not have children is a motivating factor to have children and perpetuate the cycle.
Perhaps Tony is not mature enough to accept this.
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Post by Steam Engine on Jun 28, 2013 9:34:45 GMT
Perhaps Tony is not mature enough to accept this. Perhaps Tony is desperate enough to defy etherical laws to let his daughter live normal life.
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Post by Nepycros on Jun 28, 2013 12:26:19 GMT
By golly I think I know where he's gone. The old section of the library! I was just perusing old chapters for humor, but I noticed that while they were coming up with a report on Greek mythology, Kat and Annie discovered a row of glowing paintings, each with a row of footprints leading away from the painter's perspective! They've got to somehow transport a person to the perspective in question! That's how he can escape suspicion and yet remain observant, if he is observant at all. This is a way for him to seem like a not-so-distant parent.
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Post by fuzzyone on Jun 28, 2013 12:47:34 GMT
Good theory. However, Tom has said in the past that those paintings were a plot thread that he has since abandoned. It might be a nice way to bring them back in... If I, as a writer, had introduced something like that, then changed my mind as to what they connected to in the future, I'd certainly be planning some way to try and work them back in.
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 29, 2013 0:15:05 GMT
Perhaps Tony is not mature enough to accept this. Perhaps Tony is desperate enough to defy etherical laws to let his daughter live normal life. If I had Human Torch powers I would tell the normal life to pound sand. Then again, I don't plan on having kids, and neither does my old lady, so no danger of premature, child-induced demise.
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Post by Steam Engine on Jun 29, 2013 9:18:31 GMT
Perhaps Tony is desperate enough to defy etherical laws to let his daughter live normal life. If I had Human Torch powers I would tell the normal life to pound sand. Then again, I don't plan on having kids, and neither does my old lady, so no danger of premature, child-induced demise. You do not. Does Antimony? We don't know. Perhaps Tony knows.
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Post by sidhekin on Jun 29, 2013 9:33:31 GMT
How would he know? How would even Antimony know?
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Post by Steam Engine on Jun 29, 2013 10:30:32 GMT
How would he know? How would even Antimony know? Well, I don't mean that he knows for sure. I mean that he knew her mother. She knew that her child would kill her, and all her ancestors (by "elemental line", of course) knew that their child would kill them, but they still have chosen to have child and die rather then live long and prosper. So, thinks Tony, maybe it was not something they could control? (I remember someone saying that Tom said that it is instinctive, but I can't give any proofs, so you may not take this into account.)
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Post by GK Sierra on Jun 29, 2013 19:56:03 GMT
If I had Human Torch powers I would tell the normal life to pound sand. Then again, I don't plan on having kids, and neither does my old lady, so no danger of premature, child-induced demise. You do not. Don't remind me Does Antimony? We don't know. Perhaps Tony knows. Looks pretty human torch to me.
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Post by Steam Engine on Jun 29, 2013 20:07:09 GMT
What's so important with that "human torch"? What's that?
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Post by The Anarch on Jun 30, 2013 4:34:04 GMT
I think GK thought you were talking about her fire abilities rather than her possible desire to have kids.
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