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Post by legion on Oct 29, 2010 15:37:16 GMT
TAlso, his slight stutter reminded me of Diego - did Tom do that on purpose? First thing I thought as well. I think it means that Renard's love, like Diego's, is not reciprocal. And that Renard might take drastic action as a result. Not drastic like Diego/Jeanne of course, but drastic enough that someone might get hurt. Foreshadowing of Renard taking the body of a man, and eventually killing him. Oh, and then, that would explain why Rey was the first to call Diego a coward, because he better than anyone else was able to understand how Diego felt.
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Post by Per on Oct 29, 2010 16:31:08 GMT
This chapter is actually called "The Coward Heart, pt 2".
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Post by evilanagram on Oct 29, 2010 17:08:55 GMT
A dream mixed with a Memory would be my guess Only in a dream do I think he would have the courage to tell Surma his feelings face to face, when he was his old self. Why would you think that? Renard seems like exactly the sort of person who would be willing to tell Surma he loved her before he ended up with all the emotional baggage from whatever it was that happened when he arrived at the Court. Oh, and then, that would explain why Rey was the first to call Diego a coward, because he better than anyone else was able to understand how Diego felt. Reynardine called Diego a coward because Robot said, "She died and we did nothing." It was a simple deduction on his part. That said, Surma's spurning Rey's advances does inform his harshness in panel five here. This chapter is actually called "The Coward Heart, pt 2". Except Rey isn't a coward: he told Surma he loved her. He was willing to face rejection so that he might experience love. Parley was a coward for being too afraid to admit her feelings. He may understand unrequited love, but he wasn't too afraid to try and start up a relationship. Hell, he gave up everything to pursue one.
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Post by zylonbane on Oct 29, 2010 17:32:02 GMT
Surma can't admit her love to Renard, because foxes don't have eyebrows.
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Post by Casey on Oct 29, 2010 17:53:20 GMT
Except Rey isn't a coward: he told Surma he loved her. To be fair, so did Diego.
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Post by Refugee on Oct 29, 2010 17:59:46 GMT
Politically incorrect snark:
Ladies? You know how you're always criticizing us guys for not telling you we love you?
This is why.
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Post by terramaster on Oct 29, 2010 18:45:01 GMT
Surma falls and ends up in the hospital.
And Daaaaaawwwwwwww
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Post by blahzor on Oct 29, 2010 19:03:54 GMT
I was expecting another full-chapter flashback à la Ties, but it looks like this chapter's plot arc might be more similar to S1's. This page seems a tad surreal, but nothing happening is outside the realm of possibility for the GC world, so I don't think we should dismiss it as a dream just yet. i still think this is a Annie chapter and her relation to Reynard's relation to her mom
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Post by Fhqwhgads on Oct 29, 2010 19:04:40 GMT
Surma can't admit her love to Renard, because foxes don't have eyebrows. /thread ;D
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Post by Elaienar on Oct 29, 2010 19:09:21 GMT
Politically incorrect snark: Ladies? You know how you're always criticizing us guys for not telling you we love you? This is why. Okay, so I'm not the only one thinking that Surma's being kind of, well, mean? Because Renard seems to be asking a genuine question and her response is "enigmatic smile" and "change the subject", and I feel kind of bad for the poor guy. ): At least we know which parent Antimony got her skills at changing the subject from.
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Brinunah
New Member
DFTBA - An Initialism Standing for "Don't Forget To Be Awesome"
Posts: 13
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Post by Brinunah on Oct 29, 2010 19:29:08 GMT
I am so in love with that transition panel sequence at the end <3 -breathy sigh of love-
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Post by Tenjen on Oct 29, 2010 19:30:24 GMT
theres no good answer or response to this
its very different from diego's situation and context, renard isnt a delusional asshat but comparisons can be made just the same.
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Post by Casey on Oct 29, 2010 20:33:06 GMT
By the way, I'm sure you guys saw Tom's link in the author comments on this page, which goes to his guest strip on The Intrepid Girlbot, but in case you didn't, you should really go check the guest strip out.
I found it very moving and impactful, and it goes right to the heart of an issue that happens to be in the public dialogue a lot lately here in the United States. I don't know if Tom was aware of that or if he just happened to choose that angle, but I thought it was brilliantly done nonetheless and I think you should all check it out.
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Post by Casey on Oct 29, 2010 20:39:41 GMT
No holds barred for the Freakiest Surma Face I see. Looks like a demented bobblehead... By the way I don't know if you follow Tom's Twitter or not, but he said he was going to try to "fix" this when he gets home. I didn't think there was anything wrong with it, it was a perspective shot like I'd said. Not saying you don't have a right to your opinion, because obviously you do, but perhaps the way we phrase things we should keep in mind how they might be taken by the author who already (mistakenly) believes his artwork isn't fabulous (which it is).
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Post by phyzome on Oct 29, 2010 20:45:05 GMT
Time for some chapter-title speculation!
"Fire Spike"... fire no doubt refers to Surma, the fire-headed girl.
After this latest page, it looks like she is a spike through Renard's heart.
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Post by Rex on Oct 29, 2010 20:45:33 GMT
While Surma looks HILARIOUS in that one panel, I always thought that was an intentional perspective/fish eye lens look.
That said, I don't know why Tom thinks his art stinks. This stuff not only has solid line art, but it's in COLOR (and that's well done as well).
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Post by zylonbane on Oct 29, 2010 21:22:00 GMT
By the way, I'm sure you guys saw Tom's link in the author comments on this page, which goes to his guest strip on The Intrepid Girlbot, but in case you didn't, you should really go check the guest strip out. BANDWIDTH LIMIT EXCEEDEDHappy now?
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Post by Casey on Oct 29, 2010 21:28:32 GMT
By the way, I'm sure you guys saw Tom's link in the author comments on this page, which goes to his guest strip on The Intrepid Girlbot, but in case you didn't, you should really go check the guest strip out. BANDWIDTH LIMIT EXCEEDEDHappy now? Funny man, Girlbot's site was apparently already down by that point. It may have been because Tom linked to it in his own Twitter and on-page? Tom has a LOT of followers. Or it could be completely unrelated.
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jkate
New Member
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Post by jkate on Oct 29, 2010 21:33:19 GMT
While Surma looks HILARIOUS in that one panel, I always thought that was an intentional perspective/fish eye lens look. That said, I don't know why Tom thinks his art stinks. This stuff not only has solid line art, but it's in COLOR (and that's well done as well). I would probably start thinking my art stinks too if people were comparing it to "demented bobbleheads." This chapter looks exciting. I like learning about Reynardine.
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Post by mistysoul on Oct 29, 2010 21:59:21 GMT
Ok I just thought of something. I'm not trying to imply anything .. weird or anything, but just hear me out. Have you ever noticed how Surma kind of looks like a fox? I mean, look at panel 3 there. Is that not the foxiest expression you've ever seen on a gal? Not to mention her hair is such a perfect shade of red, and it bushes out in the back kind of like a fox tail. She's also thin and lanky, and probably quite graceful on her feet. Her personality is sort of what you would expect from a fox too. Just from the limited content we've seen her in you can tell that she's clever and enjoys playing around (when she was healthy anyway). If Surma was an animal, she would totally be a fox with deep red fur the color of her hair. ..On second thought, forget I said anything.
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Post by Rex on Oct 29, 2010 22:06:52 GMT
That's cute, the idea that two different kinds of foxes (one is a fox, the other is a foxy lady) getting definitely has some appeal to it.
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Post by Refugee on Oct 29, 2010 22:21:18 GMT
Forgive me if someone else has mentioned this, and I missed it, but:
Are we finding out what eventually put Surma in the hospital?
Is this before or after Annie was born?
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Sadie
Full Member
I eat food and sleep in a horizontal position.
Posts: 146
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Post by Sadie on Oct 29, 2010 22:25:00 GMT
Politically incorrect snark: Ladies? You know how you're always criticizing us guys for not telling you we love you? This is why. ....a woman -- who may or may not be in love with them -- not responding to a love confession the way they want is the reason guys can't tell their actual girlfriends "I love you" more often? Huh. Learn something new every day. I'm super curious about what all is going on in the background of this scene and Surma's thoughts and feelings about all of it. Did she not hear him, or heard and rejected out of callous, or just didn't know what to do with the situation, or something else entirely different? We've seen precious little of how Surma's brain works.
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Post by jayne on Oct 29, 2010 23:25:48 GMT
Politically incorrect snark: Ladies? You know how you're always criticizing us guys for not telling you we love you? This is why. Okay, so I'm not the only one thinking that Surma's being kind of, well, mean? Because Renard seems to be asking a genuine question and her response is "enigmatic smile" and "change the subject", and I feel kind of bad for the poor guy. ): At least we know which parent Antimony got her skills at changing the subject from. There's really no kind way of saying you don't love someone who is in love with you. Hurts like hell no matter how its done. Even so, I don't think Surma heard it honestly... she's playing with her new skill and wanted to show it to her friend... then flew high up to show off... if Rey hadn't followed, she'd probably fly back to get his reaction. I should think Surma knows of Rey's infatuation but maybe not how deep it goes.... and probably doesn't think she should take it seriously.
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Post by djublonskopf on Oct 30, 2010 2:04:10 GMT
She died, and Reynard did nothing.
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Post by basser on Oct 30, 2010 2:28:45 GMT
No holds barred for the Freakiest Surma Face I see. Looks like a demented bobblehead... By the way I don't know if you follow Tom's Twitter or not, but he said he was going to try to "fix" this when he gets home. I didn't think there was anything wrong with it, it was a perspective shot like I'd said. Not saying you don't have a right to your opinion, because obviously you do, but perhaps the way we phrase things we should keep in mind how they might be taken by the author who already (mistakenly) believes his artwork isn't fabulous (which it is). Oh jeez, I didn't mean it that way. I thought it was intentionally trippy to go along with the whole dream imagery thing. And anyway it still is completely freaky. Mostly I think her mouth and chin needs to be smaller, if we're going for an actual perspective shot. With it large like that it tricks the eye into thinking her whole face is on the same horizontal plane, meaning her neck would have to be attached to the back of her skull, which equals bobblehead. Make her mouth/chin area smaller, and she's still looking upwards but with her face tilted more naturally. Also, Tom reads the forum? I didn't know that. Oh well. Hey, Tom, I love your comic and your art is spectacular, keep on keeping on. Perspective shots are always ridiculously hard to get right. Moving on from that, though: even if Renard professed his undying love for Surma and she reciprocated with her own ceaseless adoration, what future is there for them as a couple? She's a human, with all the natural human wants and desires, and he's a... fox.. demon.. thing. Slot A won't really fit into slot B, if you know what I mean.
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Post by hal9000 on Oct 30, 2010 3:23:45 GMT
TAlso, his slight stutter reminded me of Diego - did Tom do that on purpose? First thing I thought as well. I think it means that Renard's love, like Diego's, is not reciprocal. And that Renard might take drastic action as a result. Not drastic like Diego/Jeanne of course, but drastic enough that someone might get hurt. Foreshadowing of Renard taking the body of a man, and eventually killing him. Also, I don't believe this is a dream, but an accurate memory. Remember, Coyote said that with practice, Annie would be able to lift her whole body with the slightest thought. And we know Surma has blinker stone type powers even without using a stone. And it's not hard to believe that Renard could fly, being a deity of sorts. Depending on the circumstances in which Rey killed the boy from the court (not to mention Sivo), his and Diego's actions might end up being similarly dire.
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Post by Elaienar on Oct 30, 2010 4:11:09 GMT
Okay, so I'm not the only one thinking that Surma's being kind of, well, mean? Because Renard seems to be asking a genuine question and her response is "enigmatic smile" and "change the subject", and I feel kind of bad for the poor guy. ): At least we know which parent Antimony got her skills at changing the subject from. There's really no kind way of saying you don't love someone who is in love with you. Hurts like hell no matter how its done. Even so, I don't think Surma heard it honestly... she's playing with her new skill and wanted to show it to her friend... then flew high up to show off... if Rey hadn't followed, she'd probably fly back to get his reaction. I should think Surma knows of Rey's infatuation but maybe not how deep it goes.... and probably doesn't think she should take it seriously. Yeah, you're probably right. I don't think the Surma we've seen in Antimony's memories would laugh off someone she knew was truly in love with her. And on another note ... five cookies says the next page shows Antimony waking up from the weirdest dream she's ever had.
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Post by Aurelia Verity on Oct 30, 2010 4:15:47 GMT
I think the biggest different between Diego and Renard (going by what we have seen of the two of them) is that Diego blamed Jeanne entirely for not being in love with him. He never stopped to consider that there is something about him that she finds unlikable. His love turned to resentment so quickly because he thought himself perfectly deserving of her. It was her own fault, she chose some traitor over him. Renard, on the other hand, obviously thought that there was something wrong with him that prevented Surma from loving him. Right now it seems to be purely his physical form. We still don't know who was it that Renard killed but it was neither Eglamore not Anthony Carver. If his victim was chosen by chance and not out of revenge or jealousy then that mean that Renard killed in the hope of changing himself and possibly being with the one he loves. I am not excusing Renard, killing a man for the sake of love is still killing, but it does seem like he was willing to go to great lengths for his love while Diego, once he receive his rejection, simply acted out of spite.
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Post by jayne on Oct 30, 2010 4:16:17 GMT
There's really no kind way of saying you don't love someone who is in love with you. Hurts like hell no matter how its done. Even so, I don't think Surma heard it honestly... she's playing with her new skill and wanted to show it to her friend... then flew high up to show off... if Rey hadn't followed, she'd probably fly back to get his reaction. I should think Surma knows of Rey's infatuation but maybe not how deep it goes.... and probably doesn't think she should take it seriously. Yeah, you're probably right. I don't think the Surma we've seen in Antimony's memories would laugh off someone she knew was truly in love with her. And on another note ... five cookies says the next page shows Antimony waking up from the weirdest dream she's ever had. I'll see your five cookies and raise you another three that we see Annie waking Rey because he was whimpering in his sleep...
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