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Post by jda on Jun 1, 2022 7:03:21 GMT
Famous last words, Katerina.
Where we see the Rift start to tear Annie and Kat apart. I'd regret to see Kat high on her own fumes (just for creating a new sentient race by herself) and deny even the possibility of being called upon. "Don't you see my magnificence?"
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Post by philman on Jun 1, 2022 7:05:59 GMT
Ah, the first steps towards mad science.
As much as this is interesting, does anyone else find it weird that this lecture is coming from Renard, an etheric being hardly known for ethics or morality himself?
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laaaa
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Post by laaaa on Jun 1, 2022 7:08:12 GMT
This conversation puzzles me. It's not as if the Court is moral NOW, nor as if the only thing keeping the Court in check is the ether/Coyote/whatever.
Leaving the ether behind is nore similar (I think) to leaving, say, biology behind, or math behind. They decide they want nothing to do with x part of the world.
But, how could that make you more or less moral?
The Court already answers to no one.
I'm confused.
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Post by blahzor on Jun 1, 2022 7:17:24 GMT
Oh look that bad path she would have went down if she didn't know Annie
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Post by flowsthead on Jun 1, 2022 7:18:45 GMT
So is Kat taking a defacto position with the Court now? That's...odd, considering everything that came before. Not to mention she herself identified that the new humans would be left behind.
The only thing I can come up with is that she finds individual stories more compelling than the possibilities for an untold number. Her being heartbroken over the story of Jeanne and Annie's story of what the guides made her do with her mother were all personal stories. What happens to the new robots isn't personal to Kat yet. But even assuming this line of reasoning on behalf of her, it still reads kind of weird. She seems unusually naive here.
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Post by theonethatgotaway on Jun 1, 2022 7:27:43 GMT
Hahahahaha, LAUGHING ON LINE.
Who's this "WE", Kat? The Court that uses forest creatures and faeries as menial workers? The people that abuse sentient robots as second class citizens? Maybe you meant you and Tony, the guy that gets so angry at his own daughter he actively was ruining her life instead of managing to have a talk with her one way or another?
I think you need to go have a talk with Jones about what people think is "right" or "wrong".
edit: oh yeesh, ProBoards automatically writes out LAUGHING ON LINE.? That's haunting.
Edit 2: stop it! I said EL . OW . EL!
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Post by mochakimono on Jun 1, 2022 7:38:42 GMT
Kat, I seem to recall you sobbing in despair over the horrors of what all the other scientists at this institution have done both recently and in the past, multiple times. I think everyone in this scene knows gosh darn well the Court most certainly does not always know right from wrong.
That and, why is she even surprised that ethics are being brought up? What other restrictions could the Court be possibly wanting to avoid, which doesn't involve using magic to do so? Escaping the laws of physics themselves?
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Jun 1, 2022 7:38:45 GMT
ProBoards automatically writes out LAUGHING ON LINE.? That's haunting. Not sure if joking but that substitution and others like it were manually set... one of the few actual rules on the forum is #2 no "AOL speak." Spelling out In My Humble Opinion and the like is of the many reasons my posts here look weird. Come to think of it I really should go back and spell out my Too Long; Didn't Reads for consistency but that's one that still passes for some reason. |
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Post by mochakimono on Jun 1, 2022 7:40:15 GMT
edit: oh yeesh, ProBoards automatically writes out LAUGHING ON LINE.? That's haunting. Edit 2: stop it! I said EL . OW . EL! I believe it's a specific quirk of this board, to curtail slang and leetspeak. edit: Oops, ninja'd. |
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Post by basser on Jun 1, 2022 7:42:39 GMT
Ah, the first steps towards mad science. As much as this is interesting, does anyone else find it weird that this lecture is coming from Renard, an etheric being hardly known for ethics or morality himself? Renard's spent the majority of the past 17 years of this comic engaged in a long character arc of intense self-reflection, critical examination of his moral framework, and slow rebuilding of his shattered personal identity after his old mindset of entitled hubris drew him into a series of terrible mistakes. Doesn't seem weird to me. Y'all forget the chapter where he tried to debate a ghost shrimp into being a better person-shrimp, failed, ripped that b in half, realized his futile shrimp therapy efforts ultimately led to more suffering than if he'd ripped the thing in half to begin with, then went to have a sad puppy hang-out sesh with Eggers? Fox Papa been working on this subtle complexities of mortality knot for a dang ol while now. |
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Post by Per on Jun 1, 2022 7:48:14 GMT
A thousand years ago someone said what you say now, but they at least had ether, so you better beware, check and mate
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laaaa
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Post by laaaa on Jun 1, 2022 7:48:42 GMT
Okay, upon further reflection I think I'm beggining to get both their points.
The Court is not simply trying to avoid a pesky natural law, they want to override an essential part of the world: the only part of the world (aparently) that they cannot control; in other words, the only part of the world that could trump them over. They want absolute control, and therefore YES, going further down that path with that kind of mentality could lead them to forsake other undesirable "limits".
And I think Kat knows this. That's why she thinks that she'll have more freedom if she goes with the Court, even though the ether has been a source of inspiration for her. It's not that her research won't be regulated by the Court's officials; it will be, but they'll probably encourage her to research the very limits of any natural law she wants.
Edit: like, until now she has been constucting tissue, organs and bodies. It was for the benefit of someone who lost his arm, and to give bodies and freedom to creatures that were trapped, abused and limited (and they wanted to). That's admirable. Clap clap!
But what's next? Could she try to create a new type of organ? How about a completely new species? Maybe a hybrid? (but not in a rice-with-carrot-proteins-inside type; in a let's-splice-cat-and-dog-genes-to-create-the-ultimate-pet type). What if she tries to make it sentient? What is she tries to increase intelligence in human brains? What if she tries to increase intelligence in unborn babies?
HM.
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Post by arkadi on Jun 1, 2022 7:52:09 GMT
wtf Kat, you've lived in the Court your whole life, you've seen the kind of fucked up crap they get up to on a daily basis, you've had to deal with the fallout. How can you say something like that?
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Jun 1, 2022 8:24:08 GMT
wtf Kat, you've lived in the Court your whole life, you've seen the kind of fucked up crap they get up to on a daily basis, you've had to deal with the fallout. How can you say something like that? Because she's lived in the Court her whole life the stuff they do is her normal. Also I'd wager her curriculum isn't heavy in "history of" and ethics. |
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Post by rafk on Jun 1, 2022 8:49:36 GMT
wtf Kat, you've lived in the Court your whole life, you've seen the kind of fucked up crap they get up to on a daily basis, you've had to deal with the fallout. How can you say something like that? Because mad science. Academia is full of people like Kat who see themselves as geniuses and the rules only being for OTHER people who need to be kept from putting their underpants on their heads. Kat is a real genius but so are some of the others who think like that. |
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Post by speedwell on Jun 1, 2022 9:16:13 GMT
The Court may seek to leave any aspect of the natural world and their natural functioning behind, I suppose. But in the end they will merely be forced to confront the fact that no matter how much they seek to escape reality, reality won't be escaped. They will come up against the wall of their own status as humans whether they like it or not.
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Post by rafk on Jun 1, 2022 9:18:12 GMT
Ah, the first steps towards mad science. As much as this is interesting, does anyone else find it weird that this lecture is coming from Renard, an etheric being hardly known for ethics or morality himself? I would say that Renard has had huge character development since becoming Annie's literal Morality Pet and it is not at all weird for him to be the voice of reason and caution. |
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Post by guntherkrieg on Jun 1, 2022 10:39:37 GMT
"My analysis of historical data suggests an 97.34% probability that you are aware of my birth on your planet, and my rebirth into beauty on Citadel Station."
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Post by guntherkrieg on Jun 1, 2022 10:40:31 GMT
The Court may seek to leave any aspect of the natural world and their natural functioning behind, I suppose. But in the end they will merely be forced to confront the fact that no matter how much they seek to escape reality, reality won't be escaped. They will come up against the wall of their own status as humans whether they like it or not. Time to upgrade! MORE. HUMAN. THAN. HUMAN! |
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Post by guntherkrieg on Jun 1, 2022 10:41:47 GMT
A thousand years ago someone said what you say now, but they at least had ether, so you better beware, check and mate Now Yahtzee my battleship! |
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Post by antiyonder on Jun 1, 2022 10:57:10 GMT
The Court may seek to leave any aspect of the natural world and their natural functioning behind, I suppose. But the future refused to change.... |
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Post by csj on Jun 1, 2022 12:00:48 GMT
Kat reveals herself to be a Moral Absolutist and Universalist and is immediately cancelled.
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Post by csj on Jun 1, 2022 12:03:32 GMT
The Court may seek to leave any aspect of the natural world and their natural functioning behind, I suppose. But in the end they will merely be forced to confront the fact that no matter how much they seek to escape reality, reality won't be escaped. They will come up against the wall of their own status as humans whether they like it or not. Time to upgrade! MORE. HUMAN. THAN. HUMAN! O brave new world, that has such people in ‘t |
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Post by razgrizx on Jun 1, 2022 12:31:18 GMT
I think people here are misinterpreting the "we" in Kat's sentence. I read "We" here is not the court but Kat and Annie especifically in the hypothetical scenario they'd leave together with the Court
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Post by pyradonis on Jun 1, 2022 13:17:32 GMT
It was for the benefit of someone who lost his arm, and to give bodies and freedom to creatures that were trapped, abused and limited (and they wanted to). Yup, and she went behind the backs of the people who were doing the trapping, abusing and limiting, and now wants to leave the ones she freed behind to go with the trappers, abusers and limiters, who suddenly know right from wrong. Okay.
I think people here are misinterpreting the "we" in Kat's sentence. I read "We" here is not the court but Kat and Annie especifically in the hypothetical scenario they'd leave together with the Court Except that Kat had been explicitly told that Annie would be left behind. |
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Post by todd on Jun 1, 2022 13:22:05 GMT
The Court might well see the ether as simply "monsters and dangerous animal-gods trying to bully us humans around", judging from its past experiences - in which case, doing away with the ether might seem to them like abolishing a tyrannical form of government and replacing it with something better.
But given the Court's own record (including the more disquieting aspects of the Omega Device), they might not replace it with anything better.
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laaaa
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Post by laaaa on Jun 1, 2022 13:29:47 GMT
I think people here are misinterpreting the "we" in Kat's sentence. I read "We" here is not the court but Kat and Annie especifically in the hypothetical scenario they'd leave together with the Court I'll also add that Kat has only really interacted with... her mom, dad, Tony. None of them is ruining the world For Science. People did horrible things for the Court in the past... |
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Post by sebastian on Jun 1, 2022 13:57:01 GMT
Nobody know right from wrong, Kat. The best one can do is come up with ... guidelines ("do unto others as you would have them do unto you", "sin start when you treat people as things - included yourself" you know, things like that, and even then one must be careful. 'do unto others' is fine, but what is one is a masochist and enjoy pain? These things can be tricky.
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Post by Gemminie on Jun 1, 2022 14:27:19 GMT
The previous page ends with Annie asking, "Wouldn't that be terrifying?", referring to the Court's new situation being free of restrictions and regulations.
And now we have an interaction between Kat and Renard. Renard's coming from the point of view of the immortal entity that he is, having seen a lot of human history. Those restrictions and regulations are there for a reason; they may have flaws, but they were put in place as a result of past tragedies, in hopes of preventing them from recurring. He's not putting it past the Court to throw away ethics and morality in pursuit of their goals.
Kat thinks that "we" know right from wrong (who exactly are "we?"), but Renard's point is that, in the past, people who said that very same thing still did the wrong thing. And people got hurt.
Kat's expression goes from good humor to shock to anger on this page. We only see Annie's expression once, and she looks worried. Renard's expression, as usual, is hard to read. We're seeing a long-slumbering conflict awaken here. It's possible that if this conversation hadn't taken place, Kat would have stayed behind, though she would've been tempted to go with the Court. But much more of this, with a rift coming between friends, she may be upset enough with Annie at the crucial moment that she chooses to go with the Court. And, as I've said before, the Court may not let anyone who's gone with them leave – or it may make it impossible for them to do so.
Wild speculation: Something they may be planning to do is upload their minds into a computer or some other sort of artificial brain, having appropriated Kat's research and that of Juliette to create it. That sort of closed system may be possible for Omega to predict, and it may also be out of reach of the Ether. I still don't see why they'd need a huge amount of Ether, an amount equivalent to Coyote's powers. Maybe to create a barrier around this system to keep all etheric entities and influences out?
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Post by theonethatgotaway on Jun 1, 2022 14:32:36 GMT
ProBoards automatically writes out LAUGHING ON LINE.? That's haunting. Not sure if joking but that substitution and others like it were manually set... one of the few actual rules on the forum is #2 no "AOL speak." Spelling out In My Humble Opinion and the like is of the many reasons my posts here look weird. Come to think of it I really should go back and spell out my Too Long; Didn't Reads for consistency but that's one that still passes for some reason. edit: oh yeesh, ProBoards automatically writes out LAUGHING ON LINE.? That's haunting. Edit 2: stop it! I said EL . OW . EL! I believe it's a specific quirk of this board, to curtail slang and leetspeak. edit: Oops, ninja'd. Well, Today I Learned! Might be for the umptieth time, I do tend to forget a lot. Thanks for the confirmation, my peeps! |
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