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Post by bicarbonat on Feb 6, 2020 8:21:52 GMT
If I was a mighty wizard, magic would be ordinary to me but it would still be magic. Exactly. There's a difference between unknowable and unknown. Annie doesn't share Kat's genius level of technical knowledge. What Kat does is on a "Star Trek" level of technobabble, but I get the sense that there's some sort of science behind it. All Zimmy seems to be saying is, "what is, is," which sounds very Ayn Randish, but doesn't actually explain anything. (She's also being confusing by saying "see," when what she means is "observe." Microwave radiation, microbes, black holes can be observed.) EDIT: Well, at least she's not blaming Ether on Midi-Chlorians or something. In the next page, Boxbot demonstrates that bananas are the perfect shape for a human hand, and socratically questions the girls on the provenance of this. As Boxbot lacks human hands, the whole production is a little underwhelming. |
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Post by bicarbonat on Feb 6, 2020 8:33:36 GMT
In other words: IT JUST WORKS A WIZARD DID IT. [observes red dot trained on forehead] Ahem. A professional in an unregulated or widely indecipherable field of work did or knows something. Everybody has jobs. Nothing wrong with that. Finish folding your little unicorn and eat your cereal, darling. |
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Post by pyradonis on Feb 6, 2020 17:28:11 GMT
If I was a mighty wizard, magic would be ordinary to me but it would still be magic. No. If you were a mighty wizard, magic would be defined as Will over Reality, because in the Paracelsian/Blakean paradigm of alchemical magic that Tom is using as a background for the comic, magic is Imagination manifested by Will and the manifestations of magic are Thought Forms. (Some of us are keeping up.) Think of Blue, the master illusionist. Another way of thinking of it is that the magicians believe they're making themselves into gods. Zimmy, the atheist, quite rightly knows that you can't get to the supernatural from within the natural; even magicians are subject to their status as beings within reality. And beings that are supernatural, if there is even such a thing, can't interact with the natural without becoming part of the natural world themselves (and, importantly, ceasing to be "outside" the natural world). Coyote left that part out. Sure, the Court can be seen as humanity trying to become gods (wizards, exerting will through imagination over the natural world from the "outside", and failing to see that "outside" is a place they can't get to). That's a sneaky clue to imply that the history of the actual gods is more like the supernatural successfully "descending to earth" as a result of the exertion of imagination. I have never heard of that paradigm, also I think you interpreted too much into my sentence - what I meant was, assuming that something that could be defined as magic existed, it would not cease to be such if it became an ordinary occurence. |
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Post by wies on Feb 6, 2020 17:34:53 GMT
No. If you were a mighty wizard, magic would be defined as Will over Reality, because in the Paracelsian/Blakean paradigm of alchemical magic that Tom is using as a background for the comic, magic is Imagination manifested by Will and the manifestations of magic are Thought Forms. (Some of us are keeping up.) Think of Blue, the master illusionist. Another way of thinking of it is that the magicians believe they're making themselves into gods. Zimmy, the atheist, quite rightly knows that you can't get to the supernatural from within the natural; even magicians are subject to their status as beings within reality. And beings that are supernatural, if there is even such a thing, can't interact with the natural without becoming part of the natural world themselves (and, importantly, ceasing to be "outside" the natural world). Coyote left that part out. Sure, the Court can be seen as humanity trying to become gods (wizards, exerting will through imagination over the natural world from the "outside", and failing to see that "outside" is a place they can't get to). That's a sneaky clue to imply that the history of the actual gods is more like the supernatural successfully "descending to earth" as a result of the exertion of imagination. I have never heard of that paradigm, also I think you interpreted too much into my sentence - what I meant was, assuming that something that could be defined as magic existed, it would not cease to be such if it became an ordinary occuren Depends on the magic. If the magic is wild and unpredictable - maybe that it still would be woundrous for any practiciser, but otherwise it would be soon regarded as an everday part of life. Most people can become shockingly quickly accustomed at what they would have outright declared to be witchcraft. |
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Post by pyradonis on Feb 6, 2020 22:18:27 GMT
I have never heard of that paradigm, also I think you interpreted too much into my sentence - what I meant was, assuming that something that could be defined as magic existed, it would not cease to be such if it became an ordinary occuren Depends on the magic. If the magic is wild and unpredictable - maybe that it still would be woundrous for any practiciser, but otherwise it would be soon regarded as an everday part of life. Most people can become shockingly quickly accustomed at what they would have outright declared to be witchcraft. But what I mean is that it does not need to be wondrous for the user to retain its definition. If I think of it as magic, then to me it is magic. Except if magic is defined as something one cannot understand, but I was not talking about a specific definition, and... anyway, this little sentence is not really worth it to discuss so much.
However, if Tom's goal was to incite a discussion among the readers, he certainly succeeded.
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Post by speedwell on Feb 9, 2020 1:00:50 GMT
No. If you were a mighty wizard, magic would be defined as Will over Reality, because in the Paracelsian/Blakean paradigm of alchemical magic that Tom is using as a background for the comic, magic is Imagination manifested by Will and the manifestations of magic are Thought Forms. (Some of us are keeping up.) Think of Blue, the master illusionist. Another way of thinking of it is that the magicians believe they're making themselves into gods. Zimmy, the atheist, quite rightly knows that you can't get to the supernatural from within the natural; even magicians are subject to their status as beings within reality. And beings that are supernatural, if there is even such a thing, can't interact with the natural without becoming part of the natural world themselves (and, importantly, ceasing to be "outside" the natural world). Coyote left that part out. Sure, the Court can be seen as humanity trying to become gods (wizards, exerting will through imagination over the natural world from the "outside", and failing to see that "outside" is a place they can't get to). That's a sneaky clue to imply that the history of the actual gods is more like the supernatural successfully "descending to earth" as a result of the exertion of imagination. I have never heard of that paradigm It will, I promise, repay study. |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Feb 10, 2020 1:15:32 GMT
Just as a capper here's a link to the define magic thread. Also here's the start of Jones' lecture where she mentions the etherial tenet. |
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