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Post by todd on Apr 16, 2018 12:41:52 GMT
Probably another case of "Why writers need editors and beta-readers - to point things out to them that they're too close to the story to spot"? (Maybe Tom will revise the dialogue on this page for the book version.)
I agree that it's in character for Parley to behave that way - she has a tendency to disrupt events around her, has shown it ever since her introduction.
And this is probably as almost inappropriate timing, focusing on a minor detail in the middle of a crisis - but the symbol in the first panel looks like the one accompanying Brinnie's departure at the start of "Ties", which many readers at the time recognized as linked to Odin. I don't know if Tom's implying here that the summoning power of the beacons is in some way linked to the Norse gods, though.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2018 13:37:49 GMT
It's known as valknut (not a contemporarily-attested term), a variation on the trefoil knot / triqueta, and iirc it was already shown the last time Eglamore appeared via beacon.
It appears on the image-stone of Lärbro (Gotland, 8th century), which may or may not depict the sacrifice of King Vikar (Víkarr) of Hörðaland (a historic region in western Norway, roughly what is now Bergenshus; edit: in fact, revived by some district reform in the 20th century) by his öndvegismaðr (edit: this is "the man that sits opposite you at banquets", a position of honour and trust), advisor and companion in battle, Starkad (Starkaðr), who was brought up by his adoptive father Hrosshársgrani ("Horse-Hair Grani"), who is really Odin (Óðinn) in disguise. This episode is told by Ch. 7 of Gautreks saga (and I think by Saxo as well, I haven't read that one either way), along with the þing during which Thor (Þórr), who envies Starkad because his grandmother chose a "giant" (jötun specifically, not only þurs) over him, and Odin, who favours him for his character, must carefully counter-balance their pronounced boons and curses in the presence of ten other Æsir and Starkad (who all remain silent) -- an interesting vignette in that gods settle their conflict not through proxy wars of a thousand ships, but debate (immediately) and twists of individual human fate (indirectly). Vikar is sacrificed because first, the casting of lots at sea, then Odin speaking to Starkad himself, demanded it; Starkad gets the men to accept his suggestion of a "pretend sacrifice" which seems to be "for show", where he'll poke Vikar with a grass-blade while he has a calf's gut loosely fit around his neck. Suffice to say that Odin gives the implements, and as soon as the sacrifice is pronounced, the mock contraption transforms to kill Vikar (whose last words are oddly prescient, probably because Odin is a mercurial god, and rulers, excellent warriors and poets know this more than anyone else) in about three ways at once. Vikar's men consider Starkad a traitor afterwards -- as by Thor's pronouncement that he shall be hated by all the "common people" (...alþýdu allri). Faint echoes of Antigone.
Old Norse names (mostly) in parentheses, because I'm habitually and irrationally bothered by the question of whether I should decline them in the English or default to the nominative. Both approaches look wrong.
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Post by todd on Apr 16, 2018 14:00:10 GMT
This episode is told by Ch. 7 of Gautreks saga (and I think by Saxo as well, I haven't read that one either way), along with the þing during which Thor (Þórr), who envies Starkad because his grandmother chose a "giant" ( jötun specifically, not only þurs) over him, and Odin, who favours him for his character, must carefully counter-balance their pronounced boons and curses in the presence of ten other Æsir and Starkad (who all remain silent) -- an interesting vignette in that gods settle their conflict not through proxy wars of a thousand ships, but debate (immediately) and twists of individual human fate (indirectly). Vikar is sacrificed because first, the casting of lots at sea, then Odin speaking to Starkad himself, demanded it; Starkad gets the men to accept his suggestion of a "pretend sacrifice" which seems to be "for show", where he'll poke Vikar with a grass-blade while he has a calf's gut loosely fit around his neck. Suffice to say that Odin gives the implements, and as soon as the sacrifice is pronounced, the mock contraption transforms to kill Vikar (whose last words are oddly prescient, probably because Odin is a mercurial god, and rulers, excellent warriors and poets know this more than anyone else) in about three ways at once. Vikar's men consider Starkad a traitor afterwards -- as by Thor's pronouncement that he shall be hated by all the "common people" (... alþýdu allri). Faint echoes of Antigone. I recognized that story - which strikes me as one of the very rare occasions (possibly the only one) where a Norse god other than Odin takes part in a hero-legend (Thor, at the debate). Generally, Odin's the only Norse god who gets involved in the lives of the Norse heroes. That's struck me for some time as a major difference between Greek and Norse mythology. In the Greek myths, the gods regularly meddle or involve themselves in the lives of mortals, particularly the heroes, while in the Norse myths, the Norse gods mainly interact with each other and with other mythical beings (such as the jotnar/frost giants). You alluded to the Trojan War; the Greek gods all take sides in the war (except for Zeus, who's trying to stay out of it - until Achilles' mother Thetis calls in a favor), while the Norse gods don't similarly divide up when two mighty peoples go to war with each other. |
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Post by najmniejszy on Apr 16, 2018 14:37:06 GMT
It's known as valknut (not a contemporarily-attested term), a variation on the trefoil knot / triqueta, and iirc it was already shown the last time Eglamore appeared via beacon. I have checked, it's the exact same symbol as when the beacon was used previously and when Brinnie teleported in the flashback in chapter 37, however in chapter 22 when she teleports it looks a bit different, though still triangular |
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Post by Spoopy on Apr 16, 2018 15:31:21 GMT
Eglamore is trying his hardest not to imply he finds a teenage girl hot. I'm not sure if you're joking or not but Eglamore is definitely not attracted to the daughter of his lost love. Because that would be super yucky and weird. His feelings about her are complicated by the way Surma left him for Carver, but overall I think he sees himself as a father figure to her, at least in the protective sense, since he very nearly was her father. This leads him to perhaps assume a familiarity between them that maybe isn't really there. gunnerkrigg.com/?p=476I don't think Parley knows this backstory though. She just likes making dirty jokes and thinks Eglamore is hot, or at least enjoys pretending she does. gunnerkrigg.com/?p=377 |
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Post by frogspawned on Apr 16, 2018 15:36:48 GMT
Antimore or Eglamony?
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Post by atteSmythe on Apr 16, 2018 17:07:27 GMT
Hilarious - laughed out loud. It works because of the momentary reversal of tone, not in spite of it. Perfect, IMO.
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Post by faiiry on Apr 16, 2018 17:55:57 GMT
[edit] Though you must admit that it would be the penultimate revenge crackpairing on Anthony. [/edit] Someone needs to draw him with his eyes and veins bugging out of his head as Annie tells him, "Father, we're getting married." |
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Post by fia on Apr 16, 2018 18:16:22 GMT
What, I thought Annie's response was an excellent quick clapback! I was amused.
Annie 1 - 0 Parley
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Post by Eve Swann on Apr 16, 2018 18:17:36 GMT
I am confused why it summons both Eglamore and Parley though. Id bet the stick power is not Eglamore-summoning, but Court-Protector-summoning. Maybe one of the tatoos she also got That would make sense. Maybe Parley doesn't have her own yet cuz she's still in training? |
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Post by ctso74 on Apr 16, 2018 18:28:51 GMT
I'm guessing the comedic effect will be less jarring when put in book form. Like in an action movie, when the dramatic music stops for a half second, then starts right back after an absurd pun is delivered.
It is a little outlandish, though. I think all I would muster is, "Coyote's dead! Ysengrin attacking! New powers! Gaahh!"
My favorite absurd pun: *after decapitation* "Looks like you won't be attending that hat convention in July."
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Post by archmagarche on Apr 16, 2018 18:32:04 GMT
I am confused why it summons both Eglamore and Parley though.  Both Eglamore and Parley are far away training. Eglamore was summoned. Eglamore used Parley to teleport. |
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Post by saardvark on Apr 16, 2018 18:41:32 GMT
I am confused why it summons both Eglamore and Parley though. Both Eglamore and Parley are far away training. Eglamore was summoned. Eglamore used Parley to teleport. The Valknut symbol (see Korba, see also Brinnie) shows before they appear, so it is Eglamore's Zamming in use here, not Parley's Bip. I think he brought Parley too (hand on her shoulder) because he didn't want to leave her behind (she wouldn't know where to Bip to), and also perhaps for a chance for "on the job training" (here's your first real emergency!). Though he may not have realized just how dangerous this emergency would be.... |
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fjodorii
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Post by fjodorii on Apr 16, 2018 19:09:09 GMT
So it's ZAM - in, and bip - out?
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Post by somebunny on Apr 16, 2018 21:13:00 GMT
That blue symbol also appeared the last time the beacon was used, so I think it's just being implied that Eglamore is teleporting via means he possibly learned from Brinnie, and that he took Parley along this time (note that Eglamore is touching Parley). I don't think Parley did any teleporting herself this time around, until the last panel. |
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Post by Eversist on Apr 16, 2018 21:29:13 GMT
Eglamore is trying his hardest not to imply he finds a teenage girl hot. I'm not sure if you're joking or not but Eglamore is definitely not attracted to the daughter of his lost love. Because that would be super yucky and weird. His feelings about her are complicated by the way Surma left him for Carver, but overall I think he sees himself as a father figure to her, at least in the protective sense, since he very nearly was her father. This leads him to perhaps assume a familiarity between them that maybe isn't really there. gunnerkrigg.com/?p=476I don't think Parley knows this backstory though. She just likes making dirty jokes and thinks Eglamore is hot, or at least enjoys pretending she does. gunnerkrigg.com/?p=377I share this reading of the relationship and this particular interaction as well. -- I don't know if it's because I follow Tom's Twitter and enjoy his humor in his process videos, but this just doesn't seem outside the realm of his sense of humor, or the comic's (even the odd timing). Maybe that's why it's not really bothering me (though I do see and understand what is bothersome). Or maybe I'm just not taking this all that seriously, and that's all. Like, did people have the same reaction to Jones' off-colored joke at Egger's expense when he was changing Annie's tie? Somehow I doubt it... Different context, I know, but similarly unwarranted. People make inappropriate jokes sometimes IRL (I get that half of the concern is with the out-of-the-blue meta humor and not this.) I kinda want to re-read the comic and see if there were any injections of random humor in super cereal situations. Any excuse to re-read the comic.  Also agree with someone else's observation that this interaction definitely likely reads better as a page in a book. |
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Apr 16, 2018 22:00:17 GMT
So it's ZAM - in, and bip - out? Yep. That's how they roll. [edit] Though you must admit that it would be the penultimate revenge crackpairing on Anthony. [/edit] Someone needs to draw him with his eyes and veins bugging out of his head as Annie tells him, "Father, we're getting married." His face would be a sight worth seeing even if it were years in the post-graduation future and he just found out they were dating. I'm not sure it it would be more mad scientist, evil wizard, or super-villain but that is the face that could launch a thousand-page sequel. |
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Post by todd on Apr 17, 2018 0:28:19 GMT
I have checked, it's the exact same symbol as when the beacon was used previously and when Brinnie teleported in the flashback in chapter 37, however in chapter 22 when she teleports it looks a bit different, though still triangular I looked up the scenes in both "Ties" and "Coyote's Secret" (haven't yet looked at the one where Brinnie teleports out after the date with Tony goes wrong; I'd forgotten about it, and should check on it), and, yes, the version in "Ties" does look different. Wilder, rawer, more jagged. Which suggests a possible link between Brinnie's abilities and the beacons'. I wonder whether, in the course of the deal the Court made with Odin over Brinnie's schooling (and what a meeting that must have been!), Odin or some of the other Aesir helped supply the Court with the methods or materials used to create the beacons. (It might fit the Aesir's warrior tastes, since the beacons are used to summon the warrior defending the Court.) EDIT: Checked the Brinnie scene in the Microsat chapter. When she departs, the symbol is smoother, closer to the way it looks when Eglamore's being summoned. Was the wilder look in "Ties" a sign of lack of training, perhaps? In which case, by the time of the date that didn't work out, Brinnie had, through practice, developed more finesse. (The "lack of training" might be relative, since Brinnie's a Valkyrie who must have been serving Odin and bringing fallen warriors to Valhalla for centuries - unless it stemmed from her adopting a younger form, around 12-13, while at the Court. I'd like to know more about her, though I don't know if we'll see any more flashbacks about her. Maybe a spin-off booklet for her, like "Traveller" for Paz?) |
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Post by arf on Apr 17, 2018 1:50:12 GMT
The added creepiness in panel 3 is that mid-distance Eglamore looks a bit like Tom in his recent bio sketches.
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Post by zbeeblebrox on Apr 17, 2018 3:35:38 GMT
First of all: what is this, weird implication of romance between Annie and Eglamore #6? Is there a name for this ship? I propose: Burnt Eggs And a mandatory sentence for everyone who ships it? To be forced to eat burnt eggs |
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ffkonoko
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Post by ffkonoko on Apr 17, 2018 7:10:39 GMT
Third of all, the interjection of sudden levity into this previously extremely serious chapter is jarring and unwarranted, in my opinion. There's a lot to dislike about this page. Not feeling it. Could not disagree more. It serves a narrative point in showing that they do not have any idea what is going on, remaining in character for what they would say in such a situation without knowing it was serious, takes up a very small fraction of the chapter, but still allows a brief breather in the tone before the undoubtable plunge the next couple pages will bring. |
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fjodorii
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Post by fjodorii on Apr 17, 2018 9:58:23 GMT
So it's ZAM - in, and bip - out? Yep. That's how they roll. Hm. But Brinny ZAM'med out IIRC. Is Smitty perhaps lending a helping -bip- I wonder? |
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Post by pyradonis on Apr 17, 2018 10:33:42 GMT
Maybe Antimony is immature enough that destroying the narrative that George puts forth is, at least briefly, more important than steps that need to be taken to react to the current emergency. Adolescent egocentrism on display in fiction, particularly a character reacting to an imaginary audience, can sometimes look like fourth-wall breaking. Very true that this could be the case - but I don't think Antimony has been shown to be that kind of person. She seems to be reserved and serious at almost all times, and her immaturity seems to be restricted to the recklessness she shows by breaking court rules and overestimating her power in the forest, and an inability to humble herself to ask for help. I could well be wrong, but I don't recall a time where Annie was immature in a stereotypical teenage fashion (romantically, I mean), other than in her dealings with Jack. Even on page 476, which arguably was a more brazen example of sexual tension between Annie and Eglamore (which is honestly the most WTF aspect of the comic for me), Annie doesn't comment on Eggers' behavior. If your argument is correct, Annie's first imperative would be to say something to the effect of, "He was not trying to undress me, he was merely assisting me with my attire" (I'm trying to sound like a stilted kid raised in a hospital as best I can), in order to discredit Jones' comment. In that situation, however, she didn't bother to say anything. In this situation of today's comic, where a huge attack is going on and everyone's lives are in danger, how much more likely is it that she'd take the precious time - however brief - to destroy Parley's narrative? What I'm trying to say is that - yes, Annie is immature. But in a dire situation like this, I don't think she would be immature enough that she would postpone dealing with Coyote's rampage, however briefly, to comment on romantic situations. Of course, it's all up to Tom, whatever he does with these characters is law. I'm just quibbling based on what we have seen so far. This is a really minor issue - this is one page out of 2000, and I don't have to love all of them. I just think it's a little OOC. (By the way, this page having re-introduced the whole plotline of potential romantic sparks between Annie and Eggers is not doing good for me. I've broken out in hives and my teeth are ground to shreds just from the force of trying not to think about it.) I never saw any kind of sexual tension on page 476. Just Jones repeating something she heard elsewhere, making a social blunder because all her social skills are based purely on observation. And twelve(or thirteen?)-year-old Annie taking it at face value (remember she didn't particularly like Eglamore back then, which probably helps). |
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Post by saardvark on Apr 17, 2018 12:16:17 GMT
Yep. That's how they roll. Hm. But Brinny ZAM'med out IIRC. Is Smitty perhaps lending a helping -bip- I wonder? Eglamore's beacon may be quite specific - allowing him to ZAM in to the beacon point (only). He may not have the ability to just ZAM anywhere, in fact, I can't remember Eggers ZAMMing at all except in response to the beacon (somebody correct me if Im wrong!). He power jumps, or hops on the local dragon instead. Brinnie on the other hand can probably ZAM anywhere, being a more magically inclined Valkyrie. So it may be that the beacon allowed Eggs to ZAM in, but to quick zip outside, they need Parley's Bip (which she can do because she has been there before and can visualize outside of Annie's dorm-warehouse). Since Smitts is not there, it would suggest that Parley's Bipping skills have improved. The fact they didn't Bip there in the first place (even though Parley could have, having experience with the location) would suggest that the beacon calls the ZAMster without actually indicating the location... where they are ZAMMing to. Interesting.... blind ZAMMing! |
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Post by zaferion on Apr 17, 2018 15:54:23 GMT
None of yall know the meaning of irony, huh
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Post by warrl on Apr 17, 2018 18:21:10 GMT
Well, there apparently was a delay between Annie breaking the signal and James&George arriving...
"Oh shit, I'm asking a guy to appear in my room. And George will be with him."
"There's no obvious emergency here."
"George is gonna make some smartass comment. I gotta think of a reply... quick."
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Post by todd on Apr 18, 2018 0:17:42 GMT
I think that Tom wanted to avoid having Annie simply give a repeat of what we'd already seen in the pages (Ysengrin receives Coyote's powers, kills and eats him, decides to attack the Court), to make it more lively and colorful than a mere recap. (I suspect that's why he also didn't have Annie just tell Reynardine on the previous page what was going on - again, that would just be repeating what the audience already knows, with the danger of losing its interest. Presumably Annie will be filling Reynardine, Eglamore, and Parley in off-panel.) So most likely, he decided to put some humor on this page instead - and the setting (combined with Parley's characterization, and a call-back to Chapter 23) suggested what we got. Not the best solution, since jokes about relationships between minors and adults are in bad taste, but Tom might have not given thought to that while writing and drawing this page. So it was a misjudgement - but an understandable misjudgement, when you think about it.
The caption in "The Coward Heart" about Annie filling Parley and Smith in on Jeanne as thirty chapters' worth of exposition was a much better solution for that problem.
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Post by The Anarch on Apr 18, 2018 11:58:46 GMT
:I
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Post by merry76 on Apr 18, 2018 19:26:41 GMT
Eglamore is trying his hardest not to imply he finds a teenage girl hot. I'm not sure if you're joking or not but Eglamore is definitely not attracted to the daughter of his lost love. Because that would be super yucky and weird. His feelings about her are complicated by the way Surma left him for Carver, but overall I think he sees himself as a father figure to her, at least in the protective sense, since he very nearly was her father. This leads him to perhaps assume a familiarity between them that maybe isn't really there. gunnerkrigg.com/?p=476I don't think Parley knows this backstory though. She just likes making dirty jokes and thinks Eglamore is hot, or at least enjoys pretending she does. gunnerkrigg.com/?p=377There is a reason why "finding hot" and "is attracted to" exist in seperate. They do not mean the same. I can find a co worker hot, without being attracted to her. Or someone I meet on the street. Or an actress. But seriously, that face is trying his hardest to deny anything, anything at all. Even things he is legally allowed (and logically compelled) to. Wich makes it fun. And now I explained the joke. Damn. |
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Post by blazingstar on Apr 18, 2018 20:55:11 GMT
Eggers doesn't look like he has the magic sword on him does he? You mean the Coyote tooth-blade? Chances are he doesn't even know about it. His regular sword probably is magical, though. |
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