Wild Speculation

[penguinfactory]

Wild prediction time, following from today's comic: Annie is descended from the humans who used to live in the forest on her mother's side, hence the very obvious focus on her reflection. Annie's dad is either descended from the original human founders of Gunnerkrigg Court, is a Gillitie "traitor" who turned human, or is descended from one, thus explaining his lack of emotions.

I'll go one step further: Being descended from either the Gillitie humans or the original inhabitants of the court is the unstated entry requirement for Queslett house, thus explaining the seeming prevelance of "etheric" abilities , from the Gillitie side, and scientific prowess (Jack/Kat), along with the high number of children of staff or former staff in Annie's class- a connection to the Court tends to run in the family, all the way back to when it was founded.

Prediction the third: at some point, when the Gillitie vs Gunnerkrigg tensions hit the fan like we all know they're going to, this will be a dividing factor among Court residents. Annie, being descended from both sides, will have to serve as a peacemaker.

Man, I love a story that keeps me guessing.

[ragashingo]

Just some stuff:

1. The Court started with Etheric Science (the big glowy meeting in the forest), and we know that some of its founders were quite good at using etheric sciences. Deigo and his S-Class robots for instance. It's interesting how the Court shifted away from Etheric technology so quickly. It seems they wanted to use pure technological science to understand everything which amusingly caused them to leave some of their more impressive accomplishments behind.

2. Even though the Court frowns on Etheric stuff at present they sure are dependent on it. The robots are all at least partially Etheric, as is the computer system that can contain Rey and make forcefields.

3. The Court and the Forest apparently got unfriendly with each other and were perhaps even at war when Coyote came. Coyote split the two sides apart but even that wasn't enough to end hostilities. We've seen an example of the forest sending Dogwood scouts to the court for instance.

4. Coyote says the Court did something to the river so nothing could cross it. Obviously the Court did this to stop the incursions. Perhaps they did it to bring about peace? I don't think the river stops ANYTHING from crossing to the Court, just things that have to cross the river by ground. Alistar and his parents (you know, the ones that turned into birds) flew from the Court to the Woods after all, and the fairies can cross over too. So really I think the Court's tinkering with the river was only meant stop land based things (like Dogwoods and worse) mainly because the Forest doesn't have an air force of any real value.

5. Whatever was done to the river isn't dangerous to the Court's side even though it keeps the Forest out. More interestingly is that it might not even be Anti-Etheric. Annie fell in and not only was she fine, she was seeing spirit guides, being spiritually hurt by ghosts, and using blinker stones not long after she got back on shore.

6. The bridge over the river was probably built under the terms that neither side would use it to cross into the other, except diplomats it seems. Obviously the Court didn't trust the Forest all that much though what with all the lights. When Annie sent the robot over she accidently violated the truce. The Forest responded with by sending the robot back with one (or more just unseen) shadowmen and a Forest Arm of Death. I think the truce was reinstated once everyone learned what happened.

[fuzzyone]

I'm stumbling upon a new theory... a Theory that's taking shape the further we go.

My Theory: Jeanne was a Medium, and mediated the union of the refugees and the Gillitie wood creatures. Also, Jeanne is the Seed Bismuth.

Why I think this: First... She was unknown to the Guides. Ketrak shows up the instant an insect dies. As far as we know, The same can be said of other guides and their respective charges. We don't know how long Annie was in the Ravine before Muut showed up. But somehow, Jeanne stayed down in the ravine long enough to lose a great deal of her identity. Why could the guides she belonged to not reach her? The last time we saw a guide dispute was someone who belonged to two guides, and needed to be shown the way, but they knew Martin. He just wouldn't let them approach him.

I theorize that Jeanne was NOT among the human refugees that would eventually make up the court. Perhaps she LIVED in Gillitie Wood, helping the creatures there with their disputes. Her abilities as a Medium would not make her particularly well suited for life in the world at large, so she came to a place that would be more accepting of her.

Next, Is the fact that she was present for the founding of the Court, but not shown amongst the founders. In fact, there is no mention of her. Almost like she was expunged from the event. The Court Founders knew who they all were... but she wasn't shown as among them. This is why I think she was there before they arrived. Someone had to be there before the refugees came, to help smooth things over, and secure a place for the humans. How else would the Etheric beings of the forest trust the humans, unless there was someone speaking on their behalf? The Seed Bismuth is considered Integral to the founding of the court... but we're unclear on what it was. Diego was smitten with her enough to make his shrine. The Shrine that dates back to the founding of the Court, since it was made by Diego. Coyote, when discussing the rift in the court, depicted the scene of the founding, and called it man trying to tame the beasts of the Wood. So even though they, according to Reynardine, weren't there yet, they had some knowledge of the event. I don't imagine they were too long in coming.

There's also the fact that Jeanne was a Swordswoman, and Parley, who is in Training to be a Medium, is engaging in sword training. And, according to Reynardine, Jeanne was uncomfortable in her finery... Someone who lived among the creatures of the Wood would have no need for such a fancy, elegant dress. As to why she posed for such a portrait, that remains a mystery.

There's also one other detail: We don't know that ALL mediums had dealings with the Psychopomps. It may be that Jeanne never had dealings with them, hence, why they don't know her. We also don't know WHY none of them could come for Surma. I've theorized in the past that it was due to her position as a medium, and the neutrality that such a position required.

I'm offering no speculation on Jeanne's death, as there's far too little information to go on. But I think her ROLE is becoming clearer to me.

[fjodor]

One big Holiday wildspec coming up:

Robot had this strange extra chip attached to his CPU when he came back from the Forest. We now know that the Tic Tocs predated the Court, and both the Forest and the Court people do not know where they come from. Reynardine said that they (Coyote, Ysengrin and he) came to the forest after the seed Bismuth had been planted, so there must have been a Big Force at work already.

I therefore speculate that the founder of the Court was the Very Nice Man mentioned by Robot. The chip is a type of technology after all. The Very Nice Man is probably also the creator of the Tic Tocs (I think this was speculated before but it make a lot of sense).

The Tic Tocs look like the perfect marriage between nature and technology, which would be in line with the first -happy- years of the court and the forest. Unlike the Court robots, the Tic Tocs are unable to maintain themselves, so it is fair to assume the Very Nice Man is still at work. Gamma (I think it was her - too lazy to look up all the pages) said that the Tic Tocs are the Thousand Eyes, which I feel sounds like a surveillance system. Odin (the old man) used two crows as his spies to keep him informed about what happens in the world.

Robot is slowly turning more and more human - putting on clothes is only the fist step and I have no doubt that Kat will succeed in giving him a very realistic body. We have seen Fairies turning into humans and humans into birds.

Is there a point? Well maybe. I am starting to think that the court was designed/created by the same etheric source that Anja used for her computer, and Diego as the power source for his Robots. And by the size of the Court, which Toms stated is larger than the Forest, it seems almost impossible that this was built by the small number of people living at the Court.

Therefore I believe the Court is the result of a technology virus, that transforms nature into structures. The many references to Alchemy would be in line with this; Alchemists were in search of the Philosopher's Stone, which had the ability to turn lead into gold. The symbols for gold and lead are visible in various places.

The seed Bismuth must be the actual Philosopher's Stone, and its effect was increased by the etheric power source, leading to the virus-like behavior. The Power Station we saw is the Court's effort to reproduce the same power. Coyote stopped the virus from spreading by creating the big ravine. This was seen as a hostile act by the people of the Court (who benefited greatly from the virus), and in turn they took defensive measures to prevent the Forest from reclaiming the space that had been lost because of the virus.

A virus needs something to feed on, and now that the Court grounds appear to be completely void of life (e.g. look at the dead twigs in the chapter where Zimmy 'showers' in the rain), it slowly starts to crumble and decay. So in order to survive, the Court would have to expand again at the cost of the Forest. After a complete assimilation of all Nature, Coyote would seize to exist (when Annie visited him, he made it clear that he IS the forest), and the humans will have become God themselves. Therefore the Forest folk will have to defend themselves in order to ensure their existence. Creature like Ysengrin would like to reclaim all that was lost. That as his reason for dropping the seeds in the court hall.

Means we have one big end fight coming up, like a Ragnarokr/Armageddon event. That is when we will see Brinnie again too, together with Odin.

So, all mysteries solved. Thanks for reading... :-)

[judgedeadd]

Robot had this strange extra chip attached to his CPU when he came back from the Forest. We now know that the Tic Tocs predated the Court, and both the Forest and the Court people do not know where they come from. Reynardine said that they (Coyote, Ysengrin and he) came to the forest after the seed Bismuth had been planted, so there must have been a Big Force at work already.

I therefore speculate that the founder of the Court was the Very Nice Man mentioned by Robot. The chip is a type of technology after all. The Very Nice Man is probably also the creator of the Tic Tocs (I think this was speculated before but it make a lot of sense).

The Very Nice Man is Ysengrim. As for the strange extra chip, the generally held assumption is that it was always there and that it's the "special" part that makes Court robots sentient.

[todd]

A thought about the Founders of Gunnerkrigg Court. We've assumed that they were refugees fleeing a war - presumably as in the frightened villagers who've discovered that their village lies between two armies about to battle each other, and struggling to get out of the way of both sides. But what if they weren't so innocent? What if they had been part of a failed rebellion - or a deposed tyranny - and were fleeing to escape punishment by the victorious side? That would explain why they're still in hiding in the Court (if they were just refugees, it's probably safe for them to emerge by now, unless the Britain of this universe is still locked in a civil war) - and we've seen that the Founders were unscrupulous enough (with one exception) to murder Jeanne.

(On the other hand, the Court's genuinely interested in scientific inquiry, which makes it unlikely that they're "take-over-the-world"-type mad scientists; those kinds of guys aren't really interested in science, only in exploiting it for their ends. A true scientist - like Kat - is interested in the pursuit of science and discovery for its own sake.)

[todd]

Not exactly a *wild* speculation, but does anybody besides me have the uneasy feeling that the Founders arranged a nasty accident for the guy who walked out of the meeting, refusing to have any part in the plan to sacrifice Jeanne? They obviously wouldn't want him to talk.

[Mr Pitchfork]

I get the feeling that he was an important guy, not just some guy.

Whether this has anything to do with whether or not he would be assassinated by the founders, I don't know.

[todd]

When the Founders removed all records of Jeanne after murdering her, they didn't just rewrite the history books. They used some etheric procedure to erase her from everyone's memories, except their own, and those of the robots. The procedure was powerful enough to affect even the Guides, which is why they don't know anything about Jeanne other than her being a lost soul beyond their help, and why Muut considers it so important that Annie had learned her name.

[warrl]

The manner in which the founders killed Jeanne (not just by an arrow, something Diego did with that specific arrow) tied her spirit to the physical world so her death did not register with the psychopomps. Even when they were down in the chasm for some other reason, she was unavailable to them and therefore not worth interrupting their busy day - until they realized she had been there a very long time indeed. By then, she had forgotten her name and everyone in the Court who knew her was already dead.

I don't know why it hasn't occurred to the psychopomps to ask Reynard, Coyote, or Ysengrim about her.

Or Annie, for that matter. Reynardine was somewhat evasive about Jeanne and Diego, but Annie never (on screen anyway) directly asked him if HE knew Jeanne. In fact, one of Annie's most common oversights is the matter of just how old Reynardine is and how much of the Court's history he might know from either seeing it himself or talking with people who saw it happen.

(I can more readily forgive her not questioning Coyote - he tends to railroad the conversation. And she hasn't had many opportunities to converse with Ysengrim when not aboard Coyote's train of thought.)

Much later in the comic, Annie will etherically go down into the chasm, and Jeanne will attack her again. Annie will draw Coyote's Tooth and defeat Jeanne, then pull out (or otherwise destroy) the arrow and escort Jeanne to her proper place.

[todd]

An odd thought about who might be really running the Court. We know that Diego's dead (and I think it would weaken the final scene in the Chapter Twenty-five flashback if he was still alive), but do we know for certain that the other Founders, such as Sir Young or Steadman, have also passed on?

What if they faked their deaths (Diego, maybe burdened by his guilt, turned down the opportunity in this hypothesis) and found some etheric means of continuing on in secret - but having to hide themselves from the Court so that everyone would believe them dead, secretly communicating their wishes to the administration? (Maybe the old "consciousness uploaded in a computer" concept.) They have the Headmaster serve as the head of state to conceal their survival, but continue directing everything that goes on at the Court.

[imaginaryfriend]

I hesitate to mention this because the blindfolded sun might mean any of several applicable things but it could represent a solar eclipse. If so the clothing the Court founders were wearing may suggest a date of May 3, 1715. Notice any familiar place names in that animation?

On the other hand, the blindfolded sun might also be a symbol of exile, or of self-limited views and/or a denial of truth (perhaps about the founders, perhaps someway relating to the Forest's real nature being concealed from normal humans without), or possibly something else entirely.

[imaginaryfriend]

Now that we know how things went down, the significance of that odd tip on Diego's pimped-out arrow must be that it's a twin point. Green had Jeanne's heart figuratively. When his heart was pierced by the weapon it simultaneously hit Jeanne's heart also by virtue of Diego's genius with etheric technology. That's why the Court founders could safely write Jeanne off the instant that Green had been shot (along with the fact that she was stranded at the bottom of a deep canyon with no food, shelter, or rescue). That's how the green light ensnared Jeanne and left her an empty shell.

...so in a weird way both of my wildspecs about the arrow were correct. Green was indeed physically struck by the arrow and died in the Annan Waters, and Jeanne was targeted etherically/astrally after all. Me am even smarter than us ever suspected.

[todd]

Sir Young, Diego, Steadman, and the other Founders led a rebellion to overthrow whoever was ruling Britain at the time and seize power for themselves, and lost; their flight to Gillitie Wood was to escape being arrested and sentenced for high treason rather than simple refugees fleeing a war. The robot horse's recitation of the "War in Heaven" scene from "Paradise Lost" in Chapter Fifteen is a hint of this, with the Founders' flight to Gillitie being an analogue to Satan and his followers' expulsion from Heaven after their rebellion. (If this hint seems perhaps too subtle, note that in Chapter Sixteen, Annie and the Guides are walking past a fire extinguisher when Moddey Dhoo talks about the accident that claimed the lives of Martin and his family - and Tom confirmed that that was deliberate.)

(This raises the question of why the Founders would have the robot horse recite those lines - but many people have misinterpreted Milton's Satan as being the hero of the poem, and perhaps Sir Young and his colleagues made that mistake as well and identified with him thereby.)

[todd]

It's often been commented that the adults at the Court (the Donlans, Eglamore, Jones, etc.) are highly intelligent and competent. But much of the way that the Court's run (a school at the edge of a forest filled with hostile forest-folk, potentially dangerous dorms, lax internal security systems) seems anything but intelligent and competent. Unless - what if the adults we've seen (even the Headmaster himself) aren't in charge? What if the people who *are* in charge are running things in secret?

The real Court administrators - the people at the very top - are the Founders, who have kept themselves alive for centuries through a mixture of etheric skill and technology (except for Diego, who declined because of his guilty conscience over Jeanne's death - not strong enough to admit his responsibility over it, but strong enough to feel troubled and tormented on his deathbed). But the process of extended life has had unpleasant side effects; not only have they suffered enough physical degeneration that they can't show themselves in public (thus, using the Headmaster as a front man), but their decisions have become increasingly erratic and deranged. Yet they've preserved enough of their power that the teachers, though aware of the flaws in many of their plans, cannot defy them. (Plus, the Founders decree that the teachers have to send their own children to school at the Court - thereby providing themselves with hostages to ensure the teachers' obedience.)

[hal9000]

Mar 28, 2011 11:20:48 GMT todd said:

It's often been commented that the adults at the Court (the Donlans, Eglamore, Jones, etc.) are highly intelligent and competent. But much of the way that the Court's run (a school at the edge of a forest filled with hostile forest-folk, potentially dangerous dorms, lax internal security systems) seems anything but intelligent and competent. Unless - what if the adults we've seen (even the Headmaster himself) aren't in charge? What if the people who *are* in charge are running things in secret?

The real Court administrators - the people at the very top - are the Founders, who have kept themselves alive for centuries through a mixture of etheric skill and technology (except for Diego, who declined because of his guilty conscience over Jeanne's death - not strong enough to admit his responsibility over it, but strong enough to feel troubled and tormented on his deathbed). But the process of extended life has had unpleasant side effects; not only have they suffered enough physical degeneration that they can't show themselves in public (thus, using the Headmaster as a front man), but their decisions have become increasingly erratic and deranged. Yet they've preserved enough of their power that the teachers, though aware of the flaws in many of their plans, cannot defy them. (Plus, the Founders decree that the teachers have to send their own children to school at the Court - thereby providing themselves with hostages to ensure the teachers' obedience.)

I think that's plausible except for the last part. For instance, the Donlans are free to travel the world every year for summer vacation (and could escape at that time), and Annie was born outside of the court with parents who had long-since abandoned it.

No, I think the simpler explanation is a combination of institutional inertia and the banality of evil.

[Jelly Jellybean]

Aug 2, 2016 1:48:56 GMT Storel said:

Jul 31, 2016 23:37:48 GMT Daedalus said:

I'm still curious about the significance of the Artilleryman. He's clearly going to be important, since they've been blocked from seeing his record at the RotD, and the whole comic is (indirectly) named after him. But we know nothing about his role or abilities.

I'm wondering if he's the one who somehow created the Tic-Tocs, since he parted ways with the Court and nobody in the Court seems to know where they came from.

I am putting this reply here in the wild speculation thread because I am pulling it further from the original page thread.

IIRC, the Artilleryman found Gunnerkrigg / Gunner's Crag, which I think means he found out how to get to the Forest, led the rest of the founders to the Forest, and may have been instrumental in making the deal with the Forest to form the Court.  The very first Court Medium.

My current speculation is that the Artilleryman will be the way Annie learns more about the founding of the Court, to include why the Forest agreed to make a deal with humans and why the deal didn't work out.

[Daedalus]

Aug 2, 2016 11:43:01 GMT Jelly Jellybean said:

Aug 2, 2016 1:48:56 GMT Storel said:

I'm wondering if he's the one who somehow created the Tic-Tocs, since he parted ways with the Court and nobody in the Court seems to know where they came from.

I am putting this reply here in the wild speculation thread because I am pulling it further from the original page thread.

IIRC, the Artilleryman found Gunnerkrigg / Gunner's Crag, which I think means he found out how to get to the Forest, led the rest of the founders to the Forest, and may have been instrumental in making the deal with the Forest to form the Court.  The very first Court Medium.

My current speculation is that the Artilleryman will be the way Annie learns more about the founding of the Court, to include why the Forest agreed to make a deal with humans and why the deal didn't work out.

I support this theory, especially because he refused to be a part of the sacrifice of Jeanne. I always assumed it was because he didn't want to partake in a monstrous sacrifice of an innocent woman, but what if it was also because he didn't want to exacerbate the divisions between Court and Forest?