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Post by wynne on Feb 8, 2010 20:21:38 GMT
I love the way this page is colored. It looks like color pencil.
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Post by seitosilver on Feb 8, 2010 20:27:15 GMT
I really love the etheric pages, they're so well done that I find myself basking in their glow. When I went back to the last page done in the normal style it felt really cold and shocking and I wanted to go back to the nice and hazy warmth of the flowing organic lines and pastel coloring.
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Post by Mishmash on Feb 8, 2010 21:00:24 GMT
I think you have really hit on something there, seitosilver. That is exactly how Coyote seems to want Annie to view the Court (cold and shocking) compared to the forest.
Tom is such a good artist!
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raef
New Member
Posts: 3
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Post by raef on Feb 9, 2010 1:07:50 GMT
Holy gods Coyote is… wow. I think I've had a trip like this. (Aside: part of what Coyote might be up to with Ysengrin is demonstrating the limited view afforded by looking at material plane alone. Sure, Ysengrin shakes like an old man, but he's also a god, and so perhaps Coyote's gift really is perfect, and immeasurable in its wonder. Or, at least, it's quite a bit nicer than it first seems.) Perhaps, but you only see his head in the etheric view. The rest of him was not shown and could be equally crippled. That said, Ysengrin appears to be fairly concerned with his power in the physical realm. A god who can't control anything is still powerless.
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optern
Junior Member
Posts: 84
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Post by optern on Feb 9, 2010 2:48:39 GMT
I think it was clarified that Ysengrin is not a god, he is a folklore character, which would be better characterized as a demigod or something. Also, it was a mention "A god came" bla bla in the one where Coyote first shows up. Not "two gods."
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Post by cannedbreadmaker on Feb 9, 2010 3:56:59 GMT
Would there be an offer to Annie to pass to the Forest side? Would she have to take the test, and what kind of body would she get? I imagine that if this happened Antimony would remain the same.
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Post by Mylian on Feb 9, 2010 4:29:00 GMT
I think Annie, and we, would do well to remember the moment earlier in this chapter when Coyote did an imitation of a snake. All he needs is an apple and his costume would be complete.
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Post by warrl on Feb 9, 2010 5:01:45 GMT
I think it was clarified that Ysengrin is not a god, he is a folklore character, which would be better characterized as a demigod or something. Also, it was a mention "A god came" bla bla in the one where Coyote first shows up. Not "two gods." It wouldn't have been two gods. It would have been one or three. Reynard is the same category of being as Ysengrin; they were together (and usually rivals or enemies) long before Coyote would have heard of them.
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emrie
New Member
Posts: 5
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Post by emrie on Feb 9, 2010 6:41:48 GMT
Even if Coyote means the absolute best by Annie, she should watch out. The gifts he gave Reynard and Ysengrin had horrible drawbacks to them, though maybe in Coyote's mind, they were wonderful ideas.
And even more, if Gillitie Forest is all colourful and the Court is all drab and grey, whose fault is that? It was Coyote who divided them. He probably had his reasons, he may have had provocation from the early Court founders, but he's the one who made the final division. And he continues to want to drain the Court of anything etheric, anything that might balance out the grim mechanical tendencies of the Court.
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Post by strangethoughts on Feb 9, 2010 7:17:43 GMT
And he continues to want to drain the Court of anything etheric, anything that might balance out the grim mechanical tendencies of the Court. I need a source on that one cause Ive never seen any intention by Coyote to remove the etheric from the court. In fact that's quite contrary to coyote's nature, yes he can be a jerk (he IS a god) but for the most part he plays a big role as a friend to man and is a rather benificent spirit. He might not have stolen the sun for us like raven did but raven is an overachiever.
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Post by chiparoo on Feb 9, 2010 19:36:16 GMT
Coyote is a friend to no one. Calling him beneficent implies that he does /anything/ to help others. I'm finding it much more likely that everything coyote does is for his own pleasure. :3
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Post by warrl on Feb 9, 2010 20:04:47 GMT
Coyote is a friend to no one. Calling him beneficent implies that he does /anything/ to help others. I'm finding it much more likely that everything coyote does is for his own pleasure. :3 Coyote is a benevolent deity with a huge ego (even for a deity), a twisted sense of humor, and a short attention span. He won't intentionally do harm except in order to prevent even greater harm. However he will intentionally challenge and embarrass. In the unlikely event that he actually does harm, he will seek to make amends. (That's usually when the REAL trouble starts.)
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Chrome
Full Member
The Shiny One
Posts: 232
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Post by Chrome on Feb 9, 2010 21:44:03 GMT
I realized something - it's not just the dynamic between Diego/Jeanne, or George/Smitty that we have to worry about....but what of her own mother and father? She knows Eglamore had a thing for Surma. And her father's basically ditched her - a man who's supposed to love her.
This has to impact how she saw the Diego/Jeanne situation, or even Parley/Smitty.
I noticed we're also flying without one crucial piece of information here. How was the actual relationship between Surma and Anthony? How did those two even fall in love? What interaction between them did Annie see? She had a loving mother who really helped her become her own self. But her father? We know practically nothing.
And here's the rub: Annie has her memories, has her experiences, and they would shape what she thinks of the world. Her reaction about how Anthony is gone is telling: "He wants nothing to do with me."
I think somewhere in the back of her mind, she's always wanted to see a "good" love relationship, to believe that there is such a beautiful thing, because she never had it. She was sheltered, raised in a hospital, surrounded by spirits - and this very human of emotions probably wasn't painted in the best light. Maybe the dying people at the hospital gave her some tales of it, and maybe...just maybe...she's always wanted to see it for herself, but the world keeps letting her down.
As for Parley/Smitty - two people who she knows quite well are attracted to each other, but can't really bring themselves to admit it, let alone act on it outside of their usual bully-submissive dynamic - no wonder. She wonders why they go around these games if there's something that geniune underneath it. It must seem like a lot of nonsense to an outsider like her. Why don't they just come out and admit it, and act on it?
Then you get Diego/Jeanne. Every sign beforehand more or less pointed to Diego loving Jeanne deeply and truly, that he was a good guy, and something happened to Jeanne that tormented his poor heart. Then we get the recording that reveals he's a snake, probably a stalker, most definitely jealous, and willing to kill this woman he has feelings for.
Now, take this girl who may not have seen the healthiest relation between Anthony and Surma, who wants to see something as true as her friendship as Kat existing, who perhaps wanted to understand love better - and dump all this crap on her.
It's almost a case of Breaking the Cutie from TVTropes. Almost.
Oh, and she goes to school at the place whose founders basically killed Jeanne, and covered it up. All that cool rationalism the Court prides itself on must've been like a pit of industrial-strength acid in her stomach after that.
No wonder the poor girl has to go to the Forest to collect her thoughts!
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Post by isabellemoerman on Feb 9, 2010 22:35:29 GMT
This page is beautiful.
Annie's face is truly heartbreaking in the bottom right corner. She looks so vulnerable without her make-up.
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Chrome
Full Member
The Shiny One
Posts: 232
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Post by Chrome on Feb 10, 2010 3:18:05 GMT
Agreed there, she's always so strong. Now she's pretty shaken up, and I think this is the first time we really see that she's been that deeply affected by what happened to Jeanne.
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Magpie
New Member
One for sorrow.
Posts: 31
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Post by Magpie on Feb 10, 2010 9:08:35 GMT
..And he continues to want to drain the Court of anything etheric, anything that might balance out the grim mechanical tendencies of the Court. I hardly think that is just Coyote's doing, really. Remember how the Court doesn't really take etheric research and the Forest creatures very seriously, as said by both Anja and Jones. As far as I can tell, both sides are equally at fault, but we'll see how it plays out.
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Post by Per on Feb 10, 2010 17:32:50 GMT
It's almost a case of Breaking the Cutie from TVTropes. Things like this makes it easy to see why TV Tropes references grate on people. First you put up this analysis that is actually relevant and useful because you're looking at the work in question. Then you sum it up by saying the whole deal almost amounts to an entry on a site where people collect superficially similar story examples and gratuitously stick collective labels on them. I know you didn't mean it like that, but it doesn't look very generous.
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