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Post by sostorm on Jan 18, 2010 15:49:41 GMT
Not only does his muscles seem withered, he also looks starved. But if he's going to eat the fish, why can't he do it in the suit. Weird.
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Post by Ulysses on Jan 18, 2010 16:06:10 GMT
Ysengrin's not doing too well.
I'd say this is down to over-dependence on the suit. I wonder how often he actually leaves the suit to feed. Probably not very often - he likely draws some kind of sustenance from the tree, but not in any kind of meaningful way, it just keeps him going.
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mariposa
Full Member
Hi, I'm Elise!
Posts: 149
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Post by mariposa on Jan 18, 2010 17:23:58 GMT
An interesting contrast to the majesty he displays on the page before. But still really cool looking
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canus
New Member
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Post by canus on Jan 18, 2010 18:18:19 GMT
Maybe he was given the suit out of necessity after a crippling injury.
Say, from an arrow. *cough*
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lkm
New Member
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Post by lkm on Jan 18, 2010 18:59:09 GMT
Maybe he was given the suit out of necessity after a crippling injury. Say, from an arrow. *cough* If you're referencing that perhaps Steadman the archer did something to him, I think the tree body is much more recent than that ( the headmaster recognizes Ysengrin, but this appears to be the first time he's seen him with the new augmentation). I'm inclined to think it's more like a side-effect; Coyote's gifts don't seem to graft well (I mean, do we know if Reynardine even has a corporeal form of his own anymore? Did he leave it under a rock?). It's also possible that going Ferngully drowns out any feelings of hunger or discomfort he may have, which'd mean he's probably eating only when he remembers to. What I'd like to know is that what prompted Ysengrin to take Coyote's gift relatively recently (I assume in the last generation or so). The Court had cut off contact long enough ago that they didn't know Surma was dead and gone, with Annie's fall off the bridge being what broke the silence. If nothing happened between them for, say, a decade, why the hell did Ysengrin feel the need for an upgrade?
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Post by sandjosieph on Jan 18, 2010 19:09:43 GMT
No wonder the guy is so shakey all the timey: He's starved!
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Post by penguinfactory on Jan 18, 2010 19:15:14 GMT
Yikes. I'm actually starting to feel sorry for Ysengrin- who'd have thought it?
I'm guessing the tree suit thing is draining energy from his body to animate itself. I wonder if Annie can find a way to heal him? If she does, he coould be a powerful ally.
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Post by romangoro on Jan 18, 2010 20:05:15 GMT
Yikes. I'm actually starting to feel sorry for Ysengrin- who'd have thought it? Taking a broader and "metaer" look at the story, Tom first presented and rounded the main characters in the first chapters, then started to add the secondary ones. Many of them where rather one dimensional, but slowly he is adding layers to this characters and our perception of them changes with every page. Ysengrin was rather one sided character (he who hates humans and nothing more) and now we are beginning to see some other facets of him and suddenly (i.e., in a single page) everybody pities him. I can't resist doing a list of characters who still remain one sided: First and foremost: Coyote. He's only "The trickster" by now but I bet there is a lot more to him. Second (to come to my mind): Jones Third: Antony Carver Fourth: Eglamore, Anja, Donald and the other adults in the school. There is still something strange about Rey. And so on. ¡Cant wait to see more!
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Post by wanderer on Jan 18, 2010 20:21:30 GMT
...You know, he doesn't look so good.
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Deca
New Member
Quest Complete!
Posts: 32
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Post by Deca on Jan 18, 2010 22:23:30 GMT
He has other powers besides talking. He's got mad gardening skillz. I meant powers of his own before Coyote gave him those. XD Well, I would say that before that he was just another ordinary talking wolf. Although, he probably is immortal since there has been tales told of him and Renard for centuries.
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Post by strangethoughts on Jan 18, 2010 22:26:46 GMT
I wouldn't call Coyote a one dimensional character by any stretch of the imagination. That being a trickster is a dominant part of his personality there is no doubt but he has shown so many more characteristics. He has shown quite a bit of regret over certain actions and acknowledges that his gifts are imperfect. A god, especially a trickster, that admits anything he does is anything but perfect and planned is deep.
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raef
New Member
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Post by raef on Jan 19, 2010 0:13:15 GMT
I have to wonder if Ysengrin was immortal and gave up the immortality of his wolf body for the power of the tree form?
It would be a good trick, along the line of Coyote's other 'gifts'. He asks for power and receives it, but through it is bound to, essentially, servitude protecting the forest. Seeing the humans as a direct threat to the trees and thus his power (or perhaps even his life) might explain his otherwise irrational anger toward the Court.
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Post by asianborat on Jan 19, 2010 0:54:19 GMT
It's moments like these that remind me of how awesome this webcomic is.
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Post by johnwwells on Jan 19, 2010 14:25:22 GMT
Say, there're an awful lot of constellations up there - especially that prominent one in the lower left panel that looks a little dipper-ish. Does anyone recognize any of them? I'm no good with these.
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Post by Yin on Jan 19, 2010 14:39:05 GMT
Now that thou mentionst it, I recognise Orion's belt in the same panel (which is the only constellation I can really pick out, I must admit).
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Post by johnwwells on Jan 19, 2010 22:12:00 GMT
Orion the Hunter! Definitely appropriate. I thought Tom might do something like that.
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orin
New Member
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Post by orin on Jan 19, 2010 22:46:13 GMT
forgive me for interjecting, but he might simply be very, very old. the markings on his head are signs of him being an elderly wolf, after all. it's possible that he stays in his protective tree body because there's little he can do on his own, and it ends up rubbing his fur off as a result.
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coyotagoat
Junior Member
Helluva poker face.
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Post by coyotagoat on Jan 20, 2010 0:29:51 GMT
Well, there's no doubting his age; I think what people were referencing was that the rest of his wolf body is alot less healthy than, as we can see, his exposed head. It's a big contrast, and normal elderly wolves don't look like that. I personally think that it's just sort of the decay and malnourishment from being inside a FREAKING TREE for so long. Not exactly a bed-and-breakfast in there, guys .
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Post by strangethoughts on Jan 20, 2010 0:31:17 GMT
Hmm there's a good question. How old are Ysengrin and Reynardine? Probably younger then coyote if he did not know them from the beggining times, which really just narrows it down from millions-100's of thousands of years to as many as tens of thousands to only a few centuries.
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Post by warrl on Jan 20, 2010 0:36:11 GMT
The stars are not consistent between the panels. This is most obvious in the last two panels: #5 shows the Little Dipper, #6 Cassiopeia. The only way they could both occupy that position relative to the Ysengrim Tree is if the process of setting him down took several millennia.
The background trees also ought to be consistent at least once the process of separating Ysengrim from his Tree begins, but they are really obviously different in panel 4 as compared to 3, 5, and 6.
My conclusion: the backgrounds are just backgrounds. The only meaning they carry is "this is happening in a forest, at night".
And will somebody please start feeding that pup regularly!
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Post by Ulysses on Jan 20, 2010 0:45:46 GMT
Wiki seems to think Reynard and Ysengrin developed together and were well known by about 1150 by which point Nivardus had written his poem Ysengrimus. I'd say they're at least 1000 years old.
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Post by fuzzysocks on Jan 20, 2010 4:19:47 GMT
Not only does his muscles seem withered, he also looks starved. But if he's going to eat the fish, why can't he do it in the suit. Weird. Maybe he just doesn't want to?
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Post by mudmaniac on Jan 20, 2010 6:01:16 GMT
the previous page is like watching an F-22 jet fighter transform into a robot, execute a perfect somersault and land on its feet crouching. the current page is like watching an old man in suspenders get outta the pilot seat, and slowly hobble to the toilet on his cane.
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Post by fjodor on Jan 20, 2010 16:35:29 GMT
Hmm there's a good question. How old are Ysengrin and Reynardine? Probably younger then coyote if he did not know them from the beggining times, which really just narrows it down from millions-100's of thousands of years to as many as tens of thousands to only a few centuries. I remember asking Tom that question long time ago. His response was 'pretty old'. So I guess he has (or had) reasons to keep that vague.
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Post by warrl on Jan 20, 2010 19:33:21 GMT
Hmm there's a good question. How old are Ysengrin and Reynardine? Probably younger then coyote if he did not know them from the beggining times, which really just narrows it down from millions-100's of thousands of years to as many as tens of thousands to only a few centuries. Perhaps you're forgetting the geographic separation. Coyote is from the western US, Ysengrim and Reynardine from the general area of the French-German border. No matter how old they each are, they would not likely have learned of each other prior to about 1550. The tales about Y & R are known to be in excess of 900 years old. I couldn't find anything that said how old the Coyote legend is. (But I did find this.)
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Post by strangethoughts on Jan 20, 2010 21:47:15 GMT
Hmm there's a good question. How old are Ysengrin and Reynardine? Probably younger then coyote if he did not know them from the beggining times, which really just narrows it down from millions-100's of thousands of years to as many as tens of thousands to only a few centuries. Perhaps you're forgetting the geographic separation. Coyote is from the western US, Ysengrim and Reynardine from the general area of the French-German border. No matter how old they each are, they would not likely have learned of each other prior to about 1550. The tales about Y & R are known to be in excess of 900 years old. I couldn't find anything that said how old the Coyote legend is. (But I did find this.) Except coyote is a god, a first god at that, one who helped to shape existance, he would know the other gods from the beginning of the world. Assuming that all mythologies are true to a point then all creation myths are true to a point which implies a joint effort amongst the pantheons. Besides which we also know that coyote is not restricted to his own territory and views the whole world as his home he's a wanderer that one. Also we know psychopomps intereact with each other across territorial lines, so why wouldn't other gods? Therefore I submit that the age of a supernatural being plays a huge part in the knowledge other beings would have of it.
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Post by warrl on Jan 21, 2010 0:01:55 GMT
Except coyote is a god, a first god at that, one who helped to shape existance, he would know the other gods from the beginning of the world. Assuming that all mythologies are true to a point then all creation myths are true to a point which implies a joint effort amongst the pantheons. Besides which we also know that coyote is not restricted to his own territory and views the whole world as his home he's a wanderer that one. Also we know psychopomps intereact with each other across territorial lines, so why wouldn't other gods? Therefore I submit that the age of a supernatural being plays a huge part in the knowledge other beings would have of it. Y & R are folklore characters, which puts them maybe on par with mythical characters but a notch short of legendary characters. They certainly aren't gods. Or psychopomps. Coyote heard about Y & R and came to hunt for them, and then the three came as a group to Gillitie Wood. Or at least that's how he tells the story, and Reynardine appears to agree.
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Post by rosewind26 on Jan 21, 2010 7:17:57 GMT
my guess is that as coyote said before the gift was imperfect, perhaps it would have been perfect if his two bodies were one, but since Ysegrin won't admit the imperfection he simply uses the gift almost exclusively at the expense of the use of his own form.
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Post by rosewind26 on Jan 21, 2010 7:32:23 GMT
Maybe he was given the suit out of necessity after a crippling injury. Say, from an arrow. *cough* If you're referencing that perhaps Steadman the archer did something to him, I think the tree body is much more recent than that ( the headmaster recognizes Ysengrin, but this appears to be the first time he's seen him with the new augmentation). I'm inclined to think it's more like a side-effect; Coyote's gifts don't seem to graft well (I mean, do we know if Reynardine even has a corporeal form of his own anymore? Did he leave it under a rock?). It's also possible that going Ferngully drowns out any feelings of hunger or discomfort he may have, which'd mean he's probably eating only when he remembers to. What I'd like to know is that what prompted Ysengrin to take Coyote's gift relatively recently (I assume in the last generation or so). The Court had cut off contact long enough ago that they didn't know Surma was dead and gone, with Annie's fall off the bridge being what broke the silence. If nothing happened between them for, say, a decade, why the hell did Ysengrin feel the need for an upgrade? I think things are a stirring on both sides. boundaries aren't what they once were, but yes it would appear an interesting coincidence between when he decided to accept the gift and when Parley Annie and smith ALL started training to be mediators.
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