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Post by rosefae on Mar 14, 2012 15:48:44 GMT
That awkward moment in which I am sure that any hypothetical daughter of me and my boyfriend would respond as Annie did in panel 3 when asked the same question.
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Rafael
Full Member
Cute and spunky
Posts: 202
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Post by Rafael on Mar 14, 2012 17:13:21 GMT
MAAAAAAN! Brinnie and then Surma? What a ladies' man! Seriously, Anthony's like my hero right now.
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Post by atteSmythe on Mar 14, 2012 18:55:20 GMT
Well, we've established (just for you TB:) incontrovertibly and with unanimity of opinion that Anthony is a dick. And chicks like that.
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Post by TBeholder on Mar 14, 2012 19:07:41 GMT
Interesting... in Ties Brinnie left for "a lesson" and Tony had "matters to attend to"... interesting... If this was "interesting", he won't wear this expression this time. Everybody's talking about the starting flashback, but what got me about this page was Annie's line. To me, it sounds like "Not much. We didn't talk a lot." Judging by Donnie's reaction, he picked up on that too. I got it! This will be a battle of understatements. Antimony will drop a bigger one after Donald finishes his barrage - she can do that. This repeats several times. Then, of course, Jones unexpectedly appears, points out several possible understatements they missed, but still certifies Annie for 1-st dan in their fine art. Donald finally gets to microsat controls. Anthony calls via secure channel, ceremoniously, but briefly congratulates Annie with her new status, then challenges Jones to an understatement duel. The clash of these titans is about to start... end of the chapter! So... antimony's father looks exactly like me in 7th grade? Right down to the owlish expression and dippy hair cut? Are you also recognizable as a descendant of our saucer-flying friends? Well, we've established (just for you TB:) incontrovertibly and with unanimity of opinion that Anthony is a dick. And chicks like that. Envy? Tsk, tsk.
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vebyast
New Member
Usually I'm the Blue Marble, but this seems more appropriate
Posts: 45
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Post by vebyast on Mar 14, 2012 19:39:35 GMT
Antimony and Surma have a lot of fire symbolism. Brunnhilde had to sleep in a ring of fire until she was married. There were machinations, including a hero that was enchanted to forget that he loved Brunnhilde and some marital bait-and-switching. Eventually everybody died tragically.
Given that, I'm going to guess that this flashback is going to end in many, many tears. I'm just not sure how.
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Post by warrl on Mar 14, 2012 22:10:26 GMT
By the way, Wagner's Ring cycle and its sources collide head-on with a few other mythologies and fairy tales, with a pretty good result, here.
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Post by todd on Mar 14, 2012 22:15:25 GMT
Oh, another possible clue that they're older: they're not wearing school uniforms, possibly indicating that they're in a senior class. Not necessarily. We've seen Annie and her classmates in civvies plenty of times. The scene could be set during a weekend.
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Post by todd on Mar 14, 2012 22:17:18 GMT
Though evidently Wagner's account (and the Norse myths it was based on) can't be that accurate in the Gunnerkrigg Court universe, since she's being punished by Odin in the present day rather than in the mythic past - and by being sent to a boarding school rather than placed in an enchanted sleep surrounded by a ring of fire. I don't see a contradiction here. Maybe she's just that contrary? And the punishment depends on what she did this time. Makes sense, no? Also, in every version of the story that I've found (whether the Volsunga Saga or Wagner's Ring Cycle), she dies on Sigurd/Siegfried's funeral pyre. The fact that she's still alive means that that part of the story didn't happen in the Court's universe.
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Post by TBeholder on Mar 14, 2012 22:56:47 GMT
Given that, I'm going to guess that this flashback is going to end in many, many tears. I'm just not sure how. I'm afraid that old story is unnecessary to get this prediction. That the team of six is broken in three parts and only one of three pairs remained together is already more than enough. Also, in every version of the story that I've found (whether the Volsunga Saga or Wagner's Ring Cycle), she dies on Sigurd/Siegfried's funeral pyre. The fact that she's still alive means that that part of the story didn't happen in the Court's universe. Or that something like this happens to her all the time. Case in point: she didn't even left the Court and already chafes under the conditions imposed by "the Old Man". By the way, Wagner's Ring cycle and its sources Speaking of the sources...collide head-on with a few other mythologies and fairy tales, with a pretty good result, here. Mercedes Lackey? Well, matter of taste.
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Post by mikeymikemikey on Mar 14, 2012 22:59:47 GMT
Well, we've established (just for you TB:) incontrovertibly and with unanimity of opinion that Anthony is a dick. And chicks like that. No, all that's established that as an adult he qualifies as an ass due to his abandonment of Annie, intentions notwithstanding. He's still a teenager here, and that's still quite a number of years between then and now. Really, that's my point previously. Currently an ass doesn't necessarily equal always an ass. EDIT: And really, man? Chicks dig the asshole generalization? C'mon.
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Post by nero on Mar 14, 2012 23:20:46 GMT
"he was a handsome guy!"
So does Donny think that Anthony isn't handsome anymore?
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Post by mikeymikemikey on Mar 14, 2012 23:29:10 GMT
"he was a handsome guy!" So does Donny think that Anthony isn't handsome anymore? Or the man is just using tense consistency. Talking about the past means consistent use of past tenses (perfect tenses for different points in said past). Or maybe it's 'cause Donny is married now.
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Post by TBeholder on Mar 14, 2012 23:57:57 GMT
Almost forgot it. Note that this little talk runs as follows: Annie: <question about Anthony> Donald: <throws a weird look> <turns> Antimony... how well do you know your father? To those walking outside of the tank but wearing skullcaps - try to remove names and re-read. What do you think this answer implies about the question? "he was a handsome guy!" So does Donny think that Anthony isn't handsome anymore? Oh, come on. It most likely means "compared to the rest of us" and/or that he didn't see Anthony longer than Annie lives.
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Post by Stately Buff-Cookie on Mar 15, 2012 0:10:02 GMT
Hah, true. As Tom has said (something to this effect) before about people guessing the trajectory of this comic: imagine a dart board, and it is riddled with darts. Some are bound to hit the bull's eye. :3 Hah. Well, there's nothing to be lost in guessing wildly, is there? Other than looking foolish later, but who cares about that? As long as we're all having fun, it's worth it. Everybody's talking about the starting flashback, but what got me about this page was Annie's line. To me, it sounds like "Not much. We didn't talk a lot." Judging by Donnie's reaction, he picked up on that too. Isn't that par for the course in Annie's family? We've been shown many times how her mother barely told Annie about herself, and her father is much the same. The real tragedy here is probably that she's so used to it that it feels normal.
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reddy
New Member
Posts: 1
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Post by reddy on Mar 15, 2012 5:35:45 GMT
Can we talk about.... Brinnie's makeup!?
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bingli
Full Member
creepin' creepin'
Posts: 104
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Post by bingli on Mar 15, 2012 6:46:32 GMT
Well, we've established (just for you TB:) incontrovertibly and with unanimity of opinion that Anthony is a dick. And chicks like that. No, all that's established that as an adult he qualifies as an ass due to his abandonment of Annie, intentions notwithstanding. He's still a teenager here, and that's still quite a number of years between then and now. Really, that's my point previously. Currently an ass doesn't necessarily equal always an ass. EDIT: And really, man? Chicks dig the asshole generalization? C'mon. seconded.
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Post by anaheyla on Mar 15, 2012 7:19:38 GMT
Finally, more information on the mysterious Brinnie.
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Post by legion on Mar 15, 2012 7:42:12 GMT
Oh, another possible clue that they're older: they're not wearing school uniforms, possibly indicating that they're in a senior class. Not necessarily. We've seen Annie and her classmates in civvies plenty of times. The scene could be set during a weekend. Yes I know, that's why I said "possible" and "possibly".
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Rafael
Full Member
Cute and spunky
Posts: 202
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Post by Rafael on Mar 15, 2012 12:39:35 GMT
All I'm thinking is "Chapter 37, the one where we realize we don't actually know a god damn thing about Anthony".
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Post by atteSmythe on Mar 15, 2012 15:12:39 GMT
Well, we've established (just for you TB:) incontrovertibly and with unanimity of opinion that Anthony is a dick. And chicks like that. No, all that's established that as an adult he qualifies as an ass due to his abandonment of Annie, intentions notwithstanding. He's still a teenager here, and that's still quite a number of years between then and now. Really, that's my point previously. Currently an ass doesn't necessarily equal always an ass. EDIT: And really, man? Chicks dig the asshole generalization? C'mon. I thought that the "just for you TB" would've shown my tongue was planted firmly in cheek. Ok, fine, not a generalization. But it's evidently true in this specific case!
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cass
Junior Member
Posts: 58
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Post by cass on Mar 15, 2012 16:28:11 GMT
There are a lot of reasons a girl might go for a dickish guy. But, outside of school at least, the biggest reason is probably that dickish guys tend to be seen, by a certain type of girl, as ... safe fun ... to put it a little crassly. They won't call your parents, they won't expect to be introduced to your friends, you won't suddenly be a slut because you didn't want to go to sleep alone; they won't turn up and mess your life up. And there's also an element of the unknown to it, an experience you can't get anywhere else can be powerfully attractive. You won't get that with a self-defined nice guy. He's confused a dispositional stance with the posession of a cluster of desirable properties - and, in his inexperience, he's going to be very clingy. I don't think any girl, who doesn't want to be in an abusive relationship, wants to be someone's emotional crutch/punching bag in that way. Finding guys who are actually nice and who have interesting lives to share with you is hard. A lot of guys just look at relationships as a matter of how to court the girl - how to trick us into marriage or bed. Another main reason would be that, at least with naive girls, there can be an element of emotional conditioning to it, I suppose. You can keep a girl bound to you by blowing her mind one minute and completely ignoring her the next. It's similar to certain patterns of brainwashing. The trick is that he offers something she doesn't feel she can get elsewhere, and that she's afraid he might leave her if she fails to please him. The success of it falls off very rapidly as the experience of the potential victim increases though - even within the space of just that one relationship. You have to keep upping the rewards and punishments - and eventually, a few months down the line, you end up breaking her in half and getting her away from all her friends or having to let her go. But neither of those things seem likely to have been the case. The first one she wouldn't be after a long-term relationship at all. The second, well he doesn't seem that socially adept or actively malicious - he just seems not to care. While I admit it's possible that she got involved with him because he was a dick and she saw something in that, it doesn't really seem to fit very well. If he was a dick, I think there's probably some other compelling reason for their relationship going on.
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Post by Stately Buff-Cookie on Mar 15, 2012 21:34:20 GMT
You won't get that with a self-defined nice guy... ...Finding guys who are actually nice and who have interesting lives to share with you is hard. A lot of guys just look at relationships as a matter of how to court the girl - how to trick us into marriage or bed. This is the problem with the complaint "girls only go after assholess!" thing. It's the 'self-defined nice guy'. Think about that exact phrase. If the guy was actually nice, he wouldn't have to reinforce the notion he's a nice guy by stating it himself. This type of person tends to shroud themselves in that personality, either knowingly or unknowingly, in effort to be liked. What good is being nice because you think you'll get something out of it? It's just as you say. It's tricking people into liking you. Being nice is something that should happen ANYWAY along side of who you are, and what good are you as a person if "being nice" is all you are? It's the ultimate in missing the message of expecting people to like you for who you are. You've abandoned all your personal interests in trade for potentially not offending anyone. Is it a wonder why no one finds people like this interesting? Oh sure, no one will go out of their way to give you grief, but will your 'friends' have anything to say about you? Or that girl you used to date? All they know about you is how nice a guy you are. They should have more to say than "well he was nice". It's not like nobody can tell. At least I can. You can spot the guys like this a mile off. They don't give off the sleaze vibe either. It's something much more sad. Having a guy like this around is.. like being followed by a homeless puppy. All it knows of the world is begging for a reward at your feet in hopes to gain a home. Which is fine for the dog, but not so much for a human relationship. There's also a larger message here about one person's asshole is another person's best guy on earth. You can whitewash yourself and be 'nice' from everyone's perspective, but what good is that?
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Post by Georgie L on Mar 16, 2012 5:47:41 GMT
Can we talk about.... Brinnie's makeup!? nope. Yeah I get it was a joke
As for the nice guy thing, I think things aren't always as black and white as "Asshole" or "not asshole". Anthony is an emotionally detached person. He may not even have realised what he was doing to his daughter.
All I'm thinking is "Chapter 37, the one where we realize we don't actually know a god damn thing about Anthony". Possibly the best guess all chapter.
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Post by stormy on Mar 17, 2012 15:43:37 GMT
Guuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhh ... girls who vilify nice guys are digging their own grave, as well as being just plain hateful.
Nice does not mean following a potential love interest around pathetically. A nice person will be friendly and kind to people whether he/she is trying to date them or not. A nice person thinks about other folks and likes to see them comfortable and happy. Creeping your desired date isn't 'nice'. It's creepy.
Nice people are not necessarily cowards. A nice person of character CAN assert themselves. Its possible to be nice and have a backbone. Why do people think these two things are incompatible?
What's wrong with a man who is compassionate? Who cares about others? It doesn't have to make him 'feminine' or 'weak' or 'emotional'. It just means he isn't self-centered. And honestly? Sometimes being there for other folks takes a heck of a lot of strength than just walking away.
Do you really want a guy who is ONLY good to you? And then only as long as he feels like it? I try to surround myself with positive, generous people. And that includes my man.
I met my 'nice' guy at age 20. 14 years later, with a rapidly approaching 10 year wedding anniversary, and he's still nice. Not perfect, but kind. He's (usually) good to me, our friends, our family, and his students. And I dunno ... I personally think that's pretty damn awesome.
Nice guys rock. Period.
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Post by stormy on Mar 17, 2012 15:53:04 GMT
@stately Of course nice isn't enough, if there aren't any other traits to back it up. Say, integrity, honesty, humor, intelligence...
But I wouldn't pick a guy who wasn't 'nice' anymore than I'd pick one that was a liar. Just b/c nice isn't the end up and be all, doesn't mean its not important!
I've seen way too many women (and men!) get hurt by uncompassionate romantic partners who don't care. But you know, if you gals wanna keep sticking that metal fork in the electrical outlet, go right ahead.
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Post by foxurus on Mar 17, 2012 18:55:55 GMT
Stormy, you're missing the part where they said "self-defined".
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Post by wynne on Mar 17, 2012 21:48:26 GMT
Um... how did this get into a Nice Guy (TM) debate? Not that I don't have plenty to say on that subject, but it seems a little off topic. Let's get back to what we do best: Wild Speculation!!!
Soooooo, as Reddy said, how 'bout that makeup? I didn't even notice that before....
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Post by Stately Buff-Cookie on Mar 18, 2012 17:56:55 GMT
Stormy, you're missing the part where they said "self-defined". Pretty much. As a general rule, if anyone starts to think to themselves, "I'm a nice person. Why don't I get mine dues from time to time?" they should evaluate why they are being nice. If we really want to go beyond the original premise of DATING, the issue gets far more complex. Thinking you should get all the wimminz for being nice is bad, but there are those that let themselves be suckered into a nice guy mentality. It sucks, but there exists people that will tell you to give the very blood in your veins and run off it. The only thing you'll have to show for it is a kick in the teeth, but you keep doing it because you've been conditioned to think looking out for yourself to any degree is somehow inherently EVIL. But let's be honest. I was talking about bagging and tagging in the previous post.
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