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Post by jayne on Oct 15, 2010 17:27:27 GMT
AHA!! " employed by the court" means this was her job, not a sworn allegiance to the court. An employee can just quit. No crime, no foul. (Which is what I think Tom meant all along anyway)
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Oct 15, 2010 18:37:30 GMT
AHA!! " employed by the court" means this was her job, not a sworn allegiance to the court. An employee can just quit. No crime, no foul. (Which is what I think Tom meant all along anyway) Like the old recruiting slogan says, "It's not just a job, it's an adventure." Soldiers do give up a number of human rights nowadays, including the right to quit, and it was way worse a couple centuries ago. Even minor stuff like depressing morale by complaining or not saluting snappy enough could get you flogged! Being female I have trouble believing Jeanne was pressed, she probably chose to be a professional soldier and likely took pride in it until circumstances changed and it became inconvenient. There is some parallel to what you were saying before about marriage; the difference was that they usually beat a man who abandoned his spouse and dragged him back to her so that he would continue to support her as he was obligated to do, whereas deserting soldiers tended to be executed. Until I learn otherwise I am assuming Jeanne entered into this relationship of her own free will as an adult. Despite all that Jeanne was still a human being and I understand her choice to toss soldiering obligations for love, but she is an adult and must have known that there might be serious consequences to that decision. If she'd gotten away with Green then maybe they'd live happily ever after. That didn't happen. I'm not quite clear, why is everyone assuming she deserted? Yes, there was the note saying "escape" and giving a time, but she also didn't want to go to the annan waters. Doesn't that indicate (along with her face when she was lowered) that her boyfriend was the one "escaping" the forest? Why would he swim across the river if she was the one escaping? We do know that the green dude wasn't welcome in the Court so if they're going to be together they can't go there. It's been Formspring'd that Jeanne might not have had to swim the Annan to get to wherever they were going, but that "maybe" is an evasive answer. If they're not going to the Wood they're leaving the place altogether; I expect for some other mystical domain somewhere far away because muggle England wasn't too cool with interracial couples back in the day. Jeanne's bare feet have been bothering me since we first saw her; I wonder if they mean she can transform into something and/or carry Green somewhere, or something equally unexpected. Or maybe she's just 1/8 Hobbit.
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Post by jayne on Oct 15, 2010 21:42:32 GMT
AHA!! " employed by the court" means this was her job, not a sworn allegiance to the court. An employee can just quit. No crime, no foul. (Which is what I think Tom meant all along anyway) Like the old recruiting slogan says, "It's not just a job, it's an adventure." Soldiers do give up a number of human rights nowadays, including the right to quit, and it was way worse a couple centuries ago. Even minor stuff like depressing morale by complaining or not saluting snappy enough could get you flogged! Being female I have trouble believing Jeanne was pressed, she probably chose to be a professional soldier and likely took pride in it until circumstances changed and it became inconvenient. There is some parallel to what you were saying before about marriage; the difference was that they usually beat a man who abandoned his spouse and dragged him back to her so that he would continue to support her as he was obligated to do, whereas deserting soldiers tended to be executed. Until I learn otherwise I am assuming Jeanne entered into this relationship of her own free will as an adult. Despite all that Jeanne was still a human being and I understand her choice to toss soldiering obligations for love, but she is an adult and must have known that there might be serious consequences to that decision. If she'd gotten away with Green then maybe they'd live happily ever after. That didn't happen. I'm not quite clear, why is everyone assuming she deserted? Yes, there was the note saying "escape" and giving a time, but she also didn't want to go to the annan waters. Doesn't that indicate (along with her face when she was lowered) that her boyfriend was the one "escaping" the forest? Why would he swim across the river if she was the one escaping? We do know that the green dude wasn't welcome in the Court so if they're going to be together they can't go there. It's been Formspring'd that Jeanne might not have had to swim the Annan to get to wherever they were going, but that "maybe" is an evasive answer. If they're not going to the Wood they're leaving the place altogether; I expect for some other mystical domain somewhere far away because muggle England wasn't too cool with interracial couples back in the day. Jeanne's bare feet have been bothering me since we first saw her; I wonder if they mean she can transform into something and/or carry Green somewhere, or something equally unexpected. Or maybe she's just 1/8 Hobbit. The guys I know who are in the military never refer to it as "employed by the state", the ARE army, navy, air force, etc. Its part of their identity. The fact that Jeanne is considered "employed by the court" (by the author) makes me think its just her job.
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Post by todd on Oct 15, 2010 22:06:05 GMT
Note that none of the *characters* in the story have described Jeanne as a deserter, or brought that up at all; even the Founders, when rationalizing their plans to kill her, don't cite that as a justification. Which suggests that it hadn't occurred to Tom. (Although it could equally mean that he isn't ready to bring up the issue yet, rather than that he hadn't made the connection that his readers have.)
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Post by Casey on Oct 15, 2010 22:11:26 GMT
Another possibility why no one in the comic brought it up is because they don't see it that way. Occam's Razor. This entire "Jeanne got what she deserved because she was a filthy mutinous deserter" line of thinking is getting stale IMO.
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Post by imaginaryfriend on Oct 16, 2010 1:43:09 GMT
The guys I know who are in the military never refer to it as "employed by the state", the ARE army, navy, air force, etc. Its part of their identity. The fact that Jeanne is considered "employed by the court" (by the author) makes me think its just her job. Okay but has the author who chose those words ever been in the armed services? Note that none of the *characters* in the story have described Jeanne as a deserter, or brought that up at all; even the Founders, when rationalizing their plans to kill her, don't cite that as a justification. Which suggests that it hadn't occurred to Tom. (Although it could equally mean that he isn't ready to bring up the issue yet, rather than that he hadn't made the connection that his readers have.) When Young was pitching Diego's plan to the that room full of folk, Diego enters after the details of the plan had already been discussed. That's the only time that I can think of when it could have shown up. We only have a few key words from the letters between Jeanne and Green and if what she was planning was described as desertion I'd be surprised, I figure it'd be couched in much happier phrases. Another possibility why no one in the comic brought it up is because they don't see it that way. Occam's Razor. I agree, I don't think that Kat, Antimony, George or the robots would think of Jeanne as a deserter. I'm not even sure that Jeanne would want to think of herself as a deserter, though I suspect she might call it desertion if she were a neutral party watching a similar situation happen to another soldier at Court. This entire "Jeanne got what she deserved because she was a filthy mutinous deserter" line of thinking is getting stale IMO. You're putting words in my mouth. Saying that Jeanne's choices and attitudes influenced her situation is not the same thing as me saying that Jeanne deserved to be killed and bound as a ghost in perpetuity. As to Jeanne planning desertion... It is what it is. A deserter is a soldier who takes off without leave. Jeanne was a soldier. Jeanne was going to take off without permission, therefore Jeanne was going to desert. I will qualify that (as I have in the past) by saying that there are still details we could learn that would mitigate things but until that happens I think Occam's Razor actually suggests we go with the simple explanation. Like I've posted to this thread before, I think that an excellent case can be made for Diego being the bad actor in this scenario but Diego isn't a simplistic foil villain. In the same vein I don't think that Jeanne is a perfect Disney Princess heroine either. Even the main character of this comic breaks rules and steals now and then; perfect people and wholly-evil creatures don't seem to be featured in this comic. I am sorry if saying these things has upset anyone or lessened anyone's enjoyment of the comic but for myself, thinking that Jeanne may have crossed an ethical line for love doesn't ruin her role in the story or make me unsympathetic to her. In fact, examining the many facets of the complex characters makes me enjoy this comic more. It looks like we will find out more about Steadman next, eh?
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Post by jayne on Oct 16, 2010 2:13:39 GMT
The guys I know who are in the military never refer to it as "employed by the state", the ARE army, navy, air force, etc. Its part of their identity. The fact that Jeanne is considered "employed by the court" (by the author) makes me think its just her job. Okay but has the author who chose those words ever been in the armed services? Well, the author has shown a talent at choosing words for Annie, although he's never been a 13 year old girl, and an ageless trickster god... I don't think that's on his CV either.... since there's no cartoon author in this story, it's safe to assume Tom is not drawing solely from his actual experiences. (And doing a fine job, by the way!)
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Post by xheralt on Oct 18, 2010 5:17:06 GMT
Did anybody else here have a FLCL flashback because of Andrew's eyebrows?
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