|
Post by Cassiopea The Grande on Aug 20, 2008 3:16:54 GMT
Anyway yeah, I'm in Florida at the moment and I keep having lengthy descriptive dreams, this one didn't occur to me until just this afternoon. A lot of people will be outraged. I dreamed. ... That Smithy and Annie got together... And before you ask that's about all I can remember of it, except that someone fired a dart at some point and blamed it on Smithy but that's not his power. His power is creating order where there is none or something so it wasn't him. THINK ABOUT IT! It's not all that improbable. Unless Tom cuts in and says 'Yes... Yes it is.' I think my brain tried also to wrangle in the idea that Annie and Smithy are brother and sister but little things like incest don't really register in sleep...
|
|
|
Post by Count Casimir on Aug 20, 2008 4:04:31 GMT
It's been a while since you posted, Cassiopea, but this is a damn glorious return!
I have not yet been graced with any Gunnerkrigg dreams.
|
|
|
Post by Mezzaphor on Aug 20, 2008 7:11:05 GMT
A lot of people will be outraged. I dreamed. ... That Smithy and Annie got together... Actually, ever since ch 17, I've been hoping that those two will end up together. I've had a few GC-related dreams and they've all been weird as heck: First dream: I met Annie in real life. Only for some reason she was about my age, (early 20's) and her head was shaved. Running away from something through a park was involved somehow. Second dream: Annie was up on a stage, in front of an audience. She was telling off the Gunnerkrigg faculty. I don't remember why. Third dream: A strange revelation about the Court's backstory: that it was formerly the domain of the late god Gunnerkrigg. What's really odd was that Annie was telling all this to Kat at the beginning of ch 16, just after Ketrak's departure. (Which, incidentally, was the latest page at the time I had the dream.)
|
|
Neon
Junior Member
Posts: 98
|
Post by Neon on Aug 20, 2008 8:55:05 GMT
Okay, now that I've seen it I won't be able to read Gunnerkrigg without Smithy/Annie happening.
|
|
jubal
New Member
Posts: 25
|
Post by jubal on Aug 20, 2008 9:17:37 GMT
But that would mean Smitty and Parley are totally gonna get divorced.
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 20, 2008 15:11:00 GMT
I'm not big on the romance/shipping speculations but I can't help but observe that in the Surma-James-Anthony triangle Surma wound up going against conventional wisdom's choice: She picked someone apparently emotionally troubled (re Jones' comments) and arguably unreliable over the predictable, heroic and stable Eggers.
Since Antimony's somewhat mirroring her mother's track through GC there would be great plot symmetry if she winds up in a similar triangle and making a similar choice... which would argue against favorable outcomes for any "good boy" like Smitty. I'm unsure the story contains the male sides of any Antimony triangle so far but this party coming up would be an excellent place to introduce some. I predict a "bad boy" male lead character debut somewhere between now and mid-book 3.
Well... a bad boy to the extent such is allowed in GC, maybe a nicely romanticised but dark, troubled and emotionally unhealthy guy she can decide to make her life project around graduation time.
|
|
|
Post by Count Casimir on Aug 20, 2008 17:20:23 GMT
I don't see a romance happening anytime soon.
Of course, Tom has surprised me before. Numerous times.
|
|
|
Post by todd on Aug 20, 2008 22:42:15 GMT
I'd also be amazed if Annie got a boyfriend - but then she has changed since her early days.
Annie's head shaved - now there's a scary nightmare for you. What *did* you eat before you went to sleep, Mezzaphor? Let me know, so that I can avoid it.
|
|
|
Post by Tierra Y Libertad on Aug 21, 2008 0:15:52 GMT
[/b] debut somewhere between now and mid-book 3.[/quote]
See entry "Reynardine"
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 21, 2008 13:51:20 GMT
I'd also be amazed if Annie got a boyfriend - but then she has changed since her early days. I'll go even further and predict she'll have one and only one through her stay at GC, preceded by comics full of denial and un-Antimonyesque faux pas. Kat will have a few more crushes/relationships. [/b] debut somewhere between now and mid-book 3.[/quote] See entry "Reynardine"[/quote] Reynard doesn't count. I foresee him making snide comments from the sidelines.
|
|
|
Post by Mezzaphor on Aug 21, 2008 21:28:45 GMT
I'm not big on the romance/shipping speculations but I can't help but observe that in the Surma-James-Anthony triangle Surma wound up going against conventional wisdom's choice: She picked someone apparently emotionally troubled (re Jones' comments) and arguably unreliable over the predictable, heroic and stable Eggers. Since Antimony's somewhat mirroring her mother's track through GC there would be great plot symmetry if she winds up in a similar triangle and making a similar choice... which would argue against favorable outcomes for any "good boy" like Smitty. I'm unsure the story contains the male sides of any Antimony triangle so far but this party coming up would be an excellent place to introduce some. I predict a "bad boy" male lead character debut somewhere between now and mid-book 3. Well... a bad boy to the extent such is allowed in GC, maybe a nicely romanticised but dark, troubled and emotionally unhealthy guy she can decide to make her life project around graduation time. Half the time that generational xerox is in effect, it's so that the kids can break the cycle and make the right decision, literally or symbolically fixing the mess that their parents made. So I hold out hope that Annie isn't going to irrevocably mess up in whatever romantic choices she makes. And there's still too much ambiguity about what Carver and Eggers were like back in the day to say whether or not Surma made the right choice. Heck, all the negative information about Carver comes from the jilted third of the love triangle and a woman who admitted immediately afterwards that she was trying to provoke Annie -- hardly the most reliable sources.
|
|
|
Post by todd on Aug 21, 2008 22:22:28 GMT
Though, since Anthony went away without even bothering to write once to Annie, the argument that he's a jerk might have some validity. Kat's certainly placed him in the "jerk" category as a result.
|
|
|
Post by Mezzaphor on Aug 22, 2008 0:23:54 GMT
I wouldn't bet money on it, but there could be extenuating circumstances. I'm withholding judgment until we get more info.
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 22, 2008 4:08:22 GMT
I'm making no moral judgment against Anthony; actually I think he might have left a means to keep tabs on his daughter and other doings at GC and that there is a happy ending on the father/daughter front in the works. I'm just observing that in the Surma triangle Eggers was the better choice according to conventional wisdom.
|
|
|
Post by Mezzaphor on Aug 22, 2008 8:29:03 GMT
I'm just observing that in the Surma triangle Eggers was the better choice according to conventional wisdom. Based on what evidence? You say that Anthony was "apparently emotionally troubled (re Jones' comments) and arguably unreliable" but the evidence for this comes from Eglamore (who has reason to be biased against Anthony) and from Jones (who was attempting to provoke, not inform). You say that Eggers was "predictable, heroic and stable". People change over time. There's no evidence yet that Eggers was the same person then -- over a decade ago -- that he is now. It may turn out that Eggers was the better choice back then according to conventional wisdom, but to say so now -- with the scanty evidence we have -- is just an assumption.
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 22, 2008 14:21:09 GMT
Based on what evidence? You say that Anthony was "apparently emotionally troubled (re Jones' comments) and arguably unreliable" but the evidence for this comes from Eglamore (who has reason to be biased against Anthony) and from Jones (who was attempting to provoke, not inform). Remember, Eggers didn't start that conversation. He picked up a comment from Mr. Donlan about Anthony disappearing for periods of time without bothering to tell anyone and ran with it. Neither the Donlans nor Antimony disputed what he said, and one would think they'd be likely to argue it if they could for the sake of her (Antimony's) feelings. There's also Antimony's comments at the end of Ch. 6 which are consistent with an emotionally distant father, and his lack of appearance throughout the chapter on Good Hope as anything other than a faceless figure. Regarding Jones, yes she was trying to test Antimony's emotional reactions. That means her jab must be one of these three possibilities: Jones could be saying something outrageously false, she could be exaggerating, or she could be telling a painful truth. I'm afraid that a case for the first possibility just can't be built. The only slim suggestion of Anthony's involvement with his daughter might be the experiment Antimony proposed in the beginning of Ch. 5, which appears to be a dissection or something anatomical, and maybe her ability to pick locks. She must have learned those skills from someone and her father is the most likely candidate but even if that's the case it neither disproves the latter possibilities nor proves there was an emotionally close relationship. I'm sure we'll eventually see some good memories of Anthony in the comic but given the balance of the evidence I think we can safely infer that the Anthony character is that of an emotionally distant and currently absent father. You say that Eggers was "predictable, heroic and stable". People change over time. There's no evidence yet that Eggers was the same person then -- over a decade ago -- that he is now. It may turn out that Eggers was the better choice back then according to conventional wisdom, but to say so now -- with the scanty evidence we have -- is just an assumption. I'm talking about the conventional wisdom that the pretty girl should wind up with the hunky athletic guy in those love triangles. The picture of when the teachers were kids show what he looked like and the fact that Eggers is now the gym teacher make it reasonable to assume he was athletic back then. Beyond that, if Eggers was a big jerk I figure the Donlans wouldn't have been friends with him in the first place. ...but that's all beside the point. I'm not making a value judgment against Anthony or saying he's a bad father, or even that he was the worse match for Surma. My point was/is that Anthony occupies the "bad boy" leg of the relationship triangle dynamic. Eggers occupied the stereotype "good boy" side. Anthony won the fair maiden. Antimony is similar to Surma and doesn't get along terribly well with Eggers. This bodes ill for anyone hoping for a Smithy-Antimony match (or anything like that) in the long run. I've gone further that that and made some prophesies based on plot symmetry and trajectory but those are just what I think is probable.
|
|
|
Post by Count Casimir on Aug 22, 2008 21:55:11 GMT
My point was/is that Anthony occupies the "bad boy" leg of the relationship triangle dynamic. Eggers occupied the stereotype "good boy" side. If you'll permit me to disagree slightly: In the old picture, Eggers's scruffy haired, hand-in-pocket appearance speaks "rebel with-or-without a cause" to me, while Tony's clearly combed hair and upright spine seem to exhibit a "proper" air. If Mr. Carver were the "bad boy" in the situation, he'd need a fluffy white cat and a very high-backed chair. Also, I just noticed that those two and Surma are all not smiling. Are they all just distant, or did something just happen? EDIT: And Anja's uniform is distinctly different than everyone else's! I have gained much more curiosity than a simple mystery girl could provide. Ah, questions that may never be answered...
|
|
|
Post by Mezzaphor on Aug 22, 2008 23:13:33 GMT
Based on what evidence? You say that Anthony was "apparently emotionally troubled (re Jones' comments) and arguably unreliable" but the evidence for this comes from Eglamore (who has reason to be biased against Anthony) and from Jones (who was attempting to provoke, not inform). Remember, Eggers didn't start that conversation. He picked up a comment from Mr. Donlan about Anthony disappearing for periods of time without bothering to tell anyone and ran with it. I'm not disputing that Anthony used to disappear for months on end. I am saying that we need not draw the same conclusion from this fact that Eglamore did. Anja started to reply. Annie interrupted before we could hear whether she was trying to say "James, please, not in front of Antimony," or "James, please, that's not true and you know it." Counter-interpretation: Annie also blamed herself for failing to help Jeanne, even though she spent less than 30 seconds with Jeanne (most of which Jeanne spent trying to cut Annie's face off). In light of that, Annie's "Perhaps I did something to displease him" may have less to do with the relationship with her father and more to do with her tendency to blame herself first (even for events out of her control). And the fact that Annie was expecting Anthony to come back for her suggests that this abandonment is not consistent with Anthony's prior behavior towards his daughter. Surma was also a faceless figure in the first Good Hope flashback. And of the three other Good Hope flashbacks (ch 8, ch 9, ch 16), two of them were about the Psychopomps, which Anthony couldn't see; he would have been narrative dead weight if he had appeared in those flashbacks. Annie pointed out that Jones was messing with her immediately after Jones' "completely devoid of emotion" jab. Almost as if that was what tipped Annie off: "'Devoid of emotion'? Now I know you're full of crap, woman." So why would Jones try to provoke Annie with something wildly untrue? Maybe because she didn't know: Maybe Anthony, like his daughter, finds it hard to talk to people. Those who aren't close to him (like Jones) think he's stoic and unemotional, but those who are close (like Annie) know better. Add to that the fact that Annie called her dad after the events of ch 3, thinking he would want to know that she had been hurt. And, as mentioned before, she fully expected he would come back for her at the end of the school year. And if Anthony were a big jerk... Isn't long hair usually the domain of "bad boys"? Annie seems to be learning from the past, so whatever did happen, she need not be fated to repeat it. Getting back to the original point, much as I think Annie and Smitty would make a nice couple, as long as Parley's in the picture I don't hold out much hope for that happening.
|
|
|
Post by todd on Aug 22, 2008 23:26:39 GMT
Yes, I wouldn't want to make an enemy out of Parley. Of course, since she's in an earlier year than Smith or Annie, she'd graduate (probably) before either of them, so there'd be some time in Gunnerkrigg when she's not around.
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 23, 2008 6:11:13 GMT
Anja started to reply. Annie interrupted before we could hear whether she was trying to say "James, please, not in front of Antimony," or "James, please, that's not true and you know it." I agree Anja wanted the topic of conversation closed but is that ellipse really an interruption? An ellipse usually signifies a long pause. Assuming for the sake of argument that it was an interruption, us not knowing what Anja was going to say doesn't build a case either way. Counter-interpretation: Annie also blamed herself for failing to help Jeanne even though she spent less than 30 seconds with Jeanne (most of which Jeanne spent trying to cut Annie's face off). In light of that, Annie's "Perhaps I did something to displease him" may have less to do with the relationship with her father and more to do with her tendency to blame herself first (even for events out of her control). That interpretation's a mighty far reach considering the context of the previous panels and strips. There's no mention of the AW ghost in that whole chapter.(edit) Sorry, got confused via 2am posting and real life drama intruding on my fandom via AIM... Should have written that Antimony saying such things is evidence of lack of emotional support either way. (/edit) And the fact that Annie was expecting Anthony to come back for her suggests that this abandonment is not consistent with Anthony's prior behavior towards his daughter. That was the end of the term at a boarding school. I think that it'd be pretty reasonable for Antimony to expect her father to come for her no matter what his emotional issues. (edit) In literature and film it's common for kids who do get left in boarding schools after term to be pitied. That means either the danger to Antimony is very severe, the place Anthony is hiding is very unpleasant or otherwise unsuitable, or Anthony didn't really think about how the separation would effect Antimony, or some combination of the above. (/edit) Surma was also a faceless figure in the first Good Hope flashback. And of the three other Good Hope flashbacks (ch 8, ch 9, ch 16), two of them were about the Psychopomps, which Anthony couldn't see; he would have been narrative dead weight if he had appeared in those flashbacks. Antimony was in the hospital where her father worked and her mother was dying... but the father is completely irrelevant to the story wherever it's been referenced? Okay, assume that Anthony is a loving, supportive and involved parent with a close relationship to Antimony. Wouldn't he and Antimony have to have had a conversation about all the ghosts and psycopomps? That'd seem to be directly relevant. Sorry, but if he's absent from the story because he's irrelevant it'd make more sense that it was caused by he is irrelevant because of emotional distance. Annie pointed out that Jones was messing with her immediately after Jones' "completely devoid of emotion" jab. Almost as if that was what tipped Annie off: "'Devoid of emotion'? Now I know you're full of crap, woman." So why would Jones try to provoke Annie with something wildly untrue? Maybe because she didn't know: Maybe Anthony, like his daughter, finds it hard to talk to people. Those who aren't close to him (like Jones) think he's stoic and unemotional, but those who are close (like Annie) know better. In order to believe Jones is completely full of crap you also have to believe that everything everyone's said about Anthony Carver is either a lie or a distortion. What Jones may be saying in the "devoid of emotion" comment is probably a half-truth instead of reality but from the way Anthony's been presented in the story we can't yet rule it out. Also, Jones appears well informed and is training the new mediums... Being the previous medium Surma's a well-known figure in the court. After Antimony arrived and started making waves could Jones really be ignorant of Anthony's general reputation? (edit) I could have summed that up better... What I mean is that to build a case for Anthony as a supportive and emotionally available father ala Ward Cleaver or Bill Cosby you have to either propose a conspiracy theory (intentional or coincidental) where everything said about Anthony is wrong and those who could correct the record are being silenced (from our perspective as readers), or accuse the comic of being internally inconsistent. (/edit) Add to that the fact that Annie called her dad after the events of ch 3, thinking he would want to know that she had been hurt. Calling the parents is standard procedure for when a child gets injured at school. They get mad otherwise. And if Anthony were a big jerk... I'm willing to allow Anthony a probably-misunderstood status and redeeming qualities but like I said before, it's a safe bet that he's been emotionally distant with Antimony. In order for that to not be the case there'd have to be some new comics that reverse or explain away previous comics. Isn't long hair usually the domain of "bad boys"? At my school longer hair was for jocks (and a few headbangers) but since you bring up Egger's hair, Jones asked if Eggers was growing it out again in strip #376... I think someone mentioned it in some other thread already but that could mean she personally knew him when he was in school. Annie seems to be learning from the past, so whatever did happen, she need not be fated to repeat it. Never said she was, but we have similar characters in the same setting in similar circumstances and the same author/artist. Odds are that similar developments will follow. So far Antimony seems to be getting into more trouble than Surma (strip #162). Getting back to the original point, much as I think Annie and Smitty would make a nice couple, as long as Parley's in the picture I don't hold out much hope for that happening. Agree, though for much different reasons. Parley enjoys teasing Smitty and flirting but I could also see Parley egging Smitty on and playing an obnoxious cupid.
|
|
|
Post by todd on Aug 23, 2008 11:10:39 GMT
What is the AW ghost? (I can understand more and more why Tom isn't fond of abbreviations in this forum.)
|
|
|
Post by etcetera on Aug 23, 2008 11:17:39 GMT
AW Ghost = Annan Waters Ghost = Jeanne ... I guess. And I totally lost track of this thread.
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 23, 2008 13:47:10 GMT
Yep, Annan Waters Ghost was what I meant. Sorry about the confusing abbreviation, I figured my post didn't need to get any longer. And you're right, we have usurped this thread for off-topic things... even if it was mysteries-of-GC related stuff. Apologies, Cassiopea!
|
|
|
Post by todd on Aug 23, 2008 23:06:37 GMT
By now, she has a name: Jeanne. And before we learned that, we generally referred to her as "Ghost Girl with a Sword" rather than "Annan Waters Ghost".
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Aug 24, 2008 1:02:18 GMT
It was late at night and I didn't feel like looking up Annan to see if it had one "n" or two. Also, on rereading I see that I confused Mezzaphor's ref to Ch. 16 with Ch. 6 when we hadn't met Jeanne at all. Knowing that I now understand what he was trying to say about Antimony's comments in Ch. 6 (though I still don't buy it).
Some editing has now been done to that long post to make it clearer.
|
|
|
Post by Per on Sept 4, 2008 16:17:49 GMT
I had a Gunnerkrigg dream, but none of it was in-comic. In the first part I met Tom in person and he was drawing some sort of cartoon for one of my brothers. I don't remember much of his face since he was hunched over the drawing most of the time, but his hands seemed to be in good condition. We were throwing out ideas (for the cartoon) and laughing. When it was done I was going to ask that he make me a quick boxbot drawing, but the dream never got to that point so I don't know what his reaction would have been.
Later in the dream there was a kind of a fan competition reward in the form of an alternative boxbot design (in a drawing or something). There was some kind of explanation that when newly constructed, boxbots are evil and dangerous, but as they accumulate a few dents and scratches they quickly lose their edge; they're still malicious, but they're just too terrible for it to matter. Well, it wasn't exactly that, but it's hard to remember.
|
|
|
Post by cenit on Sept 4, 2008 16:52:26 GMT
Hi everyone:
I think I had GC dream, but it was simply walking in a place that looked like GC...
Regarding the debate here, a quick point is that Anthony was really irrelevant to the Hospital story, because he doesn't like the etheric and prefers to be all science... so he wouldn't be discussing ghost with her wife or child.
Also, like I said at some point; Annie in that chapter not only refers to him as Dad, but also shows that they were talking, about Mrs Tolinka leaving the next day... I find hard to believe that good old Anthony shows up in the room, looks Annie in the eye and says "Mrs Tolinka is leaving tomorrow" and then just leave... I expect some more interaction, maybe a conversation when Annie is talking about that lady, and Anthony (knowing somehow that she was going to die - he's a doctor) says that she is levaing... not dying but leaving, maybe to spare her feelings.
|
|
Boxbot
New Member
Le robot terrible.
Posts: 14
|
Post by Boxbot on Sept 4, 2008 18:43:05 GMT
Don't forget that most of the Good Heart stuff shows very liitle other people at all (No nurses, visitors, or patients roaming the halls). This seems to indicate, along with her mother's remarks to theguides about nightly rounds, that these portions happen at night, probaly long after Anthony Carver has gone to sleep (working as he would in the day). Most likely, the time he interacts with his daughter would be when the three of them are together, probably around mealtimes and before the night sets in.
Also: We know very, very little of Anthony Carver. James says he went off for months at a time, but in the flashback at the Diego's Warehouse, we learn James goes off training for long periods of time as well, which could reflect James seeing Anthony's leaving as inexcusable simple because he doesn't know what Anthony was doing at those time (Which Surma might have learned). And why he could be emotionally detached, Antimony herself often seems this way, because she's more introspective then usual. For all we known, Anthony Carver could be a lot like his daughter, coupled with an as-of-yet-unknown goal he works on that kept him away for long periods of time (Which he stopped when his wife was ill, and only picked up again after she was gone and his daughter occupied with school - As we don't know where he went or why, we can't determine how much of his current absence is by choice). James is biased against Anthony, and would therefore make the most negative of motives he didn't know about, seeing unexplained things as selfishness or being unreliable, a view that would probably be shared with others.
For all we know, Anthony Carver might have created the Tic-Tocs (And this way look over his daughter) and his disappearences might have been into the woods themselves, to strength himself in etheric tenets, and he and Surma might have married in a like-minded want to reunite the Forest and the Court. Or he might travel about to talk to other scientists about quantum physics, in a selfish want for people interested in what he likes to talk about.
And Antimony and Kat are definitely following a like pattern of their mothers, but as Diego's should show, they're seperating away from their parents, learning the secret of those robots where their mothers only guessed (I assume in regards to the comments in the flashback, and the fact the robot was in good repair for the scripted battle, neither of which are solid evidence).
Truthfully, it's all conjecture at this point, which seems to be Tom's goal.
Also: Those are some odd dreams. Then again, Gunnerkrigg Court's style would seem to suggest any dreams about it would be evocative, unusual, and very, very individual. Still, Antimony and Smit? There conversations seem as rich and meaningful as SMit and Mort's "This is how guys say hello."
|
|
|
Post by imaginaryfriend on Sept 4, 2008 22:04:44 GMT
Regarding the debate here, a quick point is that Anthony was really irrelevant to the Hospital story, because he doesn't like the etheric and prefers to be all science... so he wouldn't be discussing ghost with her wife or child. I have no doubt that we'll eventually see some flashbacks of Antimony and Anthony interacting at the hospital. Since he was a doctor there where his wife was dying and his daughter was staying there has to be a piece of this tale that's yet to be told. Still, with all the context that's been given I think there just isn't enough gray area for a warm, involved, and supportive Anthony to be lurking. An emotionally-withdrawn father figure would fit the circumstances well considering Antimony's personality, and people do tend to withdraw further when going through traumatic loss (note that science couldn't save Surma). Under normal circumstances it would be natural for a child to tell an involved parent about new friends... If Antimony did try to approach her father with stories about the ghosts and psychopomps at the hospital, and Anthony prefers not to deal with such things anyway, wouldn't her getting something of a brush-off be the natural result? It appears that she started seeing the psychopomps in the hospital (comic #337) so she should have said something to her dad around then that's not been told yet. Figure we may see a scene like that someday. Since I'm there already it's interesting how in the next strip (#338) Antimony reveals that her dad/father said that one of the inpatients was going to die. Why would he tell his little girl at all if he wasn't a bit detached, or if she overheard him tell someone else why would he use a euphemism for dying? Don't forget that most of the Good Heart stuff shows very liitle other people at all (No nurses, visitors, or patients roaming the halls). This seems to indicate, along with her mother's remarks to the guides about nightly rounds, that these portions happen at night, probaly long after Anthony Carver has gone to sleep (working as he would in the day). Most likely, the time he interacts with his daughter would be when the three of them are together, probably around mealtimes and before the night sets in. Also: We know very, very little of Anthony Carver. James says he went off for months at a time, but in the flashback at the Diego's Warehouse, we learn James goes off training for long periods of time as well, which could reflect James seeing Anthony's leaving as inexcusable simple because he doesn't know what Anthony was doing at those time (Which Surma might have learned). And why he could be emotionally detached, Antimony herself often seems this way, because she's more introspective then usual. For all we known, Anthony Carver could be a lot like his daughter, coupled with an as-of-yet-unknown goal he works on that kept him away for long periods of time (Which he stopped when his wife was ill, and only picked up again after she was gone and his daughter occupied with school - Interesting thought about the story taking place at times when Anthony wouldn't be there because of work routine. Also hospitals have cafeterias and people there do not need to need to observe traditional mealtime rituals. However Surma's bed looks like a single (a regular hospital bed in the first incarnation and one pillow in the grande elevated bed later). I can't see any other furniture in her hospital room (like a chair for visitors or a dresser for non-gown clothing) so it's not terribly likely that Anthony was staying there with them. Eggers going on voyages of training seems to be part of the dragonslayer thing he's got going. There's never been a suggestion he did that as a kid. If anything, to wind up as a teacher would seem to suggest that he didn't do anything too unexpected as a student. Anthony disappearing for periods of time without telling anyone where he's going is a bit different, though. Antimony being emotionally reserved or detached is another suggestion that her father being the same way. By the way: Does it sound like I'm beating up on Anthony? That's not my intent. It's possible to cast doubt on every witness we have about Anthony's personality if we suppose bias or hidden agendas on the part of everyone who's voiced an opinion about him. The circumstantial evidence about Antimony's current situation needs to be explained away. A secret message from Anthony to Antimony that got lost/stolen/eaten by Reynard might do that but that's sheer speculation about future events that reexplains previous events. Beyond that, there's still Anthony's absence in the plot. That widens the required circle of conspirators to include the author. Sorry, Anthony as a supportive and emotionally available father is a square peg in a round hole. It'd require forcing to fit. For all we know, Anthony Carver might have created the Tic-Tocs (And this way look over his daughter) and his disappearences might have been into the woods themselves, to strength himself in etheric tenets, and he and Surma might have married in a like-minded want to reunite the Forest and the Court. Or he might travel about to talk to other scientists about quantum physics, in a selfish want for people interested in what he likes to talk about. Yes! Anthony is the only character we've been introduced to that would appear to have the means, method, and motive to build the tic-tocs. I've been speculating that in other threads for a while (and hinting at it in this one) but the theory never got much popular acclaim. See the tic-toc thread for my argument about same. Surma and Anthony do represent a union of science and mysticism though I'm not sure their marriage would unite the Woods and Court as such. And Antimony and Kat are definitely following a like pattern of their mothers, but as Diego's should show, they're seperating away from their parents, learning the secret of those robots where their mothers only guessed (I assume in regards to the comments in the flashback, and the fact the robot was in good repair for the scripted battle, neither of which are solid evidence). Truthfully, it's all conjecture at this point, which seems to be Tom's goal. It's true this is a comic strip and therefore nothing is logically impossible, like Antimony *could* be secretly a boy or Kat might pull off a mask to reveal that she's actually Margaret Thatcher, but Tom is communicating a story here and the longer the strip goes the easier it will be to see where he's taking us. It looks like Kat and Antimony are going farther than their mothers went, but they're charting a very similar course.
|
|
Boxbot
New Member
Le robot terrible.
Posts: 14
|
Post by Boxbot on Sept 4, 2008 23:26:46 GMT
Ahh, but don't forget she mentions when saying she saw the guides that they were "hidden from the hospital staff," meaning she might have asked staff closer to hand (ie a nurse or nearby doctor) instead of waiting to talk to her parents of this, and, she does say she didn't really make friends with Muut until after talking to her mother. It could be that Surma told her only they two could see them, which means she might have saw it as something they shared and not involved her father at all.
It doesn't actually require a conspiracy, by the way, as much as it does Anthony being secretive about what he does. If no one knows why Anthony leaves, which the conversation about it seems to relate, then they're free to make conjecture about it. Now, since he doesn't talk about, it's easy to see how people could take this to be a perhaps selfish act, which could lead to a bias against him.
For example, let us assume, for the sake of argument, that Anthony went off and was attempting to build, ohhh, a device to understand etheric power in scientific reasoning, which required quite a bit of research on etheric power to pin down what exactly it was. However, knowing the Court's disdain for the seemingly random and escapist principles of etheric power (Magic works because it's Magic), he specifically does not tell anyone what it is he's working on.
Now, since no one knows what he's working on, and he specifically won't tell them, they're free to speculate, but such mysteries, left on their own, tend to stagnate, and it's eventually accepted as a personality quirk.
Now, following this line of assumptions, we can determine a few things: 1) James, who himself went away for training during the height of his relationship with Surma, is upset that she left him for Anthony, who also leaves for large amounts of time, but without the acceptable reason (James trains, of course, to protect Surma, which he sees as a noble goal, whereas Anthony leaves for no known reason at all, seeming to be flaky and secretive). The donlans don't particularly like the way he says this (see: "James, please. . .") but have no real evidence to refute this veiwpoint of his activities. Anthony also keeps people at a distance, because he doesn't want to reveal what he does, which could happen through a slip-of-the-tongue. This leads to Jones calling him emotionally distant, which, again, is one way to see his behavior.
I'm not suggesting that everyone is somehow against him, what I'm sugegsting is that his behavior patterns could have been such that, whilst acceptable in a friend who's perhaps a bit distant, might not be understandable as Surma's choice of husband, which could lead to their comments (James being angry at being passed over, Jones specifically viewing it in a way to make Antimony mad) making sense, because they don't know the true depths of his character. Of course, this theory is based on the fact that Surma alone learned what he was up to, thought highly of it, and also chose to keep it secret, which is also a bit far-fetched. Still, there are possibilities enough we can't discount he MIGHT have been a caring, decent father.
Now, whilst hospitals don't really have set mealtimes, it's most likely their meals would try to bring them together. If Anthony works in the day (which is a real possibility) he probably does turn in to get as much sleep as he can to be rested to continue his work, which is likely tiring. Antimony compares the sprawl of GC to Good Hope, and Good Hopes variety and number of guides speaks of a large number of patients (or a very bad survival rate for the hospital). Or, it could be as these flashbacks are stories she tells that center around her and the psychopomps and her mother, and as such, don't contain background information, like the people doing their work at night in the hospital, or her father, who can't share those experiences with her.
And by their marriage uniting the Forest and Court, I was running along the thought of Anthony disappearances having something to do with him trying to combine science and etheric tenets, mixed with Surma's knowledge as a Medium, perhaps trying to ease the two seperate things back towards working together as part of the same whole instead of further diverging.
And yes, as a comic anything could happen. It probably won't, though. Though he seems to find mystery useful to keep us following along (which it is). And whilst Antimony and Kat are following the same course, they seem to be going farther along then their mothers did, perhaps because of "tools" and knowledge their mothers passed on to them, or just that circumstances are different (ie Shadow2's involvement, which connected Robot, and lead to the need for a new robot body).
|
|