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Post by smjjames on Sept 12, 2012 7:03:19 GMT
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Post by Fhqwhgads on Sept 12, 2012 7:05:38 GMT
what the ffffff.... I swear I will never understand Ysengrin.
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Post by Serenissima on Sept 12, 2012 7:07:17 GMT
This makes me think that Coyote was actually jealous of the attention Annie has been giving Ysengrin, and visa versa, and has used this incident to capture Ys' attention again, so to speak, and break up the pair of them.
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Post by smjjames on Sept 12, 2012 7:08:38 GMT
what the ffffff.... I swear I will never understand Ysengrin. Blind rage all right, he doesn't even know why he attacked Antimony. Underneath all that gruffness, he might actually be a caring person (or wolf-god-thing as it were).
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Post by eightyfour on Sept 12, 2012 7:09:31 GMT
Why do I get the feeling that Y's shakes are not the actual drawback he got from Coyote's gift and that it's more related to his anger problem?
What's so sad about all this is that while he appears to feel genuinely sorry for attacking Annie, he'll be way too proud to apologise for it. :/
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Post by Stately Buff-Cookie on Sept 12, 2012 7:12:38 GMT
I half expected this, but only realize upon seeing it how much I didn't want this to happen.
Ys with an illness of some kind? That could be part of why Coyote gave him the tree body, and why he strives to keep Ys under such tight control. He doesn't want to see him suffer, but similarly cannot let him needlessly hurt himself or others with the very power he gave to help Ys?
Just some random (almost baseless) speculation.
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Post by smjjames on Sept 12, 2012 7:16:40 GMT
Why do I get the feeling that Y's shakes are not the actual drawback he got from Coyote's gift and that it's more related to his anger problem? Other than the appearance of having a really bad case of mange (or more likely his fur simply got rubbed off in the tree body)?
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noel
New Member
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Post by noel on Sept 12, 2012 7:17:32 GMT
Long-time reader and lurker, registered to post...
I actually thought this page was utterly clear and the most brilliantly creepy page of the comic to date.
I don't think Ysingrin attacked Annie at all. I think the tree that he allowed to take over a lot of his motor functions, which ultimately answered to Coyote, was what attacked Annie--note how much the attack is by the tree, and not by the wolf. This page is Ysingrin himself again, half-released from the tree, and unlikely to doubt the intentions of his beloved master.
I think Coyote is not as okay with Annie's attitude as he let on. Or with something else about her. We always knew he was a trickster god...
At least, that's how I read it. Thoughts?
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Post by smjjames on Sept 12, 2012 7:25:45 GMT
Long-time reader and lurker, registered to post... I actually thought this page was utterly clear and the most brilliantly creepy page of the comic to date. I don't think Ysingrin attacked Annie at all. I think the tree that he allowed to take over a lot of his motor functions, which ultimately answered to Coyote, was what attacked Annie--note how much the attack is by the tree, and not by the wolf. This page is Ysingrin himself again, half-released from the tree, and unlikely to doubt the intentions of his beloved master. I think Coyote is not as okay with Annie's attitude as he let on. Or with something else about her. We always knew he was a trickster god... At least, that's how I read it. Thoughts? The only problem with that is that Ysengrin has full control of the tree and had clear intentions of attacking Annie.
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Post by Geekette on Sept 12, 2012 7:27:14 GMT
Ys with an illness of some kind? That could be part of why Coyote gave him the tree body, and why he strives to keep Ys under such tight control. He doesn't want to see him suffer, but similarly cannot let him needlessly hurt himself or others with the very power he gave to help Ys? Well I was going for the 'Coyote deliberately set it up, and I really want to get the image of Coyote as a manipulative abusive boyfriend to Ysengrin' angle, but now I'm stuck wondering if Ysengrin just has rabies.
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Post by rafk on Sept 12, 2012 7:27:35 GMT
Long-time reader and lurker, registered to post... I actually thought this page was utterly clear and the most brilliantly creepy page of the comic to date. I don't think Ysingrin attacked Annie at all. I think the tree that he allowed to take over a lot of his motor functions, which ultimately answered to Coyote, was what attacked Annie--note how much the attack is by the tree, and not by the wolf. This page is Ysingrin himself again, half-released from the tree, and unlikely to doubt the intentions of his beloved master. I think Coyote is not as okay with Annie's attitude as he let on. Or with something else about her. We always knew he was a trickster god... At least, that's how I read it. Thoughts? Absolutely. Coyote was OBVIOUSLY up to something by goading Ysengrin, sending Annie off to talk to Ys about Coyote's theory while telling her Ys would react badly, and then the thing of him melting into the ground like that. The fact that he didn't visibly appear during the "attack" sequence was a surprise, but Ysengrin's reaction here screams out that the "attack" was unnatural and that Coyote is in some way responsible. Remember the moment with Coyote's tooth and the binding. That was the first hint to us readers that Coyote is not nice underneath the laughter (and also that he keeps secrets from Ysengrin). This one confirms it. Coyote is up to something. Don't know what. Don't know how. Destroy the court from inside? Cause the Court to end the truce? Don't know. But he's up to something alright. And Ysengrin is just his pawn.
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Post by skythorn on Sept 12, 2012 7:31:08 GMT
Long-time reader and lurker, registered to post... I actually thought this page was utterly clear and the most brilliantly creepy page of the comic to date. I don't think Ysingrin attacked Annie at all. I think the tree that he allowed to take over a lot of his motor functions, which ultimately answered to Coyote, was what attacked Annie--note how much the attack is by the tree, and not by the wolf. This page is Ysingrin himself again, half-released from the tree, and unlikely to doubt the intentions of his beloved master. I think Coyote is not as okay with Annie's attitude as he let on. Or with something else about her. We always knew he was a trickster god... At least, that's how I read it. Thoughts? Ditto on the 'registered to post' but I disagree on the substance in part. I feel the rage was based in Ysengrin being scared/confused by the way that Antimony discards this great secret with a little verbal fillip. Fear is under most rage emotions. After the rage, one feels a little vulnerable, and this is what we see of Ysengrin, and I do appreciate how Coyote comes and reassures probably the most human of all the creatures in his land. Coyote probably enhanced the rage aspect and empowered the extreme reaction. Coyote could have stopped it any time - and did not. We have seen two strong friends disagree, the human's intellectual contextualisation and the animal anthropomorphising both being sundered & their nature being laid bare - and neither surviving facing this fundamental element of either of them. Poor Ysengrim. Poor Antimony. The Great Trickster is tricking some more ...
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Post by Ashley Y on Sept 12, 2012 7:34:21 GMT
Agree with noel. Deeply creepy plot turn.
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yu2
New Member
Posts: 2
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Post by yu2 on Sept 12, 2012 7:43:57 GMT
I'm glad I'm not the only one who got immediate creeper vibes from Coyote. It really seems like the attack was ultimately the work of the trickster god in order to break apart Ysengrin and Annie's relationship because he was jealous that neither Ysengrin nor Annie were giving him any attention that he thought he deserves.
I feel bad for poor Ysengrin. You really get the feeling that he's nothing but Coyote's plaything. Ysengrin gets neglected and abused when he adores Coyote, but when he and Annie start to form a bond, he'll do whatever it takes to get that spotlight back on him—even if that means violence and deception.
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Post by asianborat on Sept 12, 2012 8:22:55 GMT
Oh my jesus that was dark.
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Post by hnau on Sept 12, 2012 8:38:18 GMT
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Post by contrition on Sept 12, 2012 8:39:04 GMT
If Coyote did end up controlling Ysengrin, I wonder if he knew about the beacon and how far he would have let the charade go if she hadn't used it.
Also, there was discussion in the previous thread about whether Annie had retrieved her blinker stone by the time they reached the edge of the forest. That, and the fact that we're witnessing this (which, if I remember correctly, every event other than flashbacks or immediate surroundings has taken place through her point of view) makes me wonder whether she isn't seeing this right now as well.
Of course, then that opens up the question of whether Coyote is putting on this act for her, Ysengrin, or if this is just a bunch of rambling wildspec.
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Post by Onomatopoeia on Sept 12, 2012 8:48:02 GMT
To quote a certain acting robot from Futurama, "I'm not familiar with the type of thing that's happening here."
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Post by GK Sierra on Sept 12, 2012 8:55:42 GMT
Aww, lookit all the new members! I hear they're born underneath leaf litter and in old crisp bags. Or is that faeries? Either way, it makes me all warm'n'fuzzy inside.
(Whoever mentioned that Ysrengrin needed some shoosh and pap pap in an earlier thread, it looks like you were dead on.)
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Post by Max on Sept 12, 2012 9:08:17 GMT
What's so sad about all this is that while he appears to feel genuinely sorry for attacking Annie, he'll be way too proud to apologise for it. :/ Something tells me Annie won't be so keen to accept an apology anytime soon.
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Post by thesaddestface on Sept 12, 2012 9:12:47 GMT
This one was so sad but also rather disturbing. He seems really confused about what happened and why he did it which makes me wonder if his mind is being affected by an external force.
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gary
Full Member
Posts: 121
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Post by gary on Sept 12, 2012 9:13:58 GMT
Something tells me Annie won't be so keen to accept an apology anytime soon. Eh, Annie can be pretty good about not holding grudges. Even just last comic she was still more concerned about Ysengrin than angry.
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Post by foxurus on Sept 12, 2012 9:22:20 GMT
This page broke my heart.
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Post by scalesandfins on Sept 12, 2012 9:32:53 GMT
Long-time reader and lurker, registered to post... I actually thought this page was utterly clear and the most brilliantly creepy page of the comic to date. I don't think Ysingrin attacked Annie at all. I think the tree that he allowed to take over a lot of his motor functions, which ultimately answered to Coyote, was what attacked Annie--note how much the attack is by the tree, and not by the wolf. This page is Ysingrin himself again, half-released from the tree, and unlikely to doubt the intentions of his beloved master. I think Coyote is not as okay with Annie's attitude as he let on. Or with something else about her. We always knew he was a trickster god... At least, that's how I read it. Thoughts? YES THIS. This is so dark and horrifying UGH. Oh my god, visceral feelings of upset and disturbed and wanting to snatch Ys away. Oh my god his scared confused face, I can't. You know the horrible, shitty news story about the elderly Spanish woman who painted the potato Jesus and how she's hiding in her house in shame and it had a photo of her making a sad face and you just wanted to explode in needing to hug her and needing to punch whoever wrote that smirky article in the face? YSENGRIN BABY. I JUST. FASKDLF;A
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Post by jasmijn on Sept 12, 2012 9:39:17 GMT
I came here to say basically all the things noel already wrote so clearly. So yeah.
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leah
New Member
Posts: 17
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Post by leah on Sept 12, 2012 9:57:06 GMT
Long-time reader and lurker, registered to post... I actually thought this page was utterly clear and the most brilliantly creepy page of the comic to date. I don't think Ysingrin attacked Annie at all. I think the tree that he allowed to take over a lot of his motor functions, which ultimately answered to Coyote, was what attacked Annie--note how much the attack is by the tree, and not by the wolf. This page is Ysingrin himself again, half-released from the tree, and unlikely to doubt the intentions of his beloved master. I think Coyote is not as okay with Annie's attitude as he let on. Or with something else about her. We always knew he was a trickster god... At least, that's how I read it. Thoughts? Yikes. I was kind of thinking Coyote had just goaded Ysengrin into losing it and was satisfied that it had worked, but I think you're right. He gave Ysengrin the tree power, Ysengrin at one point insisted that his power is perfect, which we know perfectly well it isn't since all of Coyote's gifts change when he gives them. Right before he transformed, he started clutching his head and shaking. I think at page 1082 panel 1, he's being taken over, and panel 3 is when the tree possesses him. Which means that Annie is completely right about Ysengrin being "not like this," but that she's really off in her judgment about Coyote, whose purpose seems to be sinister, deliberate, and major, rather than chaotic like I expected.
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Post by Lightice on Sept 12, 2012 10:23:50 GMT
Long-time reader and lurker, registered to post... I actually thought this page was utterly clear and the most brilliantly creepy page of the comic to date. I don't think Ysingrin attacked Annie at all. I think the tree that he allowed to take over a lot of his motor functions, which ultimately answered to Coyote, was what attacked Annie--note how much the attack is by the tree, and not by the wolf. This page is Ysingrin himself again, half-released from the tree, and unlikely to doubt the intentions of his beloved master. I think Coyote is not as okay with Annie's attitude as he let on. Or with something else about her. We always knew he was a trickster god... At least, that's how I read it. Thoughts? I don't think that you quite understand how Ysengrin's control of the trees works, based on what we've seen him do. Controlling trees is no special effort for him. It doesn't require extra concentration or willpower. Trees bend to his will as easily as the muscles of his own body; easier, in fact, now that his body has been practically crippled from disuse. It seems fairly clear to me that Ys fell into blind blood rage and acted purely on instinct for the entire encounter. Now that it's over, he's scared and ashamed for his actions. I have no doubt that Coyote manipulated the events to create this outcome, but I seriously doubt that he would have directly interfered. That would be terribly crude of a mighty trickster god whose main weapon has always been his sharp tongue, in spite of how many powers he possesses. Something tells me Annie won't be so keen to accept an apology anytime soon. You never know. This isn't the first time Ysengrin has attacked her without provocation, just the first time Coyote didn't stop him right away. I'm fairly sure that Annie understand that Ys wasn't himself when he attacked her. That being said, I really doubt that she's going to be comfortable in his company any more.
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Post by karakai on Sept 12, 2012 11:03:23 GMT
Yikes. I was kind of thinking Coyote had just goaded Ysengrin into losing it and was satisfied that it had worked, but I think you're right. He gave Ysengrin the tree power, Ysengrin at one point insisted that his power is perfect, which we know perfectly well it isn't since all of Coyote's gifts change when he gives them. Right before he transformed, he started clutching his head and shaking. I think at page 1082 panel 1, he's being taken over, and panel 3 is when the tree possesses him. Which means that Annie is completely right about Ysengrin being "not like this," but that she's really off in her judgment about Coyote, whose purpose seems to be sinister, deliberate, and major, rather than chaotic like I expected. I'm not so sure about that. Plenty of people will grab their heads when trying to wrap their brains around something, or try and get through being gobsmacked by a huge wrecking ball of emotion ( eg coping with someone dying). Ys has a lot of anger towards the court (if not humans in general), enough to act like a wrecking ball when instigated. He just couldn't hold back the blind rage. :[
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Post by paxjax123 on Sept 12, 2012 11:10:19 GMT
This creature is about to do something evil. I don't like this...
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Post by lemmingatk on Sept 12, 2012 11:24:37 GMT
Reynard kills his hosts, and it appears Ysengrin is schizo when exerting his power over trees. We know that Coyote's 'gifts' are not perfect, but remember that they came from him and he appears to have the perfect version of those powers.
Also, Coyote seems to be manipulating the situation, but is it out of evil intent or is he just bored?
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