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Tierra Y Libertad
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[1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weight
« Thread Started on Mar 23, 2012, 7:01am »
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More fingernail marks in the palm. Parallels across the generations and all that. Figuring out a title for this page's topic was tricky. Most of the text is a bunch of long sentences in tightly packed speech bubbles attached to Mr Donlan.

But why did Anthony want Antimony "to be involved"? It seems silly. I disagree with Mr Donlan's interpretation. Why would Daddy Carver want to hear his daughter's voice?

I can see the little blue clip that Antimony used to have in her hair in the first panel on Surma. Another Mechanical Milton horse is in the last panel, do you see? Hopefully they'll get to ride in the carriage again. But where? Or maybe the horse is just passing by on its way somewhere else.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #1 on Mar 23, 2012, 7:14am »
I'd have to agree with what Donlan is saying. The call was intended for Antimony, and the code was intended for Mr Donlan. I think Anthony may be getting them together like this on purpose, the purpose which will probably be detailed in whatever the code says.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #2 on Mar 23, 2012, 7:15am »
Maybe he misses her? He's not a good father, but he doesn't seem like he hates her. He may blame her for her mother's death, which is a horrible thing to do, but I don't think he truly hates her. He could even feel guilty about what the way he's been acting.

On the other hand, it could just be Donny laying through his teeth to make Annie feel better. Both are pretty plausible. He's a father, and he probably feels horrible about the way Annie's been treated by her father and the way he kind of completely crushed Annie earlier when he was eager so eager to decode that message that he didn't think about how it made her feel to be nothing more than a part of a code.

Off topic: WhoooooooOOOoOOOOOOOOoooooOO! It's three in the morning, and I'm just a few long paragraphs away from being finished with my Religious Studies paper. I never want to read about the Puritans ever again.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #3 on Mar 23, 2012, 7:22am »
Did Donny know about Tony's fingernail marks, or is that just for us?
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #4 on Mar 23, 2012, 7:43am »
I hoped that Donny was going to make that point. It seems like the obvious reason why Anthony would call Annie and use her name as part of the code. Hopefully the result of the code will help explain why he's been silent for 2 years and why he didn't speak to Annie at greater length while he seemed to have the chance
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #5 on Mar 23, 2012, 7:44am »
Code was intentional, it was possible to use different. He decided to use this one.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #6 on Mar 23, 2012, 7:44am »

Mar 23, 2012, 7:01am, Tierra Y Libertad wrote:
Why would Daddy Carver want to hear his daughter's voice?


Unless you believe he has no feelings for his daughter at all, that's a very silly question.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #7 on Mar 23, 2012, 8:04am »
Here they are again in the part of the Court that is haunted by the ghost of The Artist Formely Known As Prince.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #8 on Mar 23, 2012, 8:39am »

Mar 23, 2012, 7:15am, Molly the Sleepless wrote:
Maybe he misses her? He's not a good father, but he doesn't seem like he hates her. He may blame her for her mother's death, which is a horrible thing to do, but I don't think he truly hates her. He could even feel guilty about what the way he's been acting.

On the other hand, it could just be Donny laying through his teeth to make Annie feel better. Both are pretty plausible. He's a father, and he probably feels horrible about the way Annie's been treated by her father and the way he kind of completely crushed Annie earlier when he was eager so eager to decode that message that he didn't think about how it made her feel to be nothing more than a part of a code.


I'm inclined to believe Donny, if only because that's the version that's going to help me sleep in 5 minutes.

Either way, notice how Surma looked back? A hint of things to come, mayhap? After all, we know that Donny and Surma are/were/will be the two people closest to him...
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #9 on Mar 23, 2012, 9:23am »
Huh.

/Joker voice.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #10 on Mar 23, 2012, 9:24am »
I realised: Gunnerkrigg Court has lots of scenes of people talking while walking to some place [this is good, don't change that].
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #11 on Mar 23, 2012, 9:36am »

Mar 23, 2012, 7:44am, rafk wrote:

Mar 23, 2012, 7:01am, Tierra Y Libertad wrote:
Why would Daddy Carver want to hear his daughter's voice?


Unless you believe he has no feelings for his daughter at all, that's a very silly question.


I believe it's a perfectly valid question! He clearly needs to record her voice so he can make an obedient, and not fire spewing, robot daughter to replace Annie.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #12 on Mar 23, 2012, 9:37am »

Mar 23, 2012, 7:01am, Tierra Y Libertad wrote:
Figuring out a title for this page's topic was tricky.


You could have titled it "Eglamore's happy hand". ;D
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #13 on Mar 23, 2012, 9:59am »
I thought Annie did find her own balance, and here we see, she did only fall back to "Carver" mode... :( Oh, well. ::)

Mar 23, 2012, 7:15am, Molly the Sleepless wrote:
Maybe he misses her? He's not a good father, but he doesn't seem like he hates her. He may blame her for her mother's death, which is a horrible thing to do, but I don't think he truly hates her. He could even feel guilty about what the way he's been acting.
I don't think he got that much of self control. Or that a lot of people got enough of self control to dance over anything closely associated to this much pain - unless it becomes irrelevant, which isn't the case here.
Mar 23, 2012, 7:15am, Molly the Sleepless wrote:
and I'm just a few long paragraphs away from being finished with my Religious Studies paper. I never want to read about the Puritans ever again.
Puritans? This entirely explains the grimdark attitude, really. ;)

Mar 23, 2012, 7:43am, rafk wrote:
Hopefully the result of the code will help explain why he's been silent for 2 years and why he didn't speak to Annie at greater length while he seemed to have the chance
I still suspect plain and simple "do no harm".

Mar 23, 2012, 9:36am, Stately Buff-Cookie wrote:
I believe it's a perfectly valid question! He clearly needs to record her voice so he can make an obedient, and not fire spewing, robot daughter to replace Annie.
Some people have really strange inclinations.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #14 on Mar 23, 2012, 10:53am »
First thought: how many boys have nails long enough to do that to their palms?

Anyway. So Anthony is obviously putting a lot of effort into stopping himself from reciprocating Brinnie's affections. If he didn't care or wasn't interested he wouldn't have gone all Wolverine on his palms just from a simple "no thank you." So he's got a very good reason to avoid romantic entanglement despite apparently wanting to. Words cannot express how creepily interested I am in knowing what this reason is.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #15 on Mar 23, 2012, 10:57am »
Hm... So Anthony isn't so bad?
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #16 on Mar 23, 2012, 11:05am »

Mar 23, 2012, 9:59am, TBeholder wrote:

Mar 23, 2012, 7:15am, Molly the Sleepless wrote:
Maybe he misses her? He's not a good father, but he doesn't seem like he hates her. He may blame her for her mother's death, which is a horrible thing to do, but I don't think he truly hates her. He could even feel guilty about what the way he's been acting.

I don't think he got that much of self control. Or that a lot of people got enough of self control to dance over anything closely associated to this much pain - unless it becomes irrelevant, which isn't the case here.


Maybe it's that he blames himself? Anthony isn't good with emotion, or at least at showing them to others.

In Fire spike he's seen with Surma, and judging from the red around his eyes he's most likely cried openly just before Antimony showed up. There's got to be a lot of emotion if it's able to break through his pokerface, which he's able to keep up even when he's in emotional turmoil. Donny mentioned that he might seem collected, but that doesn't mean he always is.
Antimony has shown this ability as well and she's had lapses where she lets through that she's not a robot.




Mar 23, 2012, 10:53am, basser wrote:
First thought: how many boys have nails long enough to do that to their palms?


It's about applied pressure, not length. Unless you cut them so short that there's a risk of ingrowing.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #17 on Mar 23, 2012, 12:24pm »
So there's an obvious parallel between Anthony's behavior in the story and Antimony's behavior at the start of the chapter. They're really not that different from one another. I hope Antimony realizes this sooner rather than later, so far it seems like she's convinced she's 100% her mom but she's really not.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #18 on Mar 23, 2012, 12:24pm »
This just in. Anthony Carver is Sheldon Cooper.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #19 on Mar 23, 2012, 2:11pm »
I love the parallel with the fingernail marks. I wonder why he's so stressed out about Brinnie liking him?

Also ='( to the last line. This chapter is really starting to make me like Tony
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #20 on Mar 23, 2012, 2:29pm »

Mar 23, 2012, 2:11pm, arabesque wrote:
I wonder why he's so stressed out about Brinnie liking him?


Maybe he has had some sort of very negative experience with emotional interaction and because of that developed an "avoid emotion in public" strategy. And as he kept that up for a long time it just got worse and worse.

It doesn't need to have an external reason though. I suspect he may have Aspergers syndrome or something like that (hasn't someone else speculated that somewhere?).

Perhaps a combination of the two. To me that seems to be the most likely.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #21 on Mar 23, 2012, 2:52pm »
You know, in retrospect, I realised how well constructed the first flashback chapter ("Ties") was: it had Anthony leave the group early to establish his awkwardness, Brinnie leave early too in a magical way to start the "antimagic prejudice" thing that gets Eglamore into Dragonslayer training… AND it was also done so that the two characters couldn't interact before our eyes and we could not suspect anything of what happened in this chapter.

Mind: blown.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #22 on Mar 23, 2012, 2:57pm »
Unacceptable! He's nothing but a low life. A decent human being does not run off disregarding HIS OWN DAUGHTER'S HEART. He's so much of a selfish jerk.
"Oh, don't judge me! I'm imcapacitatingly shy!"
Oh no you don't. It's a little girl whom you have ignored and treated coldly after the death of someone YOU KNEW meant more to her than anything else in the whole world (and then some). All you needed to do was be there, or say something, or leave a calling number. But you chose to ignore and leave a cold shoulder.
I know a father. My father is a good friend of mine. You sir, are no father.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #23 on Mar 23, 2012, 3:15pm »

Quote:
The smallest thing can carry the greatest weight [with tony].


Oh, I get it.

So how heavy were those two years of silence?
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #24 on Mar 23, 2012, 5:57pm »

Mar 23, 2012, 7:01am, Tierra Y Libertad wrote:
Another Mechanical Milton horse is in the last panel, do you see? Hopefully they'll get to ride in the carriage again. But where? Or maybe the horse is just passing by on its way somewhere else.

It seems to me that Donald is flagging it down, actually. Let's go for a ride! :)
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #25 on Mar 23, 2012, 5:58pm »

Mar 23, 2012, 2:29pm, La Goon wrote:

Mar 23, 2012, 2:11pm, arabesque wrote:
I wonder why he's so stressed out about Brinnie liking him?


Maybe he has had some sort of very negative experience with emotional interaction and because of that developed an "avoid emotion in public" strategy. And as he kept that up for a long time it just got worse and worse.

It doesn't need to have an external reason though. I suspect he may have Aspergers syndrome or something like that (hasn't someone else speculated that somewhere?).

Perhaps a combination of the two. To me that seems to be the most likely.


It could just be he's not interested but still worried about hurting her feelings. That situations never fun to be in. You don't want to give your friend the wrong idea, but at the same time you feel really bad for not liking them the same way because it can hurt them. If he likes her back it could be just as bad. It can be stressful to be stuck between wanting to give it a try and being afraid that the friendship would end.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #26 on Mar 23, 2012, 6:05pm »
I know some fans dislike Anthony and think that he hates Annie and just abandoned her because he blames her for Surma’s death but to me this seems too simple and doesn’t ring true to Anthony’s character we’ve seen so far.

Reynardine said that everyone knew that if Surma was to have a child she would eventually die. Anthony was aware of this as well but perhaps thought that he could counteract ethereal magic with human medical treatments. He failed and Surma died. It does make sense that he would blame HIMSELF, since it was HIS decision to try to cure Surma and HIS failure. Would he truly hate Antimony? He is a man of cold logic; it just doesn’t seem in character that he would transfer the blame like that. Perhaps initially he formed an aversion on Annie while the realization of his failure is upon him, but in the current context his prolonged absence still does not make sense.

No, Anthony’s disappearance seems to be out of necessity. He is clearly aware that she is monitored by the court and the lack of communications for the last few years indicates that he is protecting her from either the court or whatever else he got involved in. There is a whole part to the story that we have not seen yet, a plot line for which there might have been subtle clues planted but the whole thing has not unfolded yet in the way for example, Jeannie’s plot has. So far at least, GC does not have a truly negative, evil antagonists and so I think painting Anthony as one is a bit unfair, after all, everything we know of him is from flashbacks and memories of other people. His own point of view may be completely different.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #27 on Mar 23, 2012, 6:24pm »

Mar 23, 2012, 2:57pm, shygaladriel wrote:
Unacceptable! He's nothing but a low life. A decent human being does not run off disregarding HIS OWN DAUGHTER'S HEART. He's so much of a selfish jerk.
"Oh, don't judge me! I'm imcapacitatingly shy!"
Oh no you don't. It's a little girl whom you have ignored and treated coldly after the death of someone YOU KNEW meant more to her than anything else in the whole world (and then some). All you needed to do was be there, or say something, or leave a calling number. But you chose to ignore and leave a cold shoulder.
I know a father. My father is a good friend of mine. You sir, are no father.


He could have left to find a way to prevent Annie from ending up like Surma. If that's the case, then it could make some sense for him to just up and leave. He knows she's in good hands with people who will love her and take care of her, after all they're his closest friends. He probably didn't want to tell her that she was the reason her mother died and that the same thing was going to happen to her if she ever had a child, so explaining what he was doing could be difficult for him.

Or, maybe Surma told him something or asked him to leave Annie at the Court so that so he could do something for her, like a last request.

Maybe he fell in to a horrible depression after Surma left, blaming himself for his failure to save her. He could have easily thought that Annie wouldn't want to be with him because of that. When I was depressed I didn't see why anyone would ever want to be around me. I hated myself. He could have been going through the same feelings of self loathing.

Or Maybe he is just a terrible selfish father, but Tom rarely makes characters that one dimensional so I doubt that's it.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #28 on Mar 23, 2012, 6:32pm »
There's absent fathers and there's absent fathers is the thing. If he can't be around, he could at least phone now and again, or leave some kind of contact me in case of an emergency number or at least actually tell Annie that he was leaving (which he didn't). I guess I'm on the side that even if he has a good reason to not be around he doesn't really have an excuse for the way he did it.

Also, I would feel a lot kinder towards him if Donny had said he'd rang up so Annie could hear his voice rather than so he could hear Annie's. I mean as it is he gets a bit of reassurance that oh she's alright, the court know where she is, she sounds healthy and she gets ... no reassurance at all.
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Re: [1016] The smallest thing...the greatest weigh
« Reply #29 on Mar 23, 2012, 6:34pm »

Mar 23, 2012, 6:05pm, Aurelia Verity wrote:
I know some fans dislike Anthony and think that he hates Annie and just abandoned her because he blames her for Surma’s death but to me this seems too simple and doesn’t ring true to Anthony’s character we’ve seen so far.


That's how I feel. I don't like that Anthony left Annie, but I want to hear why he left Annie before I judge him at all. Right now I pity the guy. He never struck me as someone who was a spiteful, arrogant, bastard. He wouldn't have married Surma and been such close friends with Kat's parents if that were the case, and he was clearly affected by his wife's death so I don't think he's emotionless cold hearted. I'm really curious to se more about his character.
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