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Post by SpitefulFox on Jun 22, 2011 7:08:01 GMT
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Post by judgedeadd on Jun 22, 2011 7:13:14 GMT
Political debate time.
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Post by Goatmon on Jun 22, 2011 7:43:02 GMT
Nice Bicentennial Man reference, Tom.
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jandor
Junior Member
Posts: 50
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Post by jandor on Jun 22, 2011 8:16:14 GMT
Gah! Quick Annie! Ask something, anything, about the Courts past!
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penta
New Member
Fun Time.
Posts: 23
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Post by penta on Jun 22, 2011 8:29:08 GMT
Nooo. Personally, I've been looking forward to seeing all of Diego's robots walking and talking around again in the Court. I do not want them to die again.
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Post by mudmaniac on Jun 22, 2011 8:52:36 GMT
Nice Bicentennial Man reference, Tom. Indeed. A very fitting reference too. That story made me cry as well. edit: And I don't mean the movie. oh god the movie made me want to cry in a different way.
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Post by foresterr on Jun 22, 2011 9:06:11 GMT
Damn, no questions will get answered. But what could you expect from a certain Mr Siddell ;-) I was amazed how *old* (as in, old and tired) the original robot looked in today's comic. I wonder if all the things he said influenced the way I see him.
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Post by legion on Jun 22, 2011 9:28:36 GMT
Sad.
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Post by zylonbane on Jun 22, 2011 10:36:42 GMT
Well played, Frankenbot. If you convince Kat to not reactivate any of the other robots, you'll have gotten away with the perfect murder.
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Post by theweatherman on Jun 22, 2011 11:27:22 GMT
Wait a mo, let's recap:
1: Superduper Zombiebot wakes up 2: He talks about how life is totally awesome and magical 3: He asks to die
In internet terms, lolwut?
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Post by rainofsteel on Jun 22, 2011 12:26:05 GMT
Kat needs to obtain an excellent supply of chill pills.
The robots didn't die when they put themselves into storage the first time, she did not bring that one robot back to "life", and it is not going to "die" now. They were simply asleep. Kat woke that one up. She can put it back to sleep. She could wake one or all of them again, and put them to sleep again, as often as she wished. That's all.
This robot's penchant for drama and hyperbole...
1) "and while you have given me this priceless gift of life"
2) "I hope you do not find me too brazen if I ask you to return it"
...are not reasons for Kat to abandon her reasoning capacity and succumb to ego inflation. Resurrection and murder (or mercy killing) just aren't involved in this one.
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Post by Dr. Zebra on Jun 22, 2011 12:34:29 GMT
Ohnoes zombiebot D: It seems Kat is an angel after all - the angel of death. Robot death anyway.
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jandor
Junior Member
Posts: 50
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Post by jandor on Jun 22, 2011 12:35:02 GMT
@ rainofsteel
I thought the Robot had made this clear, they don't sleep. They are on or they are off; or in its own terms, they are alive or they are dead.
Just because, unlike Humans, they can be brought back to life, doesn't mean he was any less dead (or switched off, if you prefer) for the past two hundred or so years.
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jandor
Junior Member
Posts: 50
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Post by jandor on Jun 22, 2011 12:40:14 GMT
Wait a mo, let's recap: 1: Superduper Zombiebot wakes up 2: He talks about how life is totally awesome and magical 3: He asks to die In internet terms, lolwut? You can think life is absolutely the best thing ever and still want to die. They are not mutually exclusive. I sort of agree that its not been greatly elaborated upon, but the best thing to do is wait till the chapter is finished and then go back and read it as one block. Things that seem a little weird when reading it at a 'page every 3 days' pace make perfect sense when taken as a whole. EDIT: It has explained his reasoning to some degree though, it just seems strange from my own point of view. (not bad)
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Post by rainofsteel on Jun 22, 2011 12:57:24 GMT
@ rainofsteel I thought the Robot had made this clear, they don't sleep. They are on or they are off; or in its own terms, they are alive or they are dead. Just because this robot has a penchant for strongly excessive drama and hyperbole, doesn't mean it is right. Human beings cannot, so far anyway, be switched on and off. If we could be, being "off" would not be referred to as "death" because we could come right back from it. Does the transporter from Star Trek murder and resurrect it's passengers every time it is used? Does cryogenic suspended animation seen so often in Science Fiction murder and resurrect it's passengers every time a subject goes through it? Robots in the Court appear to be overly-impressed with humans because they were created by one and so, I think, borrow a little too much from what occurs to humanity (death, where you can't be "woken up", ever) and they mentally transfer it onto themselves, regardless of what is actually happening. If Kat continues freaking out like this about every little thing that comes along, she'll turn herself into a psychotic wreck. "No, she's the mayor of Crazy Town!" -- Sunny Baudelaire, Lemony Snicket's A Series of Unfortunate Events Yes, sleep and death are two different things. You can come back from sleep, but you cannot come back from death or it wouldn't be called death.
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Post by crater on Jun 22, 2011 13:12:06 GMT
wooo! my prediction of first on screen character death might come true on.
That is, if you consider Frankenbot a character and consider what ever Kat is going to do to him as "murder" .... which I do.
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jandor
Junior Member
Posts: 50
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Post by jandor on Jun 22, 2011 13:13:58 GMT
@ rainofsteel I thought the Robot had made this clear, they don't sleep. They are on or they are off; or in its own terms, they are alive or they are dead. Just because this robot has a penchant for strongly excessive drama and hyperbole, doesn't mean it is right. Human beings cannot, so far anyway, be switched on and off. If we could be, being "off" would not be referred to as "death" because we could come right back from it. -- Robots in the Court appear to be overly-impressed with humans because they were created by one and so, I think, borrow a little too much from what occurs to humanity (death, where you can't be "woken up", ever) and they mentally transfer it onto themselves, regardless of what is actually happening. -- Yes, sleep and death are two different things. You can come back from sleep, but you cannot come back from death or it wouldn't be called death. If Humans invented a machine that could switch them on and off at will then no, it wouldn't be refered to as death. If the machine then broke while a lot of people were 'off' and no one knew how to fix the machine then those people would, for all intents and purposes, be dead. Now reverse that, when Diego was alive they probably did refer to it as on/off. When he died, they had no means to repair themselves and switching themselves off was it, the end, dead. They couldn't know that someone would succeed where they failed and figure out how to switch them back on. If in 1000 years time someone figures out how to bring me back to life from whatever is left to dig up, it doesn't change the fact I was dead. Really dead.
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Post by rainofsteel on Jun 22, 2011 13:38:15 GMT
If in 1000 years time someone figures out how to bring me back to life from whatever is left to dig up, it doesn't change the fact I was dead. Really dead. When you were awoken in 1,000 years time, you might say: Jandor: "Thank you for bringing me back to life!" Future Medical Tech: "Hey man, just in a day's work. You weren't really dead, you know." You would be from today and you would consider that you were dead and had been resurrected. The medical tech of the future would just think, "I'm thirsty, I need a future-soda-thing-drink." (Unless you were the among the first to be awoken by the process and it was a still a new and wondrous technology, in which case they would be as impressed by it as you.) It's a matter of relative viewpoint only. The robot thinks he was dead and thinks he'll be dead again. Kat apparently thinks so, too, given her obvious emotional reaction. However, given that Kat appears to have an on-off switch in her hands, the outside observer, namely me, sees something quite different. What would I think of someone getting weepy over turning a light bulb on an off, even an intelligent and possibly sentient light bulb? This is why I think Kat needs a chill pill.
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Post by darlos9d on Jun 22, 2011 14:08:46 GMT
Yeah, I'll throw in a vote for "Kat is overreacting." Nothing that is salvageable is dead. At worst, its asleep, suspended, hibernating, or in some kind of stasis. We do have those words in our language, and there's a reason we have them. And somebody can't just come along and suddenly say that any one of them are actually death. Well, they can, but at most it's a debatable point of philosophy with no clear answer.
I suppose I'll still wait for this situation to move further, but... this page is really kind of sealing the anvilicious nature of this chapter. Maybe these two will have something sensible to say after they turn Frank off, though.
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Post by zylonbane on Jun 22, 2011 14:43:18 GMT
Meanwhile, in Silicon Heaven:
"Hey! That dick is telling people we don't want to be brought back to life! NOOOOOO!!!!"
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jandor
Junior Member
Posts: 50
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Post by jandor on Jun 22, 2011 15:20:45 GMT
Look, regardless of what anyone may think of the Robot and his thoughts on life and death I can't see how anyone can say Kat is overreacting. Kat views the Robots as sentient, you can tell based on how she interacts with them all throughout the comic, Zombiebot says she has brought him back to life. He then asks if she will kill him. A sentient being is asking if a 13 year old girl will euthanize him.
We've had days to mull this over and argue the life/death, on/off, etc. blah blah blah. In the comic Kat's had, what, 10 minutes... half an hour tops?
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Post by atteSmythe on Jun 22, 2011 15:44:57 GMT
A sentient being is asking if a 13 year old girl will euthanize him. Hey, a 13 year old girl brought him to life. Turn about's fair play. Not too seriously, this is why we don't meddle with forces we don't entirely understand! That's the sort of blunder that turns the good-intentioned, if overzealous researcher into a full blown mad scientist.
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Post by basser on Jun 22, 2011 16:05:33 GMT
I think you're all reading way too far into this! That is all.
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Post by Per on Jun 22, 2011 16:24:21 GMT
Does the transporter from Star Trek murder and resurrect it's passengers every time it is used? Arguably it kills them, then assembles a copy that thinks it's the original. Sleep is not quite such a discontinuity.
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Post by Max on Jun 22, 2011 16:25:51 GMT
I think you're all reading way too far into this! That is all. It wouldn't be the Gunnerkrigg Court forum if we didn't do that.
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Post by jasmijn on Jun 22, 2011 20:38:28 GMT
What I think is that it isn't the "killing" that upsets Kat, it is Frank's rejection of life -- and that she is asked to enable that rejection. Off really is dead if you're not turned on again. It matters not that he could be revived, it matters that he doesn't want to be revived and is effectively dead in the Off-state.
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Post by warrl on Jun 22, 2011 21:11:14 GMT
I think you're all reading way too far into this! That is all. It wouldn't be the Gunnerkrigg Court forum if we didn't do that. It wouldn't be an internet discussion board if we didn't do that.
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myzelf
Junior Member
Posts: 83
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Post by myzelf on Jun 22, 2011 21:52:59 GMT
I've been meaning to ask this for a while: why does he have a window in his midriff?
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Post by Chemical Rascal on Jun 23, 2011 3:41:48 GMT
I've been meaning to ask this for a while: why does he have a window in his midriff? It's a window to his soul. That's why it's empty.
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Post by smjjames on Jun 23, 2011 4:13:39 GMT
You know, I think a better way to say in the second panel is "Our time has passed." It would just fit better IMO.
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